Archive - (2008 03 29) - Juggler (Wayne Elise) - 008 PDF

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.
com
The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0 from Fast Seduction 101
The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0

from Fast Seduction 101
Document # 008
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This is the Juggler (Wayne Elise) archive. There are many archives like this on Fast Seduction 101. For example, we have archives for: Style (Neil Strauss), Mystery, Juggler (Wayne Elise), TylerDurden, BradP, Ross Jeffries, jlaix (Jeffy), TwentySix (aka Extramask), Zan, David Shade, MrSex4uNYC, TokyoPUA, Badboy, Formhandle, ijjjji, GoneSavage, Razorjack, Svengali, toecutter, Jimbo, PlayboyLA, Jetman (aka John C. Ryan, Jr.), zarathustra_fi (Franco), Vin DiCarlo (aka Woodhaven), Herbal, Maniac High, JohnnyC69, money_matteo, Hitori, epitome, IN10SE, Lifeguard, Geoff, Huddersfield Mark, madbad, chessclub, Vince, Neo-Rio (aka Rio), Player Supreme, BlueMystery, NashvillePlayboy, Nathan Szilard, ALPHAHOT1, A2daMIR, Alessandro, Harmless, ox, Trystan, Nightblue, Commander Zap, Nightlight9, dc_guy, Coolwater, Whoisthis19, Dan Scorpio, finalD, Bishop, Laife, Lovedrop, Casey, Breakbeat, Jestor, HyperFocus (aka Identity_X), Trystan, Tunnces, vampire2727, Shark (Ranko Magami), Scoob, Papa, Roadking. All of them are available for download. And, you dont have to worry, weve been around for a long time and the site is not going anywhere, so you can download them at any time.
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Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com
Background
Background
Who is Wayne Elise aka "Juggler"?
Or, more specifically, what are these post archives about and what do they have to do with his involvement with the "Seduction Community"? Wayne Elise, aka Juggler, was one of the main characters in the best-selling book The Game: Penetrating the Secret Society of Pickup Artists, released in 2005. He also wrote a chapter in that book, but was a member of the seduction community long before that, going back as far as 2001 when he was first written about in the New York Times. Juggler turned his interpersonal skills that he developed as a professional comedian and street busker into teaching men to be more successful with women, and he was one of the first people aside from Mystery to teach in-field workshops through his company Charisma Arts (previously known as Charisma Sciences or Charisma Sciences Institute). What a lot of people dont know is theres a huge amount of wisdom from Juggler chronicled in his posts on the mASF Forum on FastSeduction.com. In fact, the mASF Forum was literally the only place Juggler was posting for the first 2 years when he was making a name for himself and was a large part of the reason he became well known in the seduction community. Juggler was also one of the only major seduction gurus to speak for free at the 2004 Austin Seduction Summit, which was a free community event organized by the Austin Lair and FastSeduction.com, one of many official free Summits promoted through FastSeduction.com. Juggler has also appeared as host of a channel four UK program called Seduction School and has traveled the world teaching men the art of seduction. To find other archives of posts from people such as Style, Mystery, and TylerDurden, all major personalities from The Game, all of whom gained their initial broad notoriety from the community on FastSeduction.com, check our other archives . You can also find new and influential members of the community using our searchable post archive containing well over half a million posts, or join our very active forum.
Articles in this archive are generated through automated means on a regular basis. Due to the automated nature of how this PDF is generated, on occasion there may be articles found within this archive which may not actually be attributed to the author intended to be represented, although best efforts have been made to ensure the automated generation process is as accurate as possible. In either case, proper attribution is given. Please make note of the specific citing above each article for verification. Questions about this archive should be directed to the FastSeduction.com webmaster at webmaster@fastseduction.com. To find more articles like this, visit the The Archive at Fast Seduction 101 web site at FastSeduction.com. Dont forget to bookmark the site when you visit! The site is fully free to access an contains the largest knowledgebase and features on the subject of meeting women, pickup and seduction.
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ot: Workshop in Shanghai China / Post 421
ot: Workshop in Shanghai China / Post 421
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Subject: ot: Workshop in Shanghai China // view thread online

Post Date: September 12th, 2002 12:38:00 PM (EDT) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Email links in posts are protected using the Safemail system via FastSeduction.com
Hey Guys, Im going to be teaching a workshop in Shanghai China, October 5-6. Should be an adventure for everyone involved. Email me if interested in taking part. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
This post/article is de facto Copyright 2002 by "juggler" with rights assigned to Learn The Skills Corp & FastSeduction.com. NO REPRODUCTION WITHOUT PERMISSION. Explicit permission and full agreement to the copyright notice on FastSeduction.com is required for any reproduction.
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SP: STILL having problems with kino :( / Post 422
SP: STILL having problems with kino :( / Post 422
Subject: SP: STILL having problems with kino :( // view thread online
In most situations where you have known a girl for awhile without initiating anything it is best to make a new you that she has never seen before. Wear different clothes, buy some cool sunglasses, put on a new scent, talk slower. Then do as Allesandro suggests and talk through her. You will feel much more like a new man and give yourself a fresh start with this girl. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Ask her name and wait... / Post 423
Ask her name and wait... / Post 423
Subject: Ask her name and wait... // view thread online

Post Date: September 20th, 2002 02:55:00 PM (EDT) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
I know where this guy is going. He is trying to use wether she asks for your name as an IOI. But there are more effective and purer ways of figuring out if a girl is into you. And it IS useful to know her name. Using it can generate a degree of intimacy. But asking for it puts you in a weaker position. The way to do it is NOT to ask for her name. Instead introduce yourself. "My name is ." This demonstrates confidence in yourself. You believe in yourself so much that you feel people should know who you are. Then she will tell you her name and you are good to go. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Time that Full De-shy takes / Post 424
Time that Full De-shy takes / Post 424
Subject: Time that Full De-shy takes // view thread online

Great reply by Tyler! Loosing your shyness is not something that should take months. It is something that can happen in one day. Guys who think that it is a process probably have never met anyone who is truely not shy. Most people are hundled within themsleves for one reason or the other. I encourage you to hang for a day with someone who has absolutley no fear of approaching and understands the order of things as Tyler suggests. Once you see this, you will have a knowing which will change you. You may still suck at picking up girls but at least you will no longer fear approaching. Try hooking up with a PUA using the service on this site or take a MM workshop or a Juggler workshop or visit with some nudists. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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gunwitch style as an attraction test? ur opinions / Post 425
gunwitch style as an attraction test? ur opinions / Post 425
Subject: gunwitch style as an attraction test? ur opinions // view thread online

Post Date: September 21st, 2002 09:41:00 AM (EDT) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
>that initial attraction or >lack of is something that >Mystery Method or SS cant >overcome...if there is a >deficiency. Not that I am a defender of MM or SS but alot of guys who take my workshop come to me after having training in either or both systems and I can tell you that overcoming a lack of initial attraction is NOT a short coming in either system. I have seen the most pimply faced geeky guys take home very beautiful girls who were not initially attracted. Further, one of the best seducers I have met, Style, can maybe bench 95 lbs. (Just kidding Style, I know you are stronger than you look) Also, its nice to have a great pair of pecs, but if you are going to rely on appearance it is easier and actually more effective to buy some cool, cutting edge threads. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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DAMN IT!! What should I do next time? / Post 426
DAMN IT!! What should I do next time? / Post 426
Subject: DAMN IT!! What should I do next time? // view thread online
With resistance, pace and lead. Or better yet, steal her frame. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Getting in the groove / Post 427
Getting in the groove / Post 427
Subject: Getting in the groove // view thread online

I love the mall. I try to take most guys to the mall during my workshops. There are many targets and alot of stuff to use as openers. Here is a tip: Go into the fun stores first. Places that sell wild clothes and piercings work well as do novelty shops and candy stores. Make up fun openings. "I wonder what my life would be like if I actually had teeth like this. (holding Austin Powers teeth) Do you think people would stare? Im already feeling quite randy." -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Bus PU Attempt: Smart Grad Chick blows me off / Post 428
Bus PU Attempt: Smart Grad Chick blows me off / Post 428
Subject: Bus PU Attempt: Smart Grad Chick blows me off // view thread online
Post Date: October 12th, 2002 12:44:00 AM (EDT) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.fieldreports Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
>Me: "Are you gonna actually >read on the bus?" >HBGrad: "Yeah, I have a >midterm next week" You went in cocky and funny. Fine, but keep in mind that C&F doesnt work when you have someone who does not play along. So here you should have tasted her mood and played to it. Our targets will not always respond how we would like them to. You should have listened and sympathized. "I know what that is like. I once had to prepare for a French test in the back of a fishing boat. Oh and I see you are studying anatomy. That can be real challenging. But it will be useful once you get through it. So many careers use a knowledge of the body." If that gets her talking then great. The key is to listen to your audience. You can move them later but at the beginning you should try to be in synch. But if she continues to be unresponsive then go on to talk with other people nearby she may come around. But this continual trying to force a conversation is below your dignity. Never look like you are trying. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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HB8 I PUd in FR#11 - PHONE CALL! / Post 429
HB8 I PUd in FR#11 - PHONE CALL! / Post 429
Subject: HB8 I PUd in FR#11 - PHONE CALL! // view thread online

Post Date: October 12th, 2002 12:53:00 AM (EDT) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.fieldreports Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
>If I accept Wednesday (it >seems to be okay for me, >otherwise I would decline), >would that be supplicating? The secret here is to tag your own restrictions on too. For instance tell her, "Wednesday is fine but it will have to be between 8 and 10pm." >Do you think going to the >shopping center with her, and >having her shop me clothes >would be a good thing? That is a great idea. She can then take a persoanl interest in you. Buy a shirt she picks out. And if you can, go to a shopping mall she has never been before - in unfamilar teritory she will bond closer to you. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Hello, this is Juggler. / Post 430
Hello, this is Juggler. / Post 430
Subject: Hello, this is Juggler. // view thread online

Post Date: October 12th, 2002 10:11:00 AM (EDT) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Mmmm... Why did this thread get my attention? Mmmm... Anyway, Ill throw my 2 cents in here on the parent - PUA relationship. The thing that most parents worry about is that you will take their daughter away from them. Do what you can to mollify this. Do this well and you can overcome alot of prejudice. For instance, if you are picking her up for the first time chat with mom and dad for a bit. Try to enjoy this. Then when your girl is ready to go say to her in front of her parents, "Your mom and dad are fun. Lets take them with us." Of course your girl will say no way. Act like you really want to hang out with them another time. Be more interested in hanging out with her folks than she is. Do this well and they will give you the keys to the gate. This reassures them that they are not losing anything but instead gaining another fun member of the family. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Overcoming the age difference problem / Post 431
Overcoming the age difference problem / Post 431
Subject: Overcoming the age difference problem // view thread online

Post Date: December 27th, 2002 06:26:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Age... Good topic. You want the girl sarging and closing you. Any topic that she brings up that is about you is good. Dont be afraid to discuss anything about yourself. That is where you want things. The longer YOU are the subject the better. If you turn the conversation away from your age (or any subject about yourself) she will avoid talking about you again and that is not good. For instance, I just turned 34. I love to bring up the subject of age. Girls will ask me how old I am and I will give them my hand or make a slow 360 degree turn so she can see the whole me and ask her to guess my age. Or I will tell them Im 34 and talk about how it was to turn 30 and that I like getting old and cant wait until Im 60. No routines here. Just enjoying the attention and letting it stay on myself. I am proud of being older than most of the girls I talk with. I like to talk about my ever increasing gray hairs and forgetfulness. I get into talking about the weaknesses of my age. So if you are 20 I would recommend being frank and open about it. Wallow in it as a topic of conversation. Id say, "Im 20. I am so innocent and flakey. I can vow to do something and then change my mind 2 minutes later." Be proud of this weakness and it becomes a strength. Have this ability to discuss all your weaknesses and you will become a very powerful presence. -Juggler
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alpha vs. beta / Post 432
alpha vs. beta / Post 432
Subject: alpha vs. beta // view thread online

Post Date: December 27th, 2002 06:43:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Just keep in mind that for seduction it IS good to have girls do things for you and take an interest in you and a responsibilty for you (like a child). Get them obsessed with your life. You are like a good movie that she has come into the middle of. She wants the main character to succeed. She wants to help. -Juggler
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Re: Reinforcing an Attitude of Desirability / Post 433
Re: Reinforcing an Attitude of Desirability / Post 433
Subject: Re: Reinforcing an Attitude of Desirability // view thread online

PDX is right on here. Id also add that if you get so you can talk about yourself more in conversations with girls than you will experience them sarging you. -Juggler
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Kino at every sentence said.. / Post 434
Kino at every sentence said.. / Post 434
Subject: Kino at every sentence said.. // view thread online

Your goal is NOT to kino her. Your goal is to have her kino YOU. To that end, you can use kino on her to encourage her to reciprocate. But thinking that kinoing her is a great thing is a kind of form of supplification. Get her to give you a back rub. Get her to nibble YOUR ear. Let them work on you. -Juggler
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HOW DO YOU PUAs handle rejection? / Post 435
HOW DO YOU PUAs handle rejection? / Post 435
Subject: HOW DO YOU PUAs handle rejection? // view thread online

She should be sarging you. Set it up that way and there is no rejection. -Juggler
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Receiving compliments / Post 436
Receiving compliments / Post 436
Subject: Receiving compliments // view thread online

A genuine, "Thank you, that is nice of you to say." Is the best response. If YOU are sarging HER then yes you need to act different with different girls HB 7-8 9-10 and all that. But if you are letting her sarge you then it is alot more simple. Your conversation needs to be alot more about you. A compliment IS about you. That is where you want things. The reason many guys feel there is a need to handle a compliment differently depending on the girl is because they do not know how to make it about themselves and panically feel they need some transition to go back into making it about her. Dont do that. Keep it on you. Example: Her: "I like your jacket." You: "Thank you. (genuinely) I like the zipper here cause it makes me feel like an airplane pilot. Which reminds me, I was going to take flying lessons. I love the idea of flying over my hometown. That would be the ultimate date I think. Pointing out where I played little league, the park where I lost my virginity..." Note: Please do not turn this into a routine. Routines are not good. Im typing off the top of my head. I can do this because I really feel this way. You have an endless source of spontaneous material when it is about you. -Juggler
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Persistent Negs / Post 437
Persistent Negs / Post 437
Subject: Persistent Negs // view thread online

Post Date: December 27th, 2002 07:46:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.advanced Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Forget negging her. That is too about her. Instead neg yourself. "Did you notice my nose wiggles when I talk?" -Juggler
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Chick says I am intimidating her. Good? / Post 438
Chick says I am intimidating her. Good? / Post 438
Subject: Chick says I am intimidating her. Good? // view thread online

Dont freak out when you hear that. Anything that is about you is good. Id probably say, "Actually Im a sweet, considerate person. I love my nieces and call my mom once a week." Not C&F, which builds resistance, but instead funny and sincere, which rocks. And this opens up other lines of conversation that are about you. But also consider that in the example you gave, it may not have been the intimidating thing but rather the venue. Having sex in a car sucks. Try to find a place that is more comfortable and private. -Juggler
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make yourself needed / Post 439
make yourself needed / Post 439
Subject: make yourself needed // view thread online

I know you mean well breakfast, but you are encouraging guys to pander to women (albeit in an artful and well worded way). You need to turn this around. Dont try to change girls for the better. They should be trying to change YOU. For instance, a girl says to me that she likes sky diving. Me: "I have wanted to go sky diving for sometime. There is this place in Canada that you can jump by yourself and not have to the tandem or static line. Thats what I would like to do but I dont know if, standing on the threshhold of the plane at 15,000 feet, Id have the courage to just leap out." Her: "Oh, you could do it." Me: "You think so? Help me. How do I find the guts?" -Juggler
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is juggler beta? / Post 440
Subject: is juggler beta? // view thread online

Post Date: December 29th, 2002 12:07:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Comments below: Actually this is a good question. I dont think Breakbeat is trying to tear anyone down here. I think he has a legitimate interest in trying to understand the apparent success of individuals who are using concepts which at first glance seem counter-intuitive. Okay, first, before I get to myself, I should say that I consider Style a good friend. I also should say I have a very good eye for interpersonal interactions and how someone comes across. I feel confident in giving my opinion of Styles style and alphaness... Everyone likes Style. I like Style. If you met him, you would like him too. He comes across as a good person. He looks you in the eye when he talks with you. He does not seem wrapped up in his ego. He comes across very genuine. Saying this may not be very good for business, but what makes Style great is not anything that he learned in ASF or from Mystery or me or Ross. What makes Style great is what he had long before coming to organized seduction. It is his real self. He is nice and has a good sense of humor. Not cocky and funny. Although he think may think he can be cocky and funny, he invariably comes across as simply funny and sweet. (Sorry if that blows your rep Style, :)) I dont know if he realizes this yet. The routines and the stuff of seduction may have given him something to focus on but they were and are unneccesary. As they are for everyone reading this. In real life Style does not come across as alpha or beta. I dont either. Forget that concept. If you have files on your computer about alphaness, consider deleting them. Seduction is not like a war of who is the most alpha. That is typical thinking. Avoid the dicotomies that most of the world thinks in. Go deeper than that. Make new rules for yourself. Okay, to get back to the point for a moment, about getting girls to take an interest in you: Yes, I suppose if you needed girls to do everything for you then you would not be a very strong person. That would be going too far. But consider, that a successful person is not someone who can stand alone. A successful person is someone who can rally others to his/her cause. The concept of relying on people to care for you should not be the focus of your game, but when it comes up, when someone wants to do something nice for you, take it everytime. If a woman offers to help you redecorate your
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apartment, take her up on it. Not only will you get free assistance but she will have more invested in you. If you are straight up with what you want in life she will help you and may be at anytime in your life a lover, a friend, a confidant... someone on your side. I have many old lovers like this who are still in my life and have become good friends. I never have to sarge again if I dont want because these beautiful friends are always recommending me to other beautiful girls. I am a hot commodity because of my history as an honest lover, a person who has outstanding rapport skills, and someone who lets his friends get involved with his life. Real needs that come from my real life. You could do the same thing if you can allow yourself to open up and forget how alpha you are and consider how real you are. -Juggler
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seduction ethics / Post 441
seduction ethics / Post 441
Subject: seduction ethics // view thread online

Post Date: December 29th, 2002 01:08:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
I agree with Breakbeat, But this really goes in another direction away from ethics and towards how your actions affect yourself. Deceit will get you girls. There are few men alive who could not sleep with tons of beautiful girls if he was to resort to deception. But if you use deceit to get girls then YOU are not getting them, your lies are. No matter how many women you score, you wont feel they like you for who you are. If you have to make them think you are a celebrity or not a computer programer or that you will love them forever or whatever than you will drive your self-esteem into the ground. You will get further from yourself and you will put more energy into the disguise rather than the reality. Until the real you is starved. Dont do that. Lying to people to get them to like you or sleep with you is just another form of pandering. No. Do the opposite. Find a way for your reality to work for you. -Juggler
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MLTR confesses attachment, then gets with another guy? / Post 442
MLTR confesses attachment, then gets with another guy? / Post 442
Subject: MLTR confesses attachment, then gets with another guy? // view thread online
Post Date: January 7th, 2003 09:28:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
She really liked you, if not loved you. And you had feelings for her too. Nothing wrong with that. But she wanted a boyfriend and probably got frustrated and another guy was there and things happened. It is fair what she did. From what you have written it sounds as if she is being straight with you. I know you are not asking for advice on what to do next but.. personally I would handle this situation delicately. I like to keep ex-lovers as friends and allies. It would be nice if when she returned from abroad, she resumed a place in your life. Make your ex-lovers into good friends. Be honest and open about how you are and be a loving person, and your former girlfriends and lovers will always be wanting to introduce you to other beautiful women. A man like that is a rare gem that is too good not to share. You took my workshop 4Running. I can say with authority that you are that type of man - hot girls will pass you around. You dont need to be in a bar sarging for new girls. So be very mindful of cutting off a bridge by playing power games like the ones other posters may recommend. These tactics may work in the short term but will always cause resentment later. Better that you be honest and admit to her that you care about her. Show her love and forget about her fooling around with some other dude. But also be open about the fact that you can not settle down right now. Think polyamory here. Its not the feelings of caring for her that have tripped you up. Its that you havent ADMITTED your feelings to her. AND that you havent fully gotten across to her how much you enjoy seducing other girls. She sounds like a nice person to me. Push yourself to care about her more while at the sametime being more unattached - that is real love. If a MLTR tells you she has met a guy she likes and may be boyfriend material, you should feel joy for her. You love her so much that you want to see her happy. Take that approach and you will be on your way to patching things up with this friend. -Juggler
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Young vs Old ...make that Older / Post 443
Young vs Old ...make that Older / Post 443
Subject: Young vs Old ...make that Older // view thread online

Post Date: January 7th, 2003 10:21:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
On 1/6/03 5:08:00 PM, Pap wrote: >Id love to hear >Jugglers thoughts on >this...from what I saw, he >uses a mix of both methods. > >Pap Hey Pap, I have to admit. Im a little confused of whats old or new school. Maybe Im getting senile... I do think that in general older guys can get away with murder. -Juggler
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Please Help Me Undo The Damage Of The Shittest. / Post 444
Please Help Me Undo The Damage Of The Shittest. / Post 444
Subject: Please Help Me Undo The Damage Of The Shittest. // view thread online
You want to be like a man who gets many women. HE would not make a big deal over a girl not kissing him back. He might think it weird but would not be upset. What you want is for a girl to show you she likes you by doing things for you. That should be your priority. Have her take you out to dinner or give you a back rub. Kissing you back or even having sex are not things that she does for you. They are things that you do together that can be enjoyable for both of you. So you DO NOT have any gripe against this girl. In the future get your women doing real things for you. Then the kissing and sex will be almost like an afterthought. -Juggler
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Re: WARNING: *67 Issue / Post 445
Re: WARNING: *67 Issue / Post 445
Subject: Re: WARNING: *67 Issue // view thread online

Post Date: January 9th, 2003 05:47:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
On 1/9/03 5:27:34 PM, SexPDX wrote: >I noticed a while back all >this futzing around with >whether or not to leave >messages, *67 and what not >goes entirely out the window >in terms of >importance when I laid the >groudwork of attraction >sufficiently before I >#closed. SexPDX puts it very well here. You want to work on your attraction skills and forget all these games. That goes for everything in your seduction life. Work on rapport, sexual state... being the man. You need to be good enough that none of the other stuff matters. -Juggler
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Theyre always late coming over / Post 446
Theyre always late coming over / Post 446
Subject: Theyre always late coming over // view thread online

Post Date: January 9th, 2003 05:59:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.fieldreports Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
I dont know... Id be pissed. And just because the girl has sex with you is not a make-up for her being late. Sex is NOT something that she gives you. Sex is something that is for both of you. (If not more for her. She should count herself lucky to have an experienced lover) Shed have to give me a back rub equal to the amount of time she was late. -Juggler
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Do any trainers other than Mystery offer in-field wor... / Post 447
Do any trainers other than Mystery offer in-field wor... / Post 447
Subject: Do any trainers other than Mystery offer in-field workshops? // view thread online
Post Date: January 21st, 2003 08:23:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Hi Namaste, I offer one on one and group in-field workshops. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Compliment Openers Suck / Post 448
Compliment Openers Suck / Post 448
Subject: Compliment Openers Suck // view thread online

Post Date: January 21st, 2003 10:06:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
You need to have the mentality that you can open with anything. Compliments are fine. Its the follow-up thats important. You: "I love that scarf youre wearing." Her: "Okay, thanks" You: (not missing a beat) "I bought one just like it. Im usually not a scarf guy but I was in France last month and everybody wears them. And they have this great way of wrapping and tucking them about their head. May I? (taking scarf and demonstrating)"... -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Locking In Your Target / Post 449
Subject: Locking In Your Target // view thread online

Post Date: January 21st, 2003 11:12:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
I know this is a sacred MM thing but ignoring the target and focusing on the obstacles is a mistake that can be a waste of time and resources. Approach the target FIRST. "Hi, my name is Bob. I have to tell you something very important." Here is where you measure the situation. Is she receptive already? None of her friends are closing ranks? If so, then you can continue with her. You are in. But if her friends are drawing ranks around her then you conversationally hang the target (sort of a take-away) and engage the friends. But remember to only work those who are drawing closer to her. Thats the key which will lower your work load. These are her real group that matter. Many times what you thought was a 5 set turns into her girlfriend, two guys who they just met and who back away at your approach of the target, and a third girlfriend who is too drunk to do anything but sit a stool. So by spotting those that close ranks with her, you can determine the real group that matters. Compare that to putting your hat on your target and going into material with the group, having the guys asking you questions about your story and blah blah. Your target could easily set the hat on the table and walk away or the artificial group could explode. - a waste of time and energy on your part. Approaching the target first, effecting a group shake out and then taking a measurement is the key that will give you the ability to be as direct as possible towards your goal. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Seriously FUCKED UP problem, need advice BAD / Post 450
Seriously FUCKED UP problem, need advice BAD / Post 450
Subject: Seriously FUCKED UP problem, need advice BAD // view thread online
Post Date: January 22nd, 2003 12:15:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
>Ive been an ASFr for a >while, If you have been in ASF for awhile then you can get other girls. Leave this one alone. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Post Date: January 23rd, 2003 10:55:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
On 1/22/03 7:28:00 PM, Style wrote: >On these two threads of >thought here: >2. Hey Juggler, I miss you, >man. When you coming out to >LA? Yeah, I dont know why you run around with that loud dressing magician when you could be hanging with your soul-mate. Anyway, as soon as I get an invite Im on a plane. It is freezing in Ann Arbor. >As for the ignoring the >target issue, it depends on >the target and the group. I >think we agree on that. Yes, when I say approach the target first I mean that as a generality. In practice these lines get blurred and it depends on venue and physical set-up, etc.. >And I >agree that sometimes the GROUP >is half just AFC guys who >approached her anyway. Its not just the AFC guys. It is also people in her group who are not an issue - who if you spent time working, you could lose ground rather than gain. Trying to win over her friends before getting in with her is a waste of time unless those friends are going to try to block you. If you work on winning those friends, which she probably has contempt for, you run the risk of looking like you are trying to please people she believes are below her. Not a good thing and again a waste of time. Its like being on stage doing a show for a big fancy corporation and playing to the office boys first. Then counting on the executives to think, "He must be good, Teddy the mail room clerk likes him." Better to have your material good enough and focused for the big wigs. >Thats >why, after doing an opener, >you say, "How do you all know >each other?" And then figure >out how to proceed from there.
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Better still, you go in with your target, put your arm around her waist, turn to her friends and ask her to introduce you to them. Then, if you want to entertain or charm her friends you have her approval backing you up. >However, I am STRONGLY against >approaching the target first >if shes a super hottie in a >club situation. I understand where you are coming from but please field test it before you judge. You can approach the target first. You have the ability Style. >I like your >style: you batter your way in >and win them over. Its >awesome. Thanks for the compliment Style, but just so we dont mislead everyone here, I am not super alpha or a fighter in anyway. Im actually pretty low key. Just can be real interesting. Give you an example. When we were all in Montreal last summer. And we ran into you and Mysterys group. As we were sarging along here was Mystery on the sidewalk, leaning over a table and opening a group. While I spotted an attractive girl inside sitting down to dinner. I go in and sit down with her and her two friends. I pull my chair next to the target and do my thing. Then I engage her friends and the two of us are a couple. We make plans to get together the next day and then I split. On the way out I notice Mystery is still performing magic/disabling targets. And all the guys in his workshop are bunched up a little ways away and everybody is ooing and awing and obviously very impressed. He turns around every once in a while and says transition or some such. I just kept thinking what a waste of time. Dont get me wrong though, as a rule, guys who perform table magic get girls. But frankly, if you want to see someone who is really good at getting girls by entertaining you should check out Dale K (www.dalek.com) Hes a crazy, cool guy. Maybe hed hook ASF guys up with a workshop. >But I recall in San >Fran, there was those three >hot girls who were getting hit >on left and right in that bar. Why did you have to bring those three up? You know thats a sensitive subject. And in front of everybody. Hmmmph! Dont make me bring up how disappointing you were that time we slept together. Okay this is what I am talking about. I was messing around and trying to work the three together, with the speakers pounding nearby, when I should have picked a target, gotten close and whispered in her ear. Bad Juggler. >What would have worked >would be to win over everyone >around them, and ignore them >(active ignorance vs passive >ignorance, that is--iow, >acknowledging them then >cutting them off) until they >CAME TO YOU. That way, you >differentiate yourself from
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>all the other AFCs out there. Too much work. We should have just been direct. Anyway, good to read you. Are you back in the states? If so then give me a call today and we can chat about this on the phone. -Juggler
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questions on group theory / Post 452
Subject: questions on group theory // view thread online

Post Date: January 23rd, 2003 11:12:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
On 1/23/03 8:46:12 AM, breakbeat wrote: >last night i was at a cock >party with exactly one 3-set >of 9s. i >approached one and attempted >to do strawberry fields, but i >wasnt in >my best of states so she >eventually cut me off. In most instances it is best to approach one (your target)and then quickly include the others as they give you their attention. This will put you next to your target and yet polite to the people in her group. After the girl has introduced you to her friends and you can either talk to them some more or resume one on one with your target without the friends CBing. Its smooth this way. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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What to do when theres no specific counter offer? / Post 453
Subject: What to do when theres no specific counter offer? // view thread online
Post Date: January 23rd, 2003 12:17:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
>Conversation with HB1 (we went >out 1 time already and had a >good time) >Fluff >Me hey, remember that bubble >tea we didnt get to try last >time? Let go try it again >this weekend This is where you made your first mistake. Sell yourself and not an activity. "Hey lets get together again?" Then once she agrees that the two of you should get together then you figure out something specific to do. My favorite, "Come over and watch the cat do back flips." Keep it simple. >HB I have to study for >examsgot a big study group >Me well, I guess Ill have to >go with my other girlfriends This is where you made another mistake. You were trying to be cute or funny as a way to cover your bitterness at her rejection. Girls can see right through this. Not attractive. You seem needy by saying this. What would a man who got lots of women do? He wouldnt care that much. What you should have done is just moved on and had more fun with the conversation, building more rapport. HB: I have to study for examsgot a big study group You: "Oh my gosh, Ive got to study too. I got this class where the professor looks and acts just like Chris Farley. I think delivering a good belch might be covered on the test." Never argue or disagree or get upset or try tricks to get girls out. That is weak. Instead work on rapport and attraction. >Conversation with HB2 (met her >at a club, havent gone out >yet) >Fluff >Me Hey I need a dance partner >for this dance workshop this >Fridaywould you be up for
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>it? Again, here either through lack of confidence, or because you have not built enough rapport and attraction you are selling the activity and not yourself. Dont do that. It would have been better and simpler to just say, "Hey, I like you. Do you like me?" If that wouldnt have worked then you had not built the kind of attraction and rapport you really need. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com www.seductionarts.com
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Taxi shit test! Comments/help? / Post 454
Subject: Taxi shit test! Comments/help? // view thread online

>later and I say, in some >frustration, "Can I just give >the directions, please?" You phrased this as a question which is weak. You were just inviting her to give you grief. People can accept direct commands more easily than they can accept being put in the position of being asked to command. Which is what you did by asking permission to give directions. I understand you were tired and frustrated - I have done the same thing. Its okay but in the future try to make your wants into statements. You can command and compliment: "Be quiet. Ill give the directions. Your job is to just sit there and look stunning." Lean over and give her a kiss. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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>Hey Juggler its C.B. Its been awhile Hey C.B. Yeah , we have to get together and hang again soon. -Juggler
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Subject: questions on group theory // view thread online

Post Date: January 23rd, 2003 06:35:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
>Funny, Ive always gone the exact >opposite route. If you go after your >target from the get-go, that opens the >door for a CB. Not go after. Open. There is a difference. Once you open, you take a read and then deal with CB if needed. >You need to build up >rapport with everyone else in the group >and ignore your target, especially if >shes a 9+. That is myth that has been propagating for years. You need to get your confidence high enough to deal with 9+ more directly. Its not her. Its you. >Shell wonder "Why is he >after all of my loser friends, he hasnt >said a word to me in 5 minutes, wonder >if its my hair, blah blah".. No, thats not what will happen. She will either get bored and leave or stay and be amused with your entertaining of her friends. Either way she will know that you are like most guys, too frightened to approach her. >Once >youve got rapport with the rest of the >group, they like you, they wont CB you. Twenty minutes later... Meanwhile a more direct confident PUA has already approached and is whispering in her ear. >Then just move on and say, "Wow, I just >realized Ive been a total dick to your >friend here (target). Mind if we go >catch up for a few minutes?" In most all >cases if you have enough rapport with >the group, they say yes, and your target >will be like "FINALLY now Ive got a >chance to prove my worth to this guy." Maybe, maybe not. She could easily see through you. You are trying too hard. You are asking permission to talk to someone. Dude that is so weak. >From then on you should be in control >with your target 1 on 1.
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You are going to control the girl you are afraid of? Mmmm... As your hero would say: What is your score in the game? This sounds like you have very little field experience. You are just re-posting out of your heros archive. Think for yourself. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Never Phrase Anything as a Question / Post 457
Never Phrase Anything as a Question / Post 457
Subject: Never Phrase Anything as a Question // view thread online

Cheers Jlaix, you are on the right path. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Re: Locking In Your Target / Post 458
Subject: Re: Locking In Your Target // view thread online

Post Date: January 24th, 2003 08:22:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.tactics-techniques Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
>I just cant see this >working in a >situation where the woman is >hit on ALL the time, while her >friends >are always ignored, waiting >patiently for the latest fly >to buzz off. Geeez, this sounds like the magician. Is he there looking over your shoulder? Look, I never said hit on. I said nothing about hit on. I said take a measurement. You can still work her friends if that is necessary. I am not saying hit on the target and ignore her friends. I said open the target and then go in one of two ways. The problem may be that you are so used to guys who do routines. IMO Opening should not be a long routine. Also, a 9+ woman is NEVER approached directly in a club. Guys always try to be indirect. They are afraid of approaching her directly. They either try going through her friends or go up to her and try to be tricky or slick or they are just nervous and it messes up their game. Nobody approaches with their real self directly. I can sit in a club and watch all night. No one will approach the 9+ except people she already knows or guys who are making up reasons to approach. You got to think outside of the box that you are in Style. You are great at this but you could be so much better and authentic. That will be my goal when I get out to LA. To change your perceptions of what is possible. >But, that said, I do think a >lot of people need a >structure. And, you >know what, Im sure you have a >structure too. Youve just >internalized >it and are not aware of it. >You also have a lowkey >demeanor, which is >automatically disarming.
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A little structure maybe. But too much structure and you lose creativity, freedom and zest. So beware my friend of being too attached to your structure. I see you as being able to soar so much higher yet. So please dont limit yourself. But of course without structure it is difficult to bottle it, label it or sell it. But your friends commercial interests (mine included) are also no reason to limit yourself. >That said, let me expand on >the logic of not going >straight to the >target. An AMATEUR hits on a >girl right away; a PRO waits >ten minutes. >IMHO, I come in under the >radar. I talk. I dont HIT on >the girl until >she feels shes earned the >right to be hit on. I give her >a chance to >express her personality and >WIN me over. Okay, now youve given him the keyboard, havent you? This is typical thinking which has been used to convince guys that they can win this POWER STRUGGLE that seduction supposedly is. Well, thats great marketing. But it is based on a fallacy. Seduction when practiced at a great level of art form is not about power. Grab hold of your Negs, Take aways, IOIs, 101, and all those clever tools we have for winning the power game and chuk them out the window. I have. Works great. Never felt better. {Begin advertisement: There will be more about this in my upcoming book: Being available soon at www.seductionarts.com :end advertisement} You have to think outside of the boxes that we all put ourselves into and realize seduction can be much more organic. It is life. You can be so much more powerful than you realize. Gimmicks and games and tricks do not make YOU more powerful. Strip that shit away. Rebuild focusing on yourself. YOU Style can approach a 10 directly and have nothing matter, not her friends or her beauty or her being hit on by other guys. YOU can do this. It is YOU and not her. >I never knew. Is that why you >didnt call me the next day? Okay, here is a funny story which I have not told you until this day. After a few days of being home from that trip I realized that my electric toothbrush was not the sameone as I had before. Same model and color but different crusty spots. So... I think I swapped with someone in that room. Yuck. >Still away. Will call you when >Im back and lets discuss.. >better >yet, lets demonstrate in the
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>field... Yeah, call me when you get back. By the way I am teaching a workshop in Vancouver Feb.28 and March 2 What are you doing that weekend? It would be cool if you could be my special guest for that. >Curious about how everything >else is going with you too... I have alot to share. Crazy life my friend, crazy. Im curious about you too. -Juggler
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Yourself / Post 459
Yourself / Post 459
Subject: Yourself // view thread online

Post Date: January 24th, 2003 11:39:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
In the last year and a half I have met countless guys in this game in real life either during my workshops or just going out. Some who have been around for a while and some are new to the community. Some have skill with women and some dont. But the common denominator for those who have no skill with women, that I have seen over and over again, is their inability to talk about themselves. This comes in all forms. Some are just quiet. Some are hiding under ultra-alphaness. Some are constant question askers. Some do nothing but talk about the game in the most technical language. Some talk about their job, their house, or their bank statements but never about themselves. Some are so negative and pessimistic about themselves that they know better than to afflict their bleakness on others. Some feel they have nothing of value to say about themselves. And if I point it out to them, they all have reasons for this: I want to talk about what shes interested in. or Im being mysterious, girls love a challenge. And yet the pattern is there with every one who has little success with women. Instinctively, women do not feel comfortable around these guys who are closed off. They may be the best of people but they are hard to trust and hard to get to know. They always look for a techinical reason for why they didnt get a woman interested. "I failed to phase shift." or "Do you think a take-away would have worked there?" And these guys look further outside of themselves to succeed. They gravitate to tricks and gimmicks because those give them hope of advancing their game without taking a risk of revealing themselves. Such things as gimmicks, entertaining, props, patterns, fancy ways of tricking closes, and on and on Even when they are out in the field, THEY are not out in the field. And thus their real self never advances. They just become more technically entwined with their structure and more familiar with putting on masks. Even if they can angle sex from a girl they never feel it is about them. They know the girl liked them for their props or their entertainment or she was tricked into feeling attraction. Self-esteem plummets. The man moves further from himself. If this is you then: Realize that you communicate all the time about yourself. There is no real hiding. Every move you make and syllable you utter says something about you. So instead of communicating I am hiding decide to take charge of that communication and begin to let out your wants, experience, feelings and
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Yourself / Post 459
creativity. Do this with everyone you come in contact with and you will experience a whole new state of being. Seduction will stop being a power struggle you have to plan and conive for and start becoming an enjoyable activity that just flows. Vow not to use gimmicks or tricks as a substitute for rapport. Instead work on rapport. Stop looking for material and begin to talk about yourself in relation to whatever topic comes up. Your humanity is interesting. Instead of telling a canned story from the archive, tell a real story that happened to you and include how you felt about it. ..and to this day I still cant look at a banana crme pie with a straight face. Instead of reading her palm, read your own to her. That says Im going to live a very long time and that line here says, Ive been doing too much manual labor. Be what you want her to be. If you want her open and sharing, then be open and share. If you want her to tell you her fantasies, then tell her yours. Dont pretend to be a celebrity. Be a person who is so amazingly you that you are better than a celebrity. Instead of working on a fancy-tricky close, build enough rapport and attraction where the close is about you and her and nothing more. Lets get out of here. Remember that routines, gimmicks and games all have limitations. While you personally have no limitations. (And yes this post was inspired by Styles if you still suck post) -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Re: questions on group theory / Post 460
Re: questions on group theory / Post 460
Subject: Re: questions on group theory // view thread online

>the method is so systematic >that if a person follows the >EXACT same steps, eventually >they will be getting almost >the same results as Mystery. I know it is comforting to believe that there are instructions to becoming good with women. But you need to focus on learning rapport and attraction skills. Get as good as you should be with those and you will toss the exact same steps away as silly. -Juggler
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If you still suck.... / Post 461
If you still suck.... / Post 461
Subject: If you still suck.... // view thread online

Great post Style. >It is only people in the first >category who are good with >women. Why >is this? Because they MAKE EYE >CONTACT WITH SELF-CONFIDENCE >and HAVE >A SENSE OF HUMOR and are ABLE >TO HOLD AN INTERESTING >CONVERSATION WITH >ANYONE. Wow, what a simple >thing. If you can cultivate >these three >things in yourself, you are >halfway there. So true. Guys, above all work on this stuff. Put the practicing tricks and gimmicks and learning steps aside for the a while and work on these basic things. And the great thing about this stuff is that you can practice it with anyone, anywhere. -Juggler
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The Hook Point / Post 462
The Hook Point / Post 462
Subject: The Hook Point // view thread online

I know exactly what you mean. Its that moment when you know everything else is easy. Its all down hill from here. You are IN, you are accepted and wanted. I was trying to explain this to a friend the other day. "Its like you break them," is all I could come up with. I like your elegant description better: Hooking point. I think, Ill always enjoy sarging for that moment. Thats all I care about now. I try to get that through to the guys I am teaching. They ask, "When do you know?" All I could tell them is that you just know. I dont want to define it with some geeky technical description. I want it to remain magical. Its like winning over a crowd on stage. When they decide they like you, you can do no wrong. And some sarges take more than others to reach that hook point. Thats the whole dichotomy of me. I really only sarge for the challenge of getting to that moment and being in that space. So its sometimes weird for me to advice guys on how to make things easier when personally I enjoy the challenge so much. You know it must kind of suck to be a celebrity performer cause you already have that acceptance when you step on stage. And I find that alot of seduction guys never get a feel for that moment and they try to do things like close or whatever without it and they keep thinking that there was something technically wrong with their close. And Im like biting my hand. Anyway, I am posting all over the place today. Its too cold to go outside. Ive been in my pajamas and Square Pants Bob slippers all day. -Juggler
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My one-on-one workshop with Juggler (long) / Post 463
My one-on-one workshop with Juggler (long) / Post 463
Subject: My one-on-one workshop with Juggler (long) // view thread online

Hey Citpyrc, It was great teaching you. You have alot of game man already. Im glad I could add to it. Guys, Citpyrc is one confident dude. I was very impressed. Cool guy. He would be the kind of guy I would introduce to my friends. And he really does look like Matt Leblanc. You are going to be really good at this art. By the way, a girl came up to me at that coffee shop and said she saw me Saturday. Kind of random. I think maybe she caught shrapnel from one of our sarges. But I replied, all proud, "Did you see I was with Joey!?" And again, I apologize on the behalf of the Midwest for the freezing weather. Talk to you soon -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Ah ha! I knew the magician was typing all the time. >Jugglers comment that you >should DIRECTLY APPROACH the >target in a group is CRAP CRAP >CRAP CRAP CRAP. It totally >ALIENATES all others in the >set, especially since all >other guys do this - that is, >if the target is a 10. You are not listening. I did not say ignore her friends. I said find out who her friends really are. Read closer. You are too in your BOX to focus properly >um definitely not. put hat on >target and this locks her in. >convey personality to others >but loud enough for target to >hear. if she returns hat, tell >her to hold on a sec and to >"wait your turn - Ill get to >you in a sec". Yeah, somtimes that will work. Others she will simply set it on the table. Either way, you should not need a hat. that shuts her >up and keeps her there. the >point is to ACTIVELY IGNORE >her. You are afraid of her. You need to develop your game where you can actually talk to a 10 and she will not walk away. >talking to her FIRST will >wreck the set if shes a 10, >trust me on this. Its not her, its you. >oh my god dude. we are playing >two TOTALLY different games >you and I. to me, its like >presenting to the top guy in >his office all by himself >versus with all his closest
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>trusted employees and >advisers. Read again. You only play to the people who ARE the trusted. >the SECRET is to >lock the target IN and >ACTIVELY IGNORE HER. Dude, you are being limited here. If you want to entertain to get girls check out my friend Dale K. (He is a real celebrity, by the way(sorry for the dig)). You have no idea what being good at picking up by entertaining really is. >imagine >doing the presentation for >everyone in the office WHILE >the top guy was there? he sees >all his trusted employees go >"wow this product is solid!". >THAT is the power of ACTIVE >IGNORANCE and SOCIAL PROOF. if >you think that her close >friends are mere OFFICE BOYS >to her, you are alienating >them and lowering your chances >of building rapport. they are >her TRUSTED BEST FRIENDS >generally. If her FRIENDS >approve of you, youre product >is as good as SOLD. dont >underestimate the power of >PEER REVIEW. Imagine being good enough that all that crap doesnt matter. Try it man, you have it in you. I know you can do it. Seriously, if you actually wnet out and focused on getting yourself better with people you would be so much more thankful in the end and this would raise your self-esteem. >when a girl is a 10, playing a >SOLID game and getting a SOLID >CLOSE is where its at. You >demonstrate the products value >FIRST. the point isnt to do >all that just to get a weak # >close. but I suspect we are >both after a totally different >calibre of woman. If you are talking about the girls you and your wing were with in Montreal I was not impressed. Styles girl was sweet young and beautiful. Your girls were at best 6s. I was thinking, This is the great Mystery?! What the fuck. To tell the truth I was very disapointed. Everyone had said how good you were and so on and here I met a guy who couldnt make good eye-contact. I dont know, to be fair, maybe you were a little off that day or something. But I was really looking forward to meeting you yet was so disapointed. And funny I still think that I would personally like you. We probably have alot more in common than Id like to admit. And Style likes you and I like him alot so... I dont know. This is a crazy world. Okay back to flame.
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>what is odd is I heard your >approach on audio, possibly >the one you are talking about. >it was BOOOOORRRRING. >lots of >"so ... whats to do in >montreal?" That is impossible. You must have been hearing something else. I was way into the restaurant. And asking questions is defintely not my style. But of course someone could have been recording me as I just chatting with people. I talk with everyone. Its not always sarging. >dude, seriously, >two different games for >different types of women. No9 >had taken your workshop and >was pulling his hair out with >the lack of enthusiasm, >gameplan, etc. Mmmm... Lets see Mysterys best friend and roommate criticices a competitor, whats the chance of that? But Ill admit that there was a bit of lack of organization and part of my mistake was thinking that I could accomadate MM into what I was teaching. Now I realize that they are like oil and water. Now I tell guys first thing; take off your necklace light-up thingys and dont be showing a bunch of picture of celebrities you have met to try to impress girls. >Ill see if I can >get a sarge on tape and maybe >you can too so we can discuss >diffs and similarities. I want >10s. I want the hottest in the >club. I want girls with high >self-esteem. Funny you should mention that. I am actually in the works at making some videos. They will be on sale at my sight www.seductionarts.com. Probably $19.95 or so. (End advertisement) > no fools mate >closes. a # close is WOOD. >Remember the two girls with me >at the restaurant we ate at >together i montreal? Like I said before, the girls that you were with were, nothing personal, not very attractive. I am so surprised you thought they were hot. (and Im not debating that you dont get hot women, Its just those were not). Now there was the blonde that you and Style knew. She came up from Toronto with you guys I believe. I remember someone posting hanging out pics of her in your lounge. She was going out to LA to pursue an acting career I think. And you posted that you were loaning her to Style or some such (I think Style had the good grace not to take you up on the offer). Posting that was so lame. Thats one of the reasons why I quit your lounge. She seemed nice but it was very wierd meeting some girl I knew about already and she is thinking I am just meeting her. Anyway, that was a wierd lunch. >the girls I met at a club and
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>we ended up instant dating and >hanging all night and then saw >her again the next night. I >stayed the night at her place >and the next she at mine. Nobodys debating whether you slept with her. You dont have to prove that to me. >a SOLID game that appeals to >me. SOLID GAMES are in fact >FASTER I agree. Solid is where you want to be. Most guys have no idea what solid really is. The close should be like of course, no question. in the long run. go in >calm and bore them and barrel >through the boredom (sorry >dude your sarge was PAINFUL!) >to get a weak # close is NOT >FAST. As I said before, you have not seen or hear me sarge. I dont know where you get this. All I know is that you were out front of a restaurant in Montreal while I was inside sitting right next to the girl and she was very happy I was there. Then later I walk out and you are still standing in your stilts doing entertianment, I think your hat was on the table or maybe it had fallen on the ground then. Didnt the waiter step on it? (okay, Im kidding, I dont rememeber where your hat was.) >The game isnt over until >sex so really we shouldnt even >call an instant date or # >close an actual CLOSE. there >is only ONE CLOSE, everything >else is a tactic for handling >time constraints so we can >continue another time. Working >a girl for 10 minutes and >getting her # is NOT the same >as working her 25 minutes and >getting an instant date and >then getting her to SEE YOU >the next day. Yes, I agree with that. >Dude, you >APPROACH and that rocks. but >man, it was lacking energy. it >was so plain. so plain No9 was >unhappy with your workshop and >requested money back as I >recall.
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Again, your best friend takes the workshop and is majorly disruptive. I was thinking, "Was he sent here by Mystery to destroy the workshop?" I dont know. The other guys were sure glad to see him go when he left after the first night. But maybe it just wasnt for him - some guys have gone so far down the gimmicks/entertaining/not-themselves path. But then again maybe it was just a personality conflict, it drives me nuts when someone does not make eye contact - is that something you teach? But anyway, not to bust on no9. I think I could get to like him if I spent more time with him and he could quit trying to be a Mystery clone and was more himself. The glimpses of the real man I saw I actually liked alot, but yeah, I cant teach someone who is pretending to be something else. Anyway, I hope one day you can have the confidence to throw all the gimmicks aside and be Eric or whoever the real you is. Im confident that man would be very cool and would do very good with women. So much better than Mystery. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Re: The Hook Point / Post 465
Subject: Re: The Hook Point // view thread online

>Yes! You know this. I had trouble >formulating it too, because its >just a weird feeling you get when you >know youve "broken " in. Its >like surfing. You paddle for a wave, and >dont know whether you will >get it or just look like a tool paddling >for nothing. But then theres >this moment where tthe wave begins to >take you, and you know youve >caught the wave and are about to >smoothly drop in. Love the surfing metaphor. >Yes. And then comes that GREAT moment >(with a girl or on stage), when >you make a joke that you KNOW is not >funny, and they laugh anyway and >think its funny. Then you KNOW they are >yours. Yes, that is a great moment. Ummm.. not that I would know, being a trash collector and all.. >Yes, my sticking point is that once Ive >hooked a stage, sometimes I >stay in a set too long because Im just >enjoying myself. Nothing wrong with that. Contrary to what some may think I dont have anything against hanging out and entertaining people if that is what you enjoy. >Yeah, why become a celebrity? Just >kidding. I bet sometimes people >want to see them fail, so they have to >win them over. That said, maybe >thats what it feels like to be a 10. >They have that acceptance when >they step on stage. (And that brings us >back to our other convo about >whether negs/distancing-from-target >should be done right away.)
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Very clever Style, You know, this is what I felt like when I was in China recently. Every person wanted to meet me and the girls want to get with me just walking down the street, just because I am a westerner. My friend and I had huge bitch shields. We would go out at night with like six or seven girls just waiting on us, wanting to help us, shopping for us, etc.. (I got to show you the pictures from the trip BTW. Have you ever been to Shanghai? The city of the future. Great place) Anyway, there were some girls who just talked to their friends and I felt for just a moment a little bit of what it must be like to be the target who is ignored. Why isnt this girl paying attention to me? etc... So yes, there is some psychological bases. But then there were girls who would approach directly and be so interestingly themselves that it blew away the entire frame and they were IN. That is what I am talking about. Havent you ever met someone who struck you as so amazing that all the other power games that people play didnt matter? That is what I think we should all be shooting for. You know, I used to experience that feeling ten or fifteen minutes into the sarge. But I get it much sooner. I dont know if my experience has just given me an ability to know that everything is possible sooner or that that actual point comes sooner. I dont know if I am explaining this well. Im such a bad typer. But anyway, I get it so soon that alot of time I am no longer that enthused and since I dont really sarge outside of teaching other guys I dont know if there is a point of all this for me anymore. >Yes. And I am late to leave for >somewhere. Surfing, actually. And I >fully plan on teaching you when you >visit... I am so excited I have always wanted to learn to surf. -Juggler
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Yourself / Post 466
Yourself / Post 466
Subject: Yourself // view thread online

Hey DM You bring up some good points. I am really bloated on chocolate cake and ice-cream so I may not be thinking properly but Ill do my best to clear them up. >Your definition of tricks and >gimmicks seems flawed. Is your >self palm reading a gimmick? >What about your bowling shoes >opener? Is that a gimmick? This is great because it gives me an opportunity to post something that has been on my mind now and then for awhile. Self-palm reading. Not a gimmick. That was a response to a post about reading a girls palm. I wrote it to make a point. And that point was dont entertain. And be more into making the real you a topic of discussion. Heck, Ive never even done self-palm reading. Of course when I wrote it and when many read it, we knew instinctively that it was good. It is interesting and it gives you the opportunity to express. But no, it is not meant as a gimmick only as an example of the frame of mind I would like to see more guys adopt. Funny, but a number of guys who have gone out with me will be watching and listening to what I say and they will be writing down stuff and saying, "What a good gimmick." And Ill be saying, "What gimmick? This is my life." Ill give you another example. About a year ago I had a love-sex affair with a woman Ill call Sarah. While the thing was going on with Sarah, I was meeting and seducing other girls. Many of these girls I would tell about my crazy relationship with Sarah. Indeed, I could not help myself. It was a big part of my life. I talked about it with everyone. I got pretty good at telling that story. But the story always changed and moved because it was being written as I lived it. It was me. The emotions I conveyed were my own. But then things changed and Sarah was no longer a big topic in my life. I stopped talking about it. I went back to talking about the mouse in my house or my grocery shopping. Then funny enough, I read in another forum that someone was out doing Jugglers Sarah story. I was like, hey thats my life! Its not a routine. That was really weird.
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Yourself / Post 466
BTW These days I talk alot about stuff like hot chocolate and what you could do with those chemical foot warmers. It is freezing out here in the midwest. >What about the water and food >poisoning? Um, not sure about that one. If you can remind me that would be cool. Im curious. Its kind of like looking back on a diary. >What about walking >around with a giant? Damn! He moved back to Germany. I love that guy. He actually visited around X-mas. But sadly he cut his mullet. You should actually meet him sometime. He is so big and ugly but at the sametime really a cool guy and everybody loves him. Some of his other friends were going to start a web page fan club. Id be tempted to send you guys the link if they ever get it up. But to address the giant as gimmick/crutch; Well, to be honest maybe he was. I felt alot more secure about not getting acousted with him there and I did reference him to people sometimes as my bodyguard. Did that make him a weak point for me? Maybe, but you he was not always around and never part of. He just liked to watch. >about telling people you are a >garbage man? Yes, that is probably the closest thing I have to a gimmick. This is something I have said for awhile. It came about because in real life I actually do have a pretty interesting job that many girls want to know more about and on an on. I found in the past, it was an instant in. So I wanted to not use that as a crutch. I wanted it to be all personality and expression. So I decided to tell them I am a trash collector. The thing is, it is not really true and so I would rather not use it. So I have thought of going back to telling them about my real job but then I have the same problem about things being too easy then. But I really only sarge anymore when I am teaching workshops and it does make a point to the students so I may keep it after all.. I dont know... if you have any ideas let me know. >You see, I see >you saying dont use gimmicks >because they are outside >yourself but I also see you >ADVOCATING and USING them. I think you understand better where I am coming from DM. I am not really against saying things or relating stories that you have used before. Its just that I think it should be about you. But since you are always changing, your stories and material should as well. And when you catch yourself relying on any one thing, work to get rid of it. I also think you will find that the more you work authentically from your own life and use your reactions to life, the better you become at putting those things into words. >WORKS and it ROCKS. You see >saying Hi! How are you? is >CANNED! Smiling is CANNED!
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Yourself / Post 466
Yes, you are correct. I am not against saying things you have said before. That is impossible. But i think the more you begin to work from your own life and reactions the more dynamic and ever shifting your material will become. >You see, CANNED stuff actually >BOOSTS creativity. It BOOSTS >individuality. Guys that rely >heavily on the canned stuff >found here almost always come >up with their OWN variations >as they get experience. Think about cancelling all routines which do not say anything about the real you. You will have to do alot of varying to make a general use routine about yourself. Otherwise you are entertaining. You want the girl attracted to you and not your material. >You see a big part of what you >are saying is THROW AWAY the >routines, gimmicks etc because >they are crutches. But fuck >crutches enable you to walk! I >encourage guys who cant wallk >to USE crutches! Sooner or >later they will find their own >path: Some discard the >crutches for more normal >tactics, others turn their >crutches into BIONIC LEGS. You know I used to agree. I would say that it was okay to at first use gimmicks but then get away from them later. But now I see that the gimmicks are leading in the wrong direction. I want the man to get closer to himself and not farther. >I have been influenced by your >style and your posts. I USE a >lot of your ideas. Thanks for saying that. It makes me feel really good to know that. >However, I >felt your recent posts were >getting rather blurry on >certain things. Of course it >could be my eyes... No, I think you are right. I havent been very clear sometimes. Thats one reason I am writing the book. But with my bad typing it is a slow process. You would not believe how long it has taken me to write this post. Wheh! But now I am done. Back to more cake... -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Yourself / Post 466
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Subject: Taxi shit test! Comments/help? // view thread online

On 1/23/03 6:29:00 PM, Commander Zap wrote: >Very, very good, Juggler. >Thanks. > >Zap Thats why I get paid the big bucks. :) -Juggler
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3 second rule thrown to shit / Post 468
3 second rule thrown to shit / Post 468
Subject: 3 second rule thrown to shit // view thread online

Good report. I would like to give you some advice here, but you have so many things going on that it would be difficult to give you any advice in text that will not confuse you. So Im glad you are taking my Vancouver workshop. But we should chat on the phone about this before then. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Destini9 and The New Theory of Seduction (LONGGGG) / Post 469
Destini9 and The New Theory of Seduction (LONGGGG) / Post 469
Subject: Destini9 and The New Theory of Seduction (LONGGGG) // view thread online
Post Date: January 28th, 2003 04:26:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.advanced Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Many truths in this post. Hope everyone gets a chance to read it. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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mp3 of my phone call to HB ( / Post 470
Subject: mp3 of my phone call to HB ( // view thread online

Post Date: January 29th, 2003 10:38:00 AM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.fieldreports Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Hey twentysix, Im just going to comment on the phone call. 1. Instead of saying, "Is so and so there?" when she picks up the phone, say "Hi this is twenty six, Im calling for so and so." You will sound more confident and sure of your self that way. 2. It was good that you didnt hesitate and told a story right away. Also it was good because I can now teach you alot form hearing it. It sounds rushed. You ask her a question (really a command) to start it off, "Guess what just happened?" then, you never give her a chance to answer, you just go right into it. That looses a bit of rapport and tells her in a small way that your questions commands are not to be taken seriously. I know that seems nitpicking but that it is a lesson to learn that can be applied on a bigger scale. And also all the little things in a conversation add up to form a picture of who you are. Get good at the little things and you will have much more control. If you are going to ask a question then ask it and wait for an answer. Personally I would have been like, "Guess what just happened?" and let her try to answer. Shw would be like, "Um, I dont know." So I would say, "Of course you dont, anything can happen in this wacky life, aliens could have landed on my lawn or a band of little people could have carried my car away. But actually there is this dog..." Okay, the story sounds a little canned, as if you had prepared before hand. That could just be to my ear but I can tell because you rushed through it and left little leaway for going in different directions as you told it. You were damn sure you were going to get through it one way or another. The purpose of any story or material should NOT be to entertain. It should be to ATTRACT. You attract by showing your humanity (your feelings and reactions to life). You had many opportunities to do that with in this story but missed them: How did you feel about the dog? You could have said, "my neighbors dog was in front of his house. I love this dog. He is so affectionate and fun. I actually taught him a couple of tricks.." or however you felt.
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How did you feel about the dog hitting his head? Here you did express some reaction which is good. But think about what you are saying. I can see that you are not focused on how you are feeling with the story but simply looking to be entertaining. You are taking the dogs potential injuries very lightly and are more concerned about having to tell the owners about the dog then anything else. You should have hammed it up here: "I was like, oh my gosh, you poor thing. I rushed over there thinking maybe I would have to give mouth to snout resuscitation, which I really didnt want to do but I would have to save the little guy. So I got over there and leaned over and checked for breathing." Then I would pause here and let her ask, "What? Was he okay?" Then tell her, "He suddenly sprung to his feet, almost giving me a heart attack. So you see I am lucky to even be able to make this phone call." Also, over all slow down and try to shorten your stories. Cut out the facts and put in more of how you feel. When you can do that, you will be able to spin stories about the most simplest things into attraction. 3. Next you asked her 3 questions in a row real quick. You: "So how are you doing anyway?" Her: "Good" You: "You are doing good?" Her: "Very good." You: "So you guys doing anything today?" (I think?) Her: "A yeah, I have to go to school and do some stuff." You may be just nervous here. But avoid these rapid fire questions. You are not even listening to the answers. Instead, ask a question: You: "How are you today?" Her: "Very good." Then respond to her answer. You: "Good to hear that. I am doing fairly well myself. I mean, aside from the dog incident, of course. Oh, I was hanging with some comedy friends today. It was cool. I got the lead on some places where I can do comedy gigs." Take your time and talk about yourself. 4. She mentioned sushi. You skipped right over it. Probably in a hurry to get to the end and get your business over with. Dont do that. Take your time. You can attract her very hard over the phone. How do you feel about sushi? Everyone has an opinion. A great topic to reveal yourself. 5. Then your conversation gets into your amateur comedy. Great subject. She is interested. But you miss the boat and make it very dry. Instead think about putting your humanity into the mix. How do you feel about the comedy? What are your reactions to the people you have met in that scene? How do you feel about being on stage? Lots of opportunity here 26. But you seem happy just to give
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her the facts and then change the subject to your close. 6. Your close: Why did you tell her you were pretty busy during the weekend? It is because you are trying to seem busy and in demand. Right out of the manual. And in a small way it works. But it is shit. It is being tricky. It will hurt your game in the long run. Instead focus on the rapport. The things I mentioned earlier. Attract in a big way. If you do this right you will not need to be tricky. It will be easy. Both of you will KNOW that you are great together. And you will both know the other knows. It will be like, "Gosh, we are awesome. Kind of scarey huh? When we see each other well have to be careful we dont light things on fire." and she will be like "I know. I cant wait." That is the kind of close, phone or otherwise that you need. But she did agree to see you. So you had a further chance to woo her. But in the future try to talk alot more about how you feel. Get into yourself and she will become alot more relaxed and able to get in to herself and you will begin to have amazing conversations and throw all the gimmicks and tricks aside. Good luck, Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Subject: mp3 of my phone call to HB ( // view thread online

On 1/29/03 5:29:00 AM, stevie_pua wrote: >The thing that struck me most >during this call is that this >girl says almost NOTHING in >reply to you. It is you, 26, >who has to keep it all going. >Why do you think this is? The reason she doesnt say anything is because 26 doesnt either. He talks about things and uses a few ASF leverages but never lets himself out of the bag. Women will not open up with if you are not open yourself. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Re: mp3 of my phone call to HB (#3) / Post 472
Re: mp3 of my phone call to HB (#3) / Post 472
Subject: Re: mp3 of my phone call to HB (#3) // view thread online

On 1/29/03 6:27:43 AM, SexPDX wrote: >I agree with kooper that the >story should have something >to do with why you >called her. There should be no reason to call. 26 needs to express for the sake of expressing. He needs to be like an artist. It just needs to come out. That should be the reason we do anything, including getting with women. To have any sort of reason is like having an excuse to express. -Juggler
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take a look: chick logic in all its glory / Post 473
Subject: take a look: chick logic in all its glory // view thread online
blah, blah, blah You talked all about her. It started off good. She was interested in the story you were writing and she wanted to get involved with it. But then you transitioned to... all about her. And when she tried to talk about you, you ran away from it and changed the subject back to her: Her: what do you like to do Me: that i like to write, play music, cook, and i think you are cool Her: but you dont even know me (btw i think youre cool too) Me: hehe but you dont even know me! Me: ok tell me more about you And later you missed another que: Her: actually, i dont know you at all, come to think of it And still later she brought up an interest in your heritage. A great subject to talk about who you are and where you are coming from but you discarded it so that you could talk about how you were hoping to see..... her. Me: hehe, well are we gonna chat on IM all night? my hands are getting tired Me: i was looking forward to talk with you in person tonight but i guess that wont happen This isnt about chick logic. Its about sickrick logic. If you are going to make it all about some chick then you will have to do some fancy moves to get and keep them interested. Thats what MM and SS and all those systems and gimmicks promise. Forget that. Get into YOU. Attract her to YOU. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Subject: take a look: chick logic in all its glory // view thread online
On 1/29/03 11:38:00 AM, DJ3Leggz wrote: >You were way to catering to >her dude. Yes, he was. But in a bigger way than most people realize. >Just like Jay said. >You should have done a bit of >take away on her ass. "God, >youre so negative, I dont >know if we could hang out." No, dont do a take away or get on her case. You drove her to be negative. All you did was talk about her without revealing anything about how you felt. That made her tighten up. When someone is not comfortable with you and tightens up it often comes out as negativity. Being negative about things takes alot less revealing, since being against something is not being anything at all. In the future change her mood by opening up and being positive about your life and she will respond in kind. read below -JUggler
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An entertaining story ! Story-Telling / Post 475
Subject: An entertaining story ! Story-Telling // view thread online

Post Date: January 29th, 2003 12:51:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.advanced Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
A good story should not be to entertain or show that you are a cool guy (whatever that means). A good story is used to attract. Cut all the stuff from this story and just talk about how you react to the situation. Comments follow: >Oh listen to that, I gotta >tell you this, youll never >believe what >happened to me the other day. That is irrelevant. CUT >I just bought this huge >microwave-oven >from Argos superstore and >"man" that thing was heavy. Emphasize how heavy you found it and cut the rest. > So >when I >finally got home and tried to >lift the microwave out of the >box, I >didnt realize that that >glass-dish those microwaves >always have was >right on top of the micro. So >I lifted it up and >"WAMM"...the glass >fell right down on the >kitchen-floor and splitters >everywhere. Simplify here. > Now how >dou you get out of the kitchen >when you are barefooted and >there are >tons of splitters everywhere?
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Combine that with the following, amp up how you felt about the situation and cut everything else. >So Im standing there trying to >move >around those splitters on my >toes and trying to get out of >the >kitchen. What a nightmare ! Here is a re-write: "I just bought this Microwave and it was so heavy. Im thinking, whats in this thing? I think my arms are still sore. (have girl feel your bicep and then flinch from the pain) So Im carrying it into the kitchen and the door on the thing opens and this glass plate I didnt realize was there falls onto the floor and into a million pieces. Im standing there in my bare feet surrounded by a sea of little shards of glass. Do I climb out the window, do I try to stretch and reach for a broom and then pole-vault out? " Remember to cut all details down to the bare essentials that make your story logical and then add liberal amounts of your reaction and how you feel about the events. That humanizing will make people into you and not your material. Better yet. just get into the space where you are talking about your feelings and reactions and you will not have to pre-plan a canned story it will just flow out along with all the rest. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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juggler: attract by showing humanity? / Post 476
Subject: juggler: attract by showing humanity? // view thread online

You are thinking of feelings as if they were all heavy emotions and girly things. You can at anytime feel powerful, brilliant, lucky, vulnerable and naked, confused, happy, charged, anything at all. YOUR feelings and reactions to life are a range of your pallet. They are WHAT YOU ARE. THere is nothing else. You either talk about her or things or you. Those are your three choices. If you talk about her, then all the gimmicks and tricks on the website are for you. Good luck. You have alot of reading ahead of you to figure out how to get sex from a girl who you are hiding from. If you talk about things, then you are playing it exceedingly safe and will bore the hell out of everyone you come into contact with. If you talk about you, then you will learn that the real you is your reactions to life and your feelings. That is it. Talk about you and your girl will become at ease talking about herself and you will establish a rapport you may never have had before. Trade sexual fantasies, talk about what you will do with each others bodies. This is all possible when you open up and make her comfortable enough to do the same. Then you can transition from talking about you to talking about we. This does not mean that you are being all deep. It means that you are putting your reactions, your view, your life on every topic and in turn affecting her to do the same. Anything else should bore you to tears. >How would showing your >feelings and reactions to life >attract a girl? Think about going to a good movie. It is all about the reactions, expressions and feelings of the characters. Male heart throbs are not worshipped by women because their character flies jets or jumps off a fire escape. >Please >elabortate on that idea. Maybe >showing your humanity might >make a girl like you, but only >in a nonsexual way, in my >experience.
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If a girl likes YOU. She like YOU. YOU are all these things I have spoken about. Make it about you. Not so much about her. Follow my advice or read gunwitch or take my workshop and I will show you in person or email me and Ill give you my number and I will tell you over the phone. This all ABOUT HER frame is messed up. Once you get in that box you have to try to win by using all kinds of tricks and gimmicks. Dvs, dont climb into that box. >she chose evil (the badboy 101 >guy) and it was quite obvious >she was very turned on by him. Not what I am talking about here. That is more trying to win in the box. Stay away from that square thing. >Ive never heard a girl say, >"oh hes sooo sensitive, i >just want to fuck his brains >out." We are not talking about sensitive here. You are still in your box. Being sensitive to her implies it is about her. Dont go there. That kind of sensitive sucks. That whole frame sucks. >but i have met more than >a few hot girls who fuck crass >indiferent badboys who care >about no one but themselves. Because they were not into her and trying to get into her frame and all the crap and gimmicks that guys do. Girls love to take a break from guys who are into them. You need to be more into yourself (giving) and be an example for her be into herself (giving) too. >Perhaps you should respond to >this in a new thread as im >sure it is of interest to many >people, and they might not see >it hidden in this thread. Good thought. But Im all over this board anyway. Read my archive or buy my book when it comes out soon. I actually like to have these little out of the way threads. >I >bet, whether you realize it or >not, that your showing other >traits besides your humanity >to attract girls. because >otherwise theyd just think >your a sensitive WUSS, as >David Deangelo would put it. >Besides your humanity, what >else do you convey? You are thinking that I am talking about it being your reaction and feeling towards her. Damnit, you are still in your box! It is NOT about her! Make it more about YOU. Being a sensitive wuss is about being all into her.
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Geeez, are we on the same planet? Did you even read my post? Okay, sorry. Im only so surely because I care about you getting it right and not wasting alot of time and effort. Remember, seducing women is easy. Maybe I really need to get everyone together somewhere and hash this stuff out. Or maybe I need to quit writing posts and finish my book. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Subject: juggler: attract by showing humanity? // view thread online

> >I see what your saying, though >the focus could be on her from >the frame that your qualifying >her (swingcat method), rather >than trying to impress her >with gimmicks and tricks. I >dont use the tricks. All i >use is, swingcat qualifying, >CF, and sexual state. Or maybe >you consider those to be >tricks? Of course I havet read Swingcats qualifying. But, if you are really qualifying. And those are really your qualifications then all the more power to you. >ive gotten ass from girls >that dont even know my name, >much less know ME. and im not >talking about prostitutes or >sluts. if you get a girl horny >and take care of anti-slut >defenses, shell fuck. And >dont tell me girls only get >horny for guys they know. Yes, you can have sex with girls that dont know your name. But it will be rare to get a girl that gets a sense that you are hiding. Remember that you are not your name or the details and facts of your life. What we are is not knowing about you. You are still thinking in typical ways. Now maybe you have had sex with a girl after doing SS or a gimmick. In most cases she had sex with you despite the gimmicks, not because of them. She already decided she was going to have sex with you cause she was looking to hook up or that she liked your tone or she found you physically attractive. >Okay, sounds good. but i dont >know how or why this would >make a girl wanna fuck.
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Because you will reach a state that is so beyond fucking. Forget sex. That is childs play. If you are shooting for sex you are shooting too low. Do what I advice and women will not just want to jump your bones but you will have them into life-long allies who be on your side forever. They will recomend you to other beautiful women. But the biggest thing will be that you will change. You will never need to try to pick-up women again. You will BE instead of DO. How to do this? Well I got to save something for the book. :) >I dont care if a girl likes >me. all i care is if shes >attracted to me enough so i >can get some ass. I am using like to mean attraction. >In fact, my >friend had a girl like him too >much, that she thought of him >as potential relationship >material and "held out" so >that he wouldnt fuck her and >move on. the girl told me >this. Okay. >> Follow my advice or read >>gunwitch or take my workshop > >ive read gunwitch method, and >had success with it. Cool. It is simple and straight forward. >>or email me and Ill give you >>my number and I will tell you >>over the phone. This all ABOUT > >ill email you for your >number. damn, im good at >number closing, lol. wish i >could afford the workshop but >i will get your book. Thanks man. Ive enjoyed the discussion. Ill email you. > >right, seducing most women is >easy. but what about the SHBs. >do they really fuck guys who >display their humanity or do >they fuck unemotional >alpha-dominant aloof guys? Unemotional sucks, every guy acts unemotional. No one acts alive. >Perhaps both, which is why i >am interested in your method. >Maybe youve found an easier
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>way to skin a cat. I think so. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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testing jugglers rapport techique / Post 479
testing jugglers rapport techique / Post 479
Subject: testing jugglers rapport techique // view thread online

Post Date: February 1st, 2003 09:41:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
Great job Breakbeat. You have it! Geeez, maybe there is no reason to finish my book after all. lol I know for sure you are doing what I do because you can not remember what you talked about. Ill rarely remember. You get into this place where you have this conversational flow that is incredible. I keep saying that. Very few ever experiences this type of rapport. Not even with long-time friends. You are talking about things but in fact you are, both of you, revealing yourselves through things. Its funny that sometimes Ill be teaching a one-on-one workshop and Ill turn to my student and ask him what I talked with that last girl about. And they can never remember. Its like a mind change that you go through. For me, that feeling is a goal not a means. When you are in that place nothing matters. There are no power struggles to win or fancy moves to make. Im so glad you got this Breakbeat. Breakfast is on me. -Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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Re: testing jugglers rapport techique / Post 480
Re: testing jugglers rapport techique / Post 480
Subject: Re: testing jugglers rapport techique // view thread online

Post Date: February 1st, 2003 09:53:00 PM (EST) Group/Board: alt.seduction.fast.general Article Author: "juggler" (if mis-matched to this archive, contact webmaster@fastseduction.com) Find recent posts by "juggler" on mASF // contact "juggler"
On 2/1/03 2:49:43 PM, breakbeat wrote: >its not about the what... >its about the how. Beautiful man. Great way to say it. You dont know how much this means to me. Finally some of you guys are getting it just through my posts and your own initiative and intelligence and now experience. I was pulling my hair out trying to put it into type. Funny, but I knew you were doing it right Breakbeat when you said you couldnt remember what you said. And in my experience this is not limited to yourself. People overhearing you will be amazed at the flow and easiness of it all but even more amazed that they can not remember anything that was said. Thanks, Juggler www.seductionarts.com
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DISCLAIMER
DISCLAIMER
^ GO BACK TO THE FIRST PAGE ^ "Fast Seduction 101" and "Fast Seduction" are registered trademarks owned by Learn The Skills Corp (owner of FastSeduction.com also known as "Fast Seduction 101"). The articles in this archive file are Copyright by the original author, as cited, as well as Learn The Skills Corp unless they were obtained from the public USENET group alt.seduction.fast, in which case they are exclusively the copyright of the original author, as cited, and republished here as fair use. Regardless, the structure of these files, as a collection, including any and all organization, formatting and distribution methods are fully Copyright {!YEAR!} by Learn The Skills Corp. No part of this archive may be republished under any condition without the explicit permission from both the original authors and Learn The Skills Corp. The files made available in this archive are for personal use only. For articles collected from public USENet, they are being redistributed within this file freely with the full rights of the author maintained. Use of these such publicly posted USENet for commercial purposes without the prior consent of the original author is forbidden. Author contact information can be obtained through a search of The Archive at FastSeduction.com. For articles compiled from the private forums on Fast Seduction 101, they are made available with implicit permission of the author ONLY through the Fast Seduction 101 web site. Any other redistribution, modification, or duplication in whole or in part not pertaining to personal use, commercial or otherwise, is EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN without the explicit written permission of the original author and Learn The Skills Corp. Redistribution of this archive file itself, edited or otherwise, in any form is also prohibited without prior explicit permission from Learn The Skills Corp.
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Table of Contents
Table of Contents
The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0 from Fast Seduction 101 . . . . Background . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ot: Workshop in Shanghai China / Post 421 . . . . . . SP: STILL having problems with kino :( / Post 422 . . . . . Ask her name and wait... / Post 423 . . . . . . . . Time that Full De-shy takes / Post 424 . . . . . . . gunwitch style as an attraction test? ur opinions / Post 425 . . . DAMN IT!! What should I do next time? / Post 426 . . . . . Getting in the groove / Post 427 . . . . . . . . . Bus PU Attempt: Smart Grad Chick blows me off / Post 428 . . HB8 I PUd in FR#11 - PHONE CALL! / Post 429 . . . . . Hello, this is Juggler. / Post 430 . . . . . . . . . Overcoming the age difference problem / Post 431 . . . . alpha vs. beta / Post 432 . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Reinforcing an Attitude of Desirability / Post 433 . . . . Kino at every sentence said.. / Post 434 . . . . . . . HOW DO YOU PUAs handle rejection? / Post 435 . . . . . Receiving compliments / Post 436 . . . . . . . . . Persistent Negs / Post 437 . . . . . . . . . . Chick says I am intimidating her. Good? / Post 438 . . . . make yourself needed / Post 439 . . . . . . . . . is juggler beta? / Post 440 . . . . . . . . . . seduction ethics / Post 441 . . . . . . . . . . MLTR confesses attachment, then gets with another guy? / Post 442 Young vs Old ...make that Older / Post 443 . . . . . . Please Help Me Undo The Damage Of The Shittest. / Post 444 . Re: WARNING: *67 Issue / Post 445 . . . . . . . . Theyre always late coming over / Post 446 . . . . . . Do any trainers other than Mystery offer in-field wor... / Post 447 . Compliment Openers Suck / Post 448 . . . . . . . . Locking In Your Target / Post 449 . . . . . . . . . Seriously FUCKED UP problem, need advice BAD / Post 450 . . Locking In Your Target / Post 451 . . . . . . . . . questions on group theory / Post 452 . . . . . . . . What to do when theres no specific counter offer? / Post 453 . . Taxi shit test! Comments/help? / Post 454 . . . . . . . Locking In Your Target / Post 455 . . . . . . . . . questions on group theory / Post 456 . . . . . . . . Never Phrase Anything as a Question / Post 457 . . . . . Re: Locking In Your Target / Post 458 . . . . . . . . Yourself / Post 459 . . . . . . . . . . . . Re: questions on group theory / Post 460 . . . . . . . If you still suck.... / Post 461 . . . . . . . . . . The Hook Point / Post 462 . . . . . . . . . . My one-on-one workshop with Juggler (long) / Post 463 . . . Locking In Your Target / Post 464 . . . . . . . . . Re: The Hook Point / Post 465 . . . . . . . . . Yourself / Post 466 . . . . . . . . . . . . Taxi shit test! Comments/help? / Post 467 . . . . . . . 3 second rule thrown to shit / Post 468 . . . . . . . Destini9 and The New Theory of Seduction (LONGGGG) / Post 469 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 37 38 40 41 42 44 45 48 50 51 52 53 54 59 61 65 66 67
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Table of Contents
mp3 of my phone call to HB ( / Post 470 . . mp3 of my phone call to HB ( / Post 471 . . Re: mp3 of my phone call to HB (#3) / Post 472 take a look: chick logic in all its glory / Post 473 take a look: chick logic in all its glory / Post 474 An entertaining story ! Story-Telling / Post 475 . juggler: attract by showing humanity? / Post 476 juggler: attract by showing humanity? / Post 478 testing jugglers rapport techique / Post 479 . Re: testing jugglers rapport techique / Post 480 DISCLAIMER . . . . . . . . .
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Archive - (2008 03 29) - Juggler (Wayne Elise) - 008 PDF

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Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.

The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0 from Fast Seduction 101

The Jaw-Dropping Juggler Archive v2.0

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

ot: Workshop in Shanghai China / Post 421

ot: Workshop in Shanghai China / Post 421

Subject: ot: Workshop in Shanghai China // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

SP: STILL having problems with kino :( / Post 422

SP: STILL having problems with kino :( / Post 422

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Ask her name and wait... / Post 423

Ask her name and wait... / Post 423

Subject: Ask her name and wait... // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Time that Full De-shy takes / Post 424

Time that Full De-shy takes / Post 424

Subject: Time that Full De-shy takes // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

gunwitch style as an attraction test? ur opinions / Post 425

gunwitch style as an attraction test? ur opinions / Post 425

Subject: gunwitch style as an attraction test? ur opinions // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

DAMN IT!! What should I do next time? / Post 426

DAMN IT!! What should I do next time? / Post 426

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Getting in the groove / Post 427

Getting in the groove / Post 427

Subject: Getting in the groove // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Bus PU Attempt: Smart Grad Chick blows me off / Post 428

Bus PU Attempt: Smart Grad Chick blows me off / Post 428

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

HB8 I PUd in FR#11 - PHONE CALL! / Post 429

HB8 I PUd in FR#11 - PHONE CALL! / Post 429

Subject: HB8 I PUd in FR#11 - PHONE CALL! // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Hello, this is Juggler. / Post 430

Hello, this is Juggler. / Post 430

Subject: Hello, this is Juggler. // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Overcoming the age difference problem / Post 431

Overcoming the age difference problem / Post 431

Subject: Overcoming the age difference problem // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

alpha vs. beta / Post 432

alpha vs. beta / Post 432

Subject: alpha vs. beta // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Re: Reinforcing an Attitude of Desirability / Post 433

Re: Reinforcing an Attitude of Desirability / Post 433

Subject: Re: Reinforcing an Attitude of Desirability // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

Kino at every sentence said.. / Post 434

Kino at every sentence said.. / Post 434

Subject: Kino at every sentence said.. // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com

HOW DO YOU PUAs handle rejection? / Post 435

HOW DO YOU PUAs handle rejection? / Post 435

Subject: HOW DO YOU PUAs handle rejection? // view thread online

Juggler (Wayne Elise) via FastSeduction.com