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STATE OF MICHIGAN IN THE 28th CIRCUIT COURT FOR THE COUNTY OF WEXFORD WILLIAM S. BARNETT, in his capacity as MAYOR OF THE CITY OF CADILLAC, Petitioner,

5 v 6 HON. WILLIAM M. FAGERMAN 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 For the Petitioner: 15 16 17 For the Respondent: 18 19 20 Also Present: 21 22 23 24 25 26 RECORDED BY: William Barnett Jim Blackburn Laura R. Lyman, CER 5813 Certified Electronic Recorder Network Reporting Corporation Firm Registration Number 8151 1-800-632-2720 MR. ROGER L. WOTILA (P22561) McCurdy Wotila & Porteous, PC 120 West Harris Street Cadillac, Michigan 49601 (231) 775-1391 MR. MICHAEL D. HOMIER (P60318) Foster Swift Collins & Smith, PC 1700 East Beltline, NE, Suite 200 Grand Rapids, Michigan 49525 (616) 726-2200 JIM BLACKBURN, Respondent. / DEPOSITION OF DOUG MELLEMA Taken by the Respondent on the 22nd day of May, 2012, at 120 West Harris Street, Cadillac, Michigan, at 11:30 a.m. APPEARANCES: Case No. 11-23578-CZ

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TABLE OF CONTENTS PAGE

Examination by Mr. Wotila . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 A Q A Q A Q BY MR. WOTILA: Q A Q

Cadillac, Michigan Tuesday, May 22, 2012 - 11:49 a.m. REPORTER: Do you solemnly swear or affirm that

the testimony you're about to give shall be nothing but the whole truth? MR. MELLEMA: Yes. DOUG MELLEMA having been called by the Respondent and sworn: EXAMINATION

Would you give us your full name, please? Douglas W. Mellema. And today's the time and date set for a deposition that we have -- is it all right if I call you Doug? Sure. This regards a piece of litigation brought by Mr. Barnett as mayor of Cadillac against Mr. Blackburn -- all right? -- to give you a little background. deposition taken before? Yes. And then I'll be short on this. don't understand, just tell me. Yup. That's fine. Ask me to clarify it, whatever. We're going If I ask you question you Have you ever had your

to have to have YOU make your responses verbally, "Yes" or

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"No," because it's being recorded.

So should you nod your

head and not answer verbally, we'll remind you and that's just because we've got to get it on tape. No gestures. Yes. Well, you can gesture and talk. You can do both. Fair enough?

I'll cut right through some of this without a lot of ado. Again, this matter concerns litigation that's ongoing regarding -- whether Mr. Blackburn should be removed from a committee. you're aware of that in general; is that fair?

Uh-huh (affirmative); yup. Let me back up. You have been named as a witness in this Have you had any

case by Mr. Barnett and his attorney.

discussions with Mr. Barnett as to why you would be a witness in this case? No. And did you ask to be a witness? No. So it's kind of news to you that you were named, I take it? Uh-huh (affirmative); yes. Have you had any discussions -- let's go back to a time period the last 18 months, from early 2011 to the present time -- with Jim Blackburn regarding his involvement in Carla Filkins campaign? No. Have you had any discussions with Mr. Barnett regarding Mr.

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Blackburn's involvement in the campaign?

I'm not talking

about closed sessions or at a council meeting or consulting with the city attorney. No. Did you at any time relate to either Mr. Stevens or Mr. Blackburn -- I'm sorry -- let me rephrase that -- to Mr. Stevens -- I'm being unartful, so I'll make it even simpler. Did you ever talk to Art Stevens and tell Art that you saw a committee or a group of people meeting at Carla Filkins' house? Yes. Tell me about when that was. It was in the summer when I saw Mr. Blackburn's car up at Filkins' house as I going down Sunnyside. Any idea when in the summer? There was two occasions and I would say probably July and August maybe. I didn't document the time or anything. I'm just talking about in general.

And who did you tell that to? I told that to Mr. Stevens. What other cars did you see there? Oh, I saw a whole bunch of cars. The reason I spotted Jim's

car is because I see it quite often, being that he's three houses down and it goes back and forth and we wave to each other. car. And so I have an eye for cars, and Jim's got a nice It's not hard to miss.

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Q A

Did you recognize any other cars that were there? Not to speak of. It didn't catch my eye. I'm kind of curious now. What kind

MR. HOMIER: of car is it? Q A Go ahead and say --

It's a Mercedes, a very nice sports car -- very nice. right out here. miss it. suntan. It's got a U of M license plate.

It's

You can't

Normally Jim has the top down.

That's why he's so

Q A

Figuring the license plate enhances it value; right? Well, U of M grads are -- they let you know. flags up and the whole deal. do that. They got the

We people from Western don't

Oh, I've seen it.

Did you draw the conclusion that that was

a political meeting? A Yes. That was after the announcement, so obviously it was

pretty obvious. Q Was that, to the best of your knowledge, before the end of August 2011 -- before August 31st? A Q Oh, yeah, it had to be before that. Do you know what relationship Jim has in the past with Carla and her husband -- Carla Filkins and her husband, Michael? A Q A Through the band. Through the mail? Band.

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Oh, through the band.

Oh, any other idea of how long

they've had -- whether they've had any social relationship? A I don't know that, but I know that Jim's daughter was very active in the band and, of course, at college, too. And so

I know Jim was involved with the band, only because I -yeah, I forget how I even heard that or knew that. Q A Q So you recall seeing Jim's car there on two occasions? Yes. Any other information that either Carla Filkins, Mike Filkins or Jim Blackburn got to you directly regarding his involvement in the campaign? A Q No. Any other individuals other than Mr. Blackburn or Mr. Barnett that you talked to that gave you information regarding Jim Blackburn's involvement in Carla's campaign? A Just that my neighbor across the street -- or across from Jim when he'd put Carla's sign out, you know, we shared some thoughts. But otherwise, I knew that Jim was involved in But that was it. That was after.

talking with him. Q A

You talked to Jim's neighbor? I'm trying to think of his name. now. It's a former FBI guy. I can't think of it right

I'll think of it in a second.

Did he state to you any specifics about Jim being involved or his extent of involvement in the campaign?

No; Jim just was a supporter of Carla, that's all.

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There has been some discussion and testimony regarding a Nominating Petition for Carla Filkins that was signed about a year ago by a number of individuals. discussion with anyone about that? Have you had any

Only over the issues over Coffey.

I think it was the first

one -- it was the first one at the Shay, the statement was brought up about this situation. and -Q A And who brought it out? I don't remember. What was that discussion? But it was just briefly

It was -- but who was there was Dave I think that's

Reiser, Bill Rzepka, Dr. Verbrugge, I think. who -- it was one of the doctors. Q A And was it about --

And they had come down -- it was very -- just mentioning that -- of the situation. But their main interest was on

what we were doing with the audit and those type of questions. Q That was where the conversation primarily went.

Do you remember -- you said there was something about a Nominating Petition mentioned in it?

A Q A

No; no. Or not? All right. I'm sorry.

You asked me about the individuals that were on that Nominating Petition.

Q A

I see.

All right.

Thank you.

And I was responding that some of those probably were at

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that issues over Coffey, because it was a group basically that hang out at Hermann's, came down to the Shay on the first issue over Coffey. And it was just mentioned by one

of them -- I can't even remember which one -- about the situation, and I said, "I know nothing about that." was my reason for being there. Is there anyone we haven't discussed here -- well, let me -that's too broad. I'll restate that. Has anyone had any That

detailed discussion with you regarding Jim Blackburn's involvement or lack of involvement in Carla Filkins' campaign for mayor? In closed session, we've had discussion. Fair enough. And without getting into that closed session,

you're referring to sitting as a sitting council member and present would be -Uh-huh (affirmative); we were updated. I won't get into that. That's fine. Other than that, out

into the general public, anyone at all that's come to you and said or given you information regarding Jim Blackburn's involvement or lack of involvement in the mayoral campaign for Carla Filkins? There might have been a few people that have mentioned, "How was the Blackburn case coming?" and I generally just don't answer that or I brush it off. business with the public. I try to stay off of city

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So you've made some observations about seeing Jim's car at her house?

A Q

This was after Carla had announced. Okay. After she had announced. How many cars were there,

by the way? A There was quite a few. I would say at least 12 to 15. I

believe Jim's car was out in the street, too. Q You don't recognize or recall any other specific vehicles, friends, people you knew? A Q A No. And it's not --

That's fine. You know, Jim's got a nice looking car there. real quick. You spot it

You know, it's not pink or anything like that,

but it's a nice-looking car. MR. HOMIER: MR. WOTILA: A You better lock the doors. Yeah. I was going to say --

Well, you know, I know Jim likes cars, and I like boats, so whatever floats your boat; right? MR. WOTILA: MR. HOMIER: I don't have anything else. I have nothing. You're done.

(Deposition concluded at 12:00 p.m.) -0-0-0-

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26499:00016:1459688-1

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STATE OF MICHIGAN IN THE 28th CIRCUIT COURT FOR THE COUNTY OF WEXFORD WILLIAM S. BARNETT, in his capacity as MAYOR OF THE CITY OF CADILLAC, Petitioner,

5 v 6 HON. WILLIAM M. FAGERMAN 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 For the Petitioner: 15 16 17 For the Respondent: 18 19 20 Also Present: 21 22 23 24 25 26 RECORDED BY: William Barnett Jim Blackburn Laura R. Lyman, CER 5813 Certified Electronic Recorder Network Reporting Corporation Firm Registration Number 8151 1-800-632-2720 MR. ROGER L. WOTILA (P22561) McCurdy Wotila & Porteous, PC 120 West Harris Street Cadillac, Michigan 49601 (231) 775-1391 MR. MICHAEL D. HOMIER (P60318) Foster Swift Collins & Smith, PC 1700 East Beltline, NE, Suite 200 Grand Rapids, Michigan 49525 (616) 726-2200 JIM BLACKBURN, Respondent. / DEPOSITION OF MICHAEL WOOD Taken by the Respondent on the 22nd day of May, 2012, at 120 West Harris Street, Cadillac, Michigan, at 9:30 a.m. APPEARANCES: Case No. 11-23578-CZ

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TABLE OF CONTENTS PAGE

Examination by Mr. Wotila . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 Examination by Mr. Homier . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .10

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 A Q A Q BY MR. WOTILA: Q A Q A Q A Q

Cadillac, Michigan Tuesday, May 22, 2012 - 9:48 a.m. REPORTER: Do you solemnly swear or affirm that

the testimony you're about to give shall be nothing but the whole truth? MR. WOOD: Yes. MICHAEL WOOD having been called by the Respondent and sworn: EXAMINATION

Would you state your name for the record? Michael Alan Wood. And where do you live, Michael? 1115 Dandy Street here in Cadillac. Is it all right if I call you Mike? That's fine. All right. before? Yes, I have. Then I'll be brief. A couple of ground rules. We'll ask Mike, have you ever had your deposition taken

you when we ask you a question to respond verbally and not a nod of the head; fair enough? Yes. And if we remind you sometimes, if you nod your head, it's -- we're not being rude. It's because the microphones

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have to pick it up. It can't tell whether I'm nodding my head or not. Also, I'll ask you a few questions. Mr. Homier from the A couple of rules:

City will also ask you a few questions.

If you know something; in other words, have a clear recollection of something, we'd like you to make that clear. If you're guessing, please let us know you're guessing so the record is clear in that regard. Right. If I ask a question that's not clear or you don't understand, just tell me that; fair enough? Fair enough. Same with Mr. Homier? Right. Michael, I've talked to you about this matter; is that right? Yes, that's correct. And that was at the deli fairly recently? Yes. Now, this matter being that I'm referring to is circumstances surrounding a Nominating Petition for Carla Filkins; is that right? Yes. Now, I'm going to hand you what's already been marked as Deposition Exhibit 1, a document that is indicated as a

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Nominating Petition.

Have you seen that before?

Yes, I have; my name's on it. Now, there are dates in the upper right-hand corner, and after your name is a date written in, 5-27-11 -- or May 27, 2011; is that right? Uh-huh (affirmative); that's right. Checking a calendar for the record of May 27th of a year ago or just about a year ago was a Friday, for the record. right? It was Friday? I thought it was Saturday. All

According to the calendar I have, assuming it's correct, May 27th was a Friday. Okay. I'll stand corrected if anyone has any different information on that. Now, I'm also going to hand you -- and will want

you to refer to a sketch that was drawn by your wife, Michelle. I want you to look at that a minute, which is

just a very rough sketch regarding what we refer to as the deli at Hermann's. Yes, that's correct. Let me back up. in the morning? Almost every morning, except Sunday. Do you have any recollection -- let's start with a general recollection about signing that Petition? Do you, from time to time, go to the deli

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A Q A Q

Yes, I do. Now, did you sign the Petition? Yes, I did. Do you know roughly the time of day that you would have signed it?

It would have had to have been in the morning, I believe. That's my best recollection of that.

In general, can you tell me the circumstances surrounding that Petition? What happened in general, as you remember?

Mr. and Mrs. Filkins were there and they brought the Petition to -- she wanted to run for mayor, and I was amenable to that, so I signed the Petition.

Q A Q A Q

So you remember Mrs. Filkins being there? And Mr. Filkins as well. You remember Mr. Filkins being there? Yes. Now, as to you're signing it, if you recall, where were you roughly in terms of the sketch when you signed that?

A Q

I had a table near this (indicating) side. Now, there's a circle with a 1 on it. For the record, That's marked

that's been marked as -- "1" is not a table. as an area where there are small tables. A Okay.

Well, then it would be this table (indicating) right

here, that's where everybody wants a seat at that table there.

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Would you mark that with an X for the record, just so we know what we're referring to? (Witness marks on diagram)

A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q

That's the table I sat at every morning that I'm there. So you remember it being morning? Uh-huh (affirmative). You remember signing the Petition? Yes. You remember Mrs. Filkins being there? Yes And your recollection is Mr. Filkins was there? Yes, he was there. Now, as to the circumstances, could you give us more detail, if you recall -- to the extent you recall of how you were given the Petition or how you came to be in possession of it?

I believe Mrs. Filkins came over to our table and asked us to take a look at it and see if we wanted to sign it. signed it and I think I -- I'm not sure, but I think I passed it onto somebody else. hover over me. But, you know, she didn't And I

But I believe I handed it to somebody else; He

probably the next person on the -- yeah, Nick Nelson. sat at the table opposite of me and I handed it to him. Q Now, as to -- it's been about a year.

So as to what you've

testified so far, do you have a pretty clear recollection?

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A Q

Yes. Do you remember not from looking at the Petition, but just from memory -- would you be able to state who all, if anyone else, was there at the deli that morning?

I can't remember everybody that was there. can't.

I honestly

Now, as to -- let's go to the next question.

There are some It

other names on this Petition and I'll go through a few.

includes Nicholas Nelson, Hermann Suhs, your wife, Michelle, David Reiser, John Dillon -- it says here -- Karen Rochelle Carroll. Do you know if those people often frequent the

deli in the morning? A When they're in town, the Carrolls do. They're -- a lot of

times in the winter, they're gone to Florida, so I don't see them, you know, until they return. But I couldn't

independently recall all these people being there, but I do remember -- and to be honest -Q Well, let me ask you generally; are some of those people typically there in the morning? A Q Yes; yes. But to be clear, I hear you, you've said you don't have a recollection that specifically -A I don't have a recollection of all these folks being there that day. Q I just can't remember that far back.

As to other details; for instance, exactly where your wife

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Michelle was standing at the time you signed it, do you know for sure or would you only be guessing? No, I don't. I can't -- I can't be sure.

And you recall -- do you recall handing it to Nick Nelson or is -- are you guessing? That's a guess. I'm not sure that -- I know that -- because

of that, I can see I did hand it to him, because he's the next person who signed it. So obviously I had to have But I don't

handed it to him, if he's the next person. remember doing that.

I must have done it, because he's the He always

next person in line and he sits across from me. does. So obviously I must have handed it to him.

That's a conclusion you're drawing yourself? That's a conclusion. independently, no. But you specifically do remember signing it yourself? Yes; yes. Do you remember seeing Carla Filkins anywhere else in the deli that day? She was over on this side (indicating) with her husband sitting over here having coffee. coffee. For the record, you're pointing to -The sofa section. There's something marked as the sofa, and that's what you're I guess they were having That's not something that I remember

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pointing to? Yes. And you remember her being there at some point; right? Yes; yes. MR. WOTILA: MR. HOMIER: THE WITNESS: MR. HOMIER: Petition. THE WITNESS: Sure. I don't have anything else. Mr. Wood, good morning. Good morning. If you could hand me the Nominating

(Witness hands document to counsel) MR. HOMIER: Thank you. EXAMINATION BY MR. HOMIER: Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A You testified earlier that Mr. Filkins was there? Yes. You know that for certain? Yes, 'cause I saw him. Did you talk to him? I don't believe I talked to him, no. Did you talk to Carla Filkins? Yes, I did. And what did she say to you? I don't remember that part of it. discussion with her. I know I did have a

She asked -- I guess I do remember.

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She had asked if we would want to look at the Petition. What time in the morning was that? I couldn't tell you. So she comes in to the restaurant and is it your testimony then she comes over and gives you the Petition? She asks me if I want to look at it and see if I wanted to sign it and I did. Were you the first person she spoke to? I don't know. I can't remember that.

Did you see Mr. Blackburn there that day? Yes, I did. Where was he? He was flitting around from one place to another. just sitting down. recall. He wasn't

He was moving around the room, as I

He sat with us for a little while and then he went

up and -- I don't even know exactly where he was at any given time during the time I was there. When Mrs. Filkins came into the restaurant did she immediately come to your table? I don't believe so. I think they sat over there or made

their order or whatever. "Over there," you mean in the sofa area? Sofa area, right. So she comes in and sits in the sofa area? Well, I think they went and ordered something; you know,

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coffee or whatever and then went over there. recall.

That's what I

And then did she get up and bring the Petition over to you? I believe so. You didn't get up and go over to her? No, I did not. That was later I went over there.

So you specifically remember her coming to your table? Yes. And you specifically remember Mr. Filkins being there? Yes; he was in that area over here (indicating). You testified earlier that you thought it was a Saturday? I thought it was a Saturday. Well, why would you think it was a Saturday? Because usually we didn't see the Filkins there on a Friday, because he is usually working. thought it was a Saturday. He's a school teacher. So I

I guess it's my mistake.

Well, would it surprise you to learn that maybe he wasn't there on Friday? I know he was there. You're certain? I'm absolutely positive. 100 percent? 100 percent certain. No doubt in your mind? No doubt in my mind that he was there.

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Just as sure as you're certain about her bringing you the Petition?

A Q

Yes. You testified earlier that you must have passed it around because the next person to sign it was Nick Nelson; is that correct?

A Q

Right. Does that mean that Carla Filkins was not standing -- you testified earlier that Carla Filkins was not hovering over you?

A Q A

No, she wasn't. Was she anywhere in the immediate vicinity? I don't think so. I think she was over -- back over to this

sofa area, if I'm not mistaken. Q A Q How long did she stay? I have no idea. So you signed the Petition and then it's gone, you never see it again until today; is that -A No; not until this very moment or this morning. it after that. Q A Q A Did you ever see anybody else sign it? I can't recollect seeing anybody actually sign it, no. When you signed it, was your wife present? I don't know if she was there at that time or not. was -- it was a work day for her. She I never saw

And the reason -- that's

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the reason I thought it was a Saturday because she comes in early on Saturdays to do the book work for Friday night. What time do you usually get there? I'm there usually by 6:30 before the place opens. So you can't remember the time -- what time it was that Ms. Filkins came in -No, I can't remember. Would 9:00 o'clock sound reasonable? I guess it would be as good as any other time. I'm sure it

wasn't any later than 10:00, I would suspect, because I'm usually gone by then. You said you're there every day. Yeah, almost every day; yup. You probably get to know other people who are there often as well? Yes, I do. So who would you call the regulars there in the morning? Okay. Dick Loughmiller, he's not a resident of the city; Well, almost every day?

Nick Nelson; Scott Swanson; and then there's a second group that comes in, a Margaret -- I can't think of her last name right now, but Margaret comes in -- Heims -- Heims (phonetic) is her name. She comes in. She's not a resident

of the city; Dave Reiser, John -- I can't -Jones? No. His name was -- his uncle or dad was a judge here. I

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can't think of his last name offhand -- Miltner -- Mr. Miltner, and Mr. Dillon and a retired banker, Jim -- I can't think of his last name. Peterson? Yeah. I'm sorry.

That's all right. I can't remember. Your wife couldn't remember his first name, so between the two, you got it together. We got the whole name, yeah. I can't remember sometimes.

Anybody else that you can think of? Not that I can think of right off the top of my head. Did Mr. Blackburn ask you to sign this Nominating Petition? No, he didn't ask me to sign it. Did you ever see it in his hands? I can't recall that I did. On this day when you signed this Petition, did you talk to anybody else about -- anybody including Ms. Filkins about her qualifications for mayor? No, I didn't. You didn't have any discussion with anybody about that? No, I didn't. I actually don't know her that well. I know

her husband from him being the band director and that sort of thing. I really don't know Carla that well.

Would you consider Bill Rzepka a regular?

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A Q A

Yeah, that's another one I forgot; yup. And John Jones? Yes. He's recent regular. He hasn't been coming there as

long as everybody else. Q In preparation for your testimony today, who have you talked to? A Q A Not in preparation. I talked to Roger.

What did you talk about? I can't remember, to tell you the honest truth. a -It was just

Q A

Well, when was it? I think it was yesterday or the day before. Hermann's. It was at

Q A Q A

So you talked to Mr. Wotila yesterday or the day before. Right. And you can't remember what was said? Well, I can't remember exactly what was said. We talked

about a whole lot of things; politics, you know, the things going on in Washington. We were talking about him going on There was a lot of

a bicycle race this past weekend. things. this. Q A Q So did you talk about this? No. You did not discuss this case?

It didn't necessarily have anything to do with

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A Q A

I don't believe that we discussed this case. Not one word? I don't think so. honest with you. I'm not really happy to be here, to be

Q A Q

Well, that makes two of us. Well, you know -So when Mr. Wotila said he interviewed you earlier in your direct testimony and you said, "Yes," did he interview you about this case or not?

I don't believe he did.

I don't think it was an interview. If you want to call

We were just talking back and forth. that an interview, I guess you can. Q

Well, I asked you if you discussed this case and you said, "No."

I don't believe we did discuss this case other than some offhand comments that I'm not going to repeat here.

Well, I wish you would, 'cause now I'm going to ask about them.

A Q A

Well, I'm not going to. So what were the offhand comments? I'm not going to -- I think that's -- that's my private business.

Well, I'm sorry, sir.

It's not.

You're under oath and

you're here to testify in a deposition. A I understand that.

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Now, if you don't want to answer my questions, I can't force you, but the judge can.

A Q

Fine. So did you or did you not talk to Mr. Wotila about this case?

A Q A Q A

Not about the case itself. What did you talk about? About the mayor. And what did you say about the mayor -- or vice versa? Well, some of the things that we don't think that the mayor is -- I don't think the mayor has done a very good job here. That's the reason I wanted -- for Mrs. Filkins.

Q A

Okay.

What else did you discuss? I already told you we discussed a

That's basically was it.

bicycle race that he was in. Q Okay. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about this,

relevant to this case. A Q Well, the relevancy, that was it. And the whole sum and substance of that conversation was that you didn't like the mayor? A That's right. what he's done. Q A Q Is that why you're here testifying today? Because I don't like the mayor? Yeah. And I don't even know him. I just don't like

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A Q

No.

Because I was told to come here. You were told to come here and

So I want to get this right.

you didn't discuss any of the context of this case? A Q We did not discuss the context of this case. When Mr. Wotila asked you earlier or stated to you earlier that he interviewed you the other day about this case, what does that mean to you? A Well, I don't know. "interviewed" means. and me answering? conversation. Q A Q A Q Well, you acknowledged that he interviewed you, did you not? Well, then I guess I misunderstood what "interview" means. So did he ask you questions about this case? No, he didn't ask me questions about this case. Did he ask you whether you had signed the Nominating Petition? A Q I don't remember whether he did or not. So when you say he didn't ask you questions about this case, you don't know? A Q A Q I don't know. And that was two days ago? I believe. And yet your memory is pretty good when it comes to a year ago? I mean, I don't understand what I mean, that's him asking me questions It was a

No, it wasn't like that.

20

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I didn't say it was good about a year ago. I signed the Petition.

I remember that

Q A Q A

Well, you testified 100 percent that Mr. Filkins was there. I know he was there. I believe that's what you said. Look. The whole idea of this thing is that you're trying to

weasel me into saying something about the mayor that I don't want to say and I'm not going to do it. Q A Q A Q I'm not trying to weasel you into anything. Yes, you are. Yes, you are.

I'm asking you questions about this case. And I'm trying to answer them as best I recollect. So I'm asking you whether your memory was better a year ago or two days ago? MR. WOTILA: About what?

Q A

In relation to the facts of this case. I don't understand. You know, the facts of the case are What is this all about? Why

what -- what is this case?

don't you tell me what this is all about, 'cause I really don't understand. Q A I'm asking the question. No. I know you're asking the questions. But I have a right

to know -Q A So answer, please, sir --- why I'm being deposed.

21

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Q A Q

Sir, I didn't Subpoena you or ask you to come today. Fine. If you have those questions, you can ask Mr. Wotila. why I'm asking you, what did you talk about this case? didn't request that you be here. That's I

A Q

Oh, okay.

Well, I don't know who did. You're going to tell me that you

So -- so wait a minute.

don't know who asked you to be here? A Q A I really don't. I got a letter.

You just showed up? No. I got a letter in the thing, but all it said is I had I don't know who was the party that asked

to appear here. me to come here. Q A Q A Q A Q

Well, who was the letter from? Wotila. And that was after he spoke to you two days ago? No; it was before that I got the letter. So he sent you a Notice to Appear here today? Well, yeah, but I don't understand who sent the thing. I understand that. Just, please, answer my questions. He

sent you a letter, a Notice to Appear here today? A Q A Q Right. He talked to you one to two days ago? Yes. And your testimony is you discussed nothing about this case?

22

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I don't believe that we discussed that much about this case. I don't know exactly what I said. say what I said about the mayor. relevant. You know, I don't want to I don't think it's

Q A Q A

Because I take it, it wasn't -It wasn't very nice. Okay. Why do you think it is relevant? He's cost

Well, I don't think he's doing a very good job. this city a lot of money.

He's doing it right now and he

did it with the fire chief and the head of the police department, made him retire early. good government. Q A And, again, is that why you're here testifying today? No. I mean -MR. WOTILA: is argumentative. MR. HOMIER: It's not. It goes to a bias. It He He's asked and answered that. This I don't think that's

goes to his prejudice against the mayor, if he has one. obviously he one. A Q A Q A Q I have one. Okay. All right? Okay. That's what you want to get? Yes, I do.

That's all I wanted to know.

That's fine. And I just want to make sure we're clear on the record, you

23

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A

did not discuss this matter with Mr. Wotila two days ago? I don't believe that it -- it wasn't an inquisition. mean, we talked. I talk to him every time I see him. I He

didn't prepare me for this case. now. I have a mind of my own.

I can tell you that right

I'm sure that you do. Petition? No. Or Mr. Dillon? No. Or Ms. Carroll?

Did you ever see Mr. Reiser sign this

No, I didn't see them sign it. Did you see anybody sign it? I can't recollect that I did, except my wife. sign it. You saw your wife sign it? Uh-huh (affirmative). When did she sign it? I believe it was after I signed it, but I'm not sure. At your table? Yes. You said Mr. Nelson sits across from you? Yes. And that your assumption was that you must have handed it to him? I saw her

24

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Yes; 'cause I -- after seeing this -- the copy of the thing, he's the next person on the list, obviously I must have reached over and handed it to him.

Q A Q A

So your wife then is number five on the list. I don't know. I don't have it front of me.

How does that come back to your table to get signed then? I'm not sure. I can't remember. I have nothing further. Nothing else. Thanks, Michael for

MR. HOMIER: MR. WOTILA: coming in.

(Deposition concluded at 10:13 a.m.) -0-0-0-

25 1
26499:00016:1459684-1

1 2 3 4

STATE OF MICHIGAN IN THE 28th CIRCUIT COURT FOR THE COUNTY OF WEXFORD WILLIAM S. BARNETT, in his capacity as MAYOR OF THE CITY OF CADILLAC, Petitioner,

5 v 6 HON. WILLIAM M. FAGERMAN 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 For the Petitioner: 15 16 17 For the Respondent: 18 19 20 Also Present: 21 22 23 24 25 26 RECORDED BY: William Barnett Jim Blackburn Laura R. Lyman, CER 5813 Certified Electronic Recorder Network Reporting Corporation Firm Registration Number 8151 1-800-632-2720 MR. ROGER L. WOTILA (P22561) McCurdy Wotila & Porteous, PC 120 West Harris Street Cadillac, Michigan 49601 (231) 775-1391 MR. MICHAEL D. HOMIER (P60318) Foster Swift Collins & Smith, PC 1700 East Beltline, NE, Suite 200 Grand Rapids, Michigan 49525 (616) 726-2200 JIM BLACKBURN, Respondent. / DEPOSITION OF MICHELLE WOOD Taken by the Respondent on the 22nd day of May, 2012, at 120 West Harris Street, Cadillac, Michigan, at 9:00 a.m. APPEARANCES: Case No. 11-23578-CZ

1 2 3

TABLE OF CONTENTS PAGE

Examination by Mr. Wotila . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 4 5 6 EXHIBIT INDEX 7 8 Deposition Exhibit 1 marked . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 9 (Nominating Petition) Deposition Exhibit 2 marked . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .12 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 (Witness Diagram) PAGE Examination by Mr. Homier . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .13

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 BY MR. WOTILA: Q A Q A Q A Q A

Cadillac, Michigan Tuesday, May 22, 2012 - 9:05 a.m. (Deposition Exhibit 1 marked) REPORTER: Do you solemnly swear or affirm that

the testimony you're about to give shall be nothing but the whole truth? MS. WOOD: Yes, I do. MICHELLE WOOD having been called by the Respondent and sworn: EXAMINATION

Would you give us your full name, please? Michelle Marie Wood. Where do you live? 1115 Dandy Street here in Cadillac. Is it all right if I call you Michelle? It is. And I do know you socially from Hermann's? Hermann's, yes. MR. WOTILA: Wood coming in. sit in or -MR. HOMIER: MR. WOTILA: MR. HOMIER: Yeah; please. Do you want to keep them separate? Yeah. Hold on just a second. We have Mr.

I don't know if we want to separate him to

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 Q A Q A A Q A Q A Q A Q Q A Q

(Off the record) Have you ever had your deposition taken before? Never. I'll talk to you briefly. For the record, I have

interviewed you regarding this question -Yes. -- of the Petition; is that right? Yes, you have. I'm going to ask you some questions. If you don't

understand the question, just tell me you don't understand it or could I repeat it; fair enough? Yes. And you are answering verbally. I will want you to answer So a nod can't be

verbally because we're being recorded. picked up. Yes.

So if Mr. Homier or I remind you, we're not trying to be rude. It's just for the record; fair enough?

That's great. Michelle, where do you work? I work at Hermann's European Caf, 214 North Mitchell Street here in Cadillac. Now, I'm going to go right to an issue that I have talked to you about and we've discussed this over at the deli at Hermann's; is that right?

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26

A Q

That's correct. I'm going to hand you what's already been marked as Deposition 1 and it is -- the top of it entitled, "A Nominating Petition."

A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q

Yes. Have you seen that before? Yes, I have. Now, does your signature appear on that? Yes, it does. And where? It would be number 5, sir. And there's a date over to the right-hand side -Yes. -- 5-27-11; is that right? That is correct. Now, I have a calendar with me and for the record, the calendar is indicating that May 27, 2011, was a Friday for the record?

A Q A Q

Yes, it is. Do you have any recollection of signing this Petition? Yes, I do. All right. Let's back up and go over that. Roughly when

you signed that, can you tell us -- and not to the minute or anything like that, but roughly the time of day that it was? A It would have been morning and that I'm sure of because I

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 Q A Q A Q Q A Q

work from 6:00 o'clock in the morning until 1:00 o'clock in the afternoon. And I usually see people between 8:00 and

9:30 that come in. Now, when you say, "come in" -- and I'm going to ask you to exercise your artistic skills. All right? Would you just

in sketch form -- I'm not asking anything dramatic here -draw the deli portion of the caf and then I'll get to why later. But just some sense of the entry and where things

are generally located. All right. Okay. (Witness marks on diagram) And I'll have you narrate in a minute, for the record, drawing now. Do you want me to include tables and -Generally, yeah; just without great detail, chairs, just indicate where tables are. (Witness marks on diagram) Basically that's it. I'm going to walk you through this a bit. There are

several -- and I'm going to lead a little bit here, just as to location to set the scene. MR. WOTILA: me know. Are there several rooms that you might refer to as Hermann's generally? Michael, if you object to that, let

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26

A Q A Q A Q

Yes.

I forgot to add the entrance to the butcher shop.

So there is a -- you mentioned a butcher shop? That's correct. And that is one room? Yes. This, that you've drawn, is what I am referring to as the deli; is that right?

A Q A

That's correct. And you have written here, "Entrance to caf"? Yes; there's two rooms over there. more specific? Do you want me to be

If I'm holding this here -- and I'll have this marked later. But what we'll call the top of the drawing, where it says, "Entrance," would be Mitchell Street; is that right?

A Q

That's correct. And here (indicating) to the -- I'll refer to the south is an area that's connected to the deli and that would be what?

A Q A

Opa's Butcher Shop. You mentioned entrance to caf. And that is -And beyond that,

Yeah; that is the bar side of the caf. sir, is the dining of the caf.

Q A Q A

So we're indicating here roughly four rooms? Yes. And they're all connected? Yes; except the hotel.

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26

So we have -- all right -- the butcher shop, the deli, another room is the caf and then over to the right not shown here would be a formal dining area?

A Q A Q

That's correct. And they're all interconnected; is that right? That is correct. But what you've drawn here is just a very rough sketch of what we're referring to as the deli; is that right?

A Q

Yes; that is correct. Now, roughly in terms of distance, just so we get an idea of size, you've drawn some circles here in the upper right; is that right?

A Q

Uh-huh (affirmative); those are tables, yes, sir. From those circles to these long rectangles, these are tables, too?

A Q A Q A

That is correct. What's the distance there? Between? Oh, these circles or tables marked. Oh, I'm not good at distance; maybe 10 feet, Mr. Wotila. I'm not sure. Are we talking --

Q A Q

But we're just talking -- you're saying roughly 10 feet? Roughly. Now, going back to what appears to be May 27th, because of dates are here --

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26

A Q

Yes, sir. Do you know any of the other names -- I'm sorry -- the other names on this nominating position; is that right?

A Q A Q

Yes, sir. Do you recognize any of those names? I recognize all of these names. All right. And you've mentioned that you remember this

being in morning -- in the morning? A Q Yes. As to these individuals, did they attend Hermann's restaurant regularly -- or I'm sorry -- the deli? A Q A Q A Q Yes. When? Occasionally; in the mornings; always in the mornings. Would it be fair to call it a coffee group or -Coffee klatch, whatever you want to attach to it. Now, do you remember the circumstances under which you signed this Petition as to what happened? A Yes. Mrs. Filkins came in, came over -- I'm not sure. Our I would say regularly.

coffee klatch sits in this area (indicating). Q Now, when you say "our coffee klatch," you refer to yourself? A Q A Yes. You're one person? Yes.

10

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A Q

Mr. -- do you want me to -Why don't you mark with a number here and I'll use blue ink for this. You fill this out in pencil. Okay.

A Q

All right.

Mark as a number 1 what you're referring to as the area where your coffee klatch sits. (Witness marks on diagram)

A Q A Q A Q A Q A

Right here (indicating). And would you put a circle around the 1, so we know -Yes, sir. And if you know that day, who that was? If I know that day? Yes. Well -And if you don't know, that's okay. I can only assume who was there that day by the Petitions, and they're all marked on the 27th of May of last year. So

I don't know if I'm supposed to assume, but I believe I can safely assume that all these people were there. Mr. Reiser,

Mr. Dillon usually sit at this (indicating) table. Q A Now, would you mark that number 2? 2 and put a circle around it. Okay.

(Witness marks on diagram) Q So you're indicating -- you've marked a rectangle. That's

the table where you said Mr. Reiser and Mr. Dillon would

11

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often sit? That's correct. Now, going back to what you recall happening the day this was signed, you said Ms. Filkins came in -Came in the Mitchell Street entrance and she brought the Petition with her, and asked if we would sign it. did. Let's talk about you first. Okay. I signed it. You've used "we." And we

Do you remember who handed it to you? Mrs. Filkins. Do you know if Mr. Blackburn was there that day? I believe he was, because of his name on the Petition. But other than his name on the Petition -- this is a year ago, I understand? Yeah; yeah. Today is -- roughly a year ago? Right. It's dated May 27, 2011. You said because of his name.

Other than that, do you have any specific recollection regarding Mr. Blackburn? No, I don't; no. Do you have any specific recollection of any discussion you might have had with Carla Filkins that morning? Only that after I personally signed the Petition, she went

12

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and whoever else signed it that day -- she went to sit on the sofa. sofa. She grabbed a cup of coffee, went and sat on the

And after I signed the Petition, I walked over to her

and asked her about yard signs. MR. WOTILA: time. MR. HOMIER: Petition? MR. WOTILA: this time as Exhibit 2. Oh, sure. Let me also mark it at Can you hand me a copy of the I don't have anything else at this

I'm going to have you just initial

here (indicating), Michelle, the upper corner, your initials. (Witness marks on exhibit) MR. WOTILA: upper right-hand corner? THE WITNESS: MR. WOTILA: that as Exhibit 2. (Deposition Exhibit 2 marked) MR. HOMIER: Ms. Wood, my name is Mike Homier. I That's correct. And I'll have the court reporter mark All right. You've placed "MW" in the

represent the City of Cadillac. THE WITNESS: MR. HOMIER: Yes, sir. So I'm going to ask you some And if you don't

questions, the same way Mr. Wotila did.

understand anything, let me know and I'll try and repeat it.

13

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Okay? THE WITNESS: I will, sir. EXAMINATION BY MR. HOMIER: Q You testified that you were working that day; is that correct? Yes, sir. And you always work in the morning? Yes, sir. And I think your testimony was that you work from 6:00 to 1:00 p.m.? Yes; yes, sir. Generally; sometimes I go over. But

generally that is my hours. You always start at 6:00? Yes. Sometimes a little earlier; sometimes a little later.

Could you have started later on this day? Probably not. Why is that? Because I like to get there before Chef Hermann gets there because I can work in peace and quiet. So on those days when you get there later, what's the difference between those days and this day? Maybe 15 minutes. What is it that you do there? I'm his secretary or office manager.

14

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And on this day, you said people generally come in between 8:00 and 9:30?

A Q A Q

That's correct, sir. And this would apply to the 27th of May? That's also correct, sir. Now, you testified that your name was on this Nominating Petition?

A Q

Yes, I did. And you testified that Ms. Filkins came into the restaurant and asked you to sign it?

A Q A Q

That's correct, sir. So why is it that your name appears on number 5? Other people were there signing it as well as myself, sir. Well, your testimony was she came into the restaurant, handed it to you, and asked you to sign it.

Yes; she came to the little area that I have marked and asked all of us to sign it.

When you say all of you, you testified earlier that you just assumed these people were there because their name was on the list?

A Q

Yes. And you had no specific recollection whether any of the other people were there that day?

A Q

Generally, sir, they're always there Monday through Friday. I'm not asking generally; I'm asking specifically. On that

15

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day, you testified earlier, did you not, that you assumed these people were there because they signed it? Yes, I did. But you have no specific recollection of any of these people being there except for yourself? And my husband, yes, sir. And your husband. day? Yes, I do. So back to my question. If Ms. Filkins comes into the Your husband, you know, was there that

restaurant and as you've testified, she hands you the Nominating Petition, why is your name at number 5 and not number 1? I can't answer that because -- well, maybe because the Petition circulated while she was standing there and I just happened to come in. I flit around the restaurant, the

deli, and she was in there and I went over there to see what was going on. So is your testimony that she came into the restaurant and handed it to you or is your testimony that she came into the restaurant and then you came from somewhere else? That could be; I'm sure that's correct, sir. Well, how sure are you that it's correct because you've given two different versions in the last 10 minutes? MR. WOTILA: I'll object to that characterization.

16

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I think the record speaks for itself, that she said she came in and she handed her it. give a time sequence. Her initial statement did not

So I'll object to the

characterization, but you can continue to answer questions as he asks them. I guess my earlier testimony was not completely truthful as far as not being number one who signed it. So who was there that day specifically; do you recall? My husband, Michael A. Wood, was there. assume, sir. Would it surprise you to learn Mrs. Filkins has testified that she was not there on that Friday morning? It would really surprise me, sir. How sure are you that she was there that morning? I remember that morning because after I signed the Petition, sir, I walked over to the sofa and I asked her how I would go about getting yard signs. So the sofa is towards the south side next to the entrance on the diagram; correct? That's correct, sir. And so when she hands you the Petition, where is it that you're at? I was over where number 1 is. Over near number 1? Uh-huh (affirmative). Now, I won't

17

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So she hands it to you at number 1, and then she goes and sits over at the sofa?

Yeah.

She might have sat and chatted with -- or stood and

chatted with people for a while and then retreated to the sofa. By the time that I had finished signing it and said

my hellos to everybody that might have been there, I walked over to the sofa where she was sitting. Q Now, all of that testimony is just guessing, isn't it? don't know one way or the other? MR. WOTILA: Q All of what testimony? You

All of your testimony that you just testified about she may have retreated, she may have given it, you don't know; correct? MR. WOTILA: it down. Well, I'll object. You have to break So

She talked about seeing her at the sofa.

please break it down. Q Okay. Well, let's go back. You said she handed it to you

at number 1, as marked on the diagram? A Q Yes. And then you said she may have retreated, she may have gone somewhere else, she may have gone back to the sofa; correct? A Q A Q Yes. You don't know that specifically, do you? That she went to the sofa? You don't know where she went after she handed it to you?

18

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I saw her -- when I turned around, I said hello to everybody that was sitting there, which is what I generally do and then I went over to the sofa where she was seated and I asked her about yard signs, sir.

Q A Q

How long was she sitting in the sofa? Maybe a minute or two. So she sits on the sofa for a minute to two. go then? Where does she

I don't know.

I left the premises -- or where she was, I

was working, sir. Q So after you talked about yard signs, it's possible she walked out, if she was there at all? A Q A Q A It could be. You referred earlier to your coffee klatch? Yeah. Tell me what that means. Well, certain people come in every day for coffee. My

husband happens to be one of them, and then we have a second group of men that come in. Dillon. Q A So who comes in every day? Well, my husband does; Mr. Nelson -- Nick Nelson does, if he's not on vacation somewhere; Scott Swanson does; Mr. Richard Loughmiller does. Q Who else? It includes Mr. Reiser and Mr.

19

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A Q A Q A

Those I would say were the regulars, sir. And then you mentioned a second group of people? Yes; and they sit at that number 2. And who were those people? Mr. Jack Dillon, Mr. David Reiser, and when you're done, I can continue.

Q A

Go ahead. Coach John Jones, Mr. Peterson. his first name. He's -- I don't know what

And he's the real tall man. I can't answer questions. Oh.

MR. WOTILA: THE WITNESS: A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q

He is a former banker, retired banker. Mr. Peterson? Yeah. Anyone else? Yes; that's right. Anyone else? No, that's about it; the regulars. Was Mr. Dillon there that day? I don't recall. Was Mr. Reiser there that day? I don't recall. Was Mr. Jones there that day? I don't know. Mr. Peterson there that day? It's Jim Peterson. Mr. Bill Rzepka.

20

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A Q A Q

I don't recall. And Mr. Rzepka, was he there that day? I don't recall. So you don't recall any of these other people there, but you recall Ms. Filkins being there; is that right?

A Q A Q A

Yes; yes, because I specifically asked her for yard signs. Did you know Mrs. Filkins before this day? She would come in occasionally, yes. And when would she occasionally come in; do you recall? I only saw her on Saturday morning, sir, because I know that she works at the hospital and I assume it to be Monday through Friday.

Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q A Q

So what time of the morning did she come in? I would say probably -- probably around 9:00. So your testimony is she came in around 9:00 a.m.? Yes, sir. On Friday? Yes, sir. May 27th? Yes, sir. How long did she stay? I can't be sure, sir. I was working.

You work 'til 1:00 o'clock? That's correct, sir. Did you work 'til 1:00 o'clock that day?

21

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I could have. records.

I don't know.

I would have to check my time

At least 'til 1:00 o'clock, sir.

Q A

After 9:00 a.m., did you ever see Ms. Filkins that day? Not that I recall, sir. in my office. I usually am stuck in the basement

So it's possible that Ms. Filkins brought in the Petition and immediately left the premises; correct?

A Q

I can't answer that, sir.

I don't know.

Did you have -- you have no idea how long she stayed that day; is that --

A Q

No, sir, I don't. When Ms. Filkins asked you to sign the Petition, did you ask her any questions?

A Q

Not that I recall, sir. And how would you characterize your relationship with Mrs. Filkins?

I see her occasionally. acquaintance.

I would say she was an

We don't hook up socially.

And so she asked you to sign a Nominating Petition and you don't ask her any questions?

Only about the yard signs. background.

I knew a little of her

I was quite impressed with it.

Q A

How did you know about her background? Her husband used to come in, usually during the summer when he's not teaching.

22

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Had you ever had any conversations with him about Mrs. Filkins?

A Q

Yes; but not the mayoral race, no. In preparation for your deposition testimony here today, who did you talk to?

Mr. Wotila came into my office to let me know that I was going to be asked to make a deposition. weeks ago. And that was two

Q A Q A Q A

Have you talked to anybody else? No. You haven't talked to Hermann? Yes, we've talked; yes. Okay. And you want to know the content, is that what you're asking me?

Q A

Yes. We were just, you know, talking about at first he was Subpoenaed by your law firm, sir, and then I was wondering why I hadn't been. And that's basically why we -- what we I said to him, "Well, I guess

had to say to one another. I'm not going to be called." Q A

Did you discuss the events of May 27th at all with Hermann? He told he had signed the Petition as well but that was about the extent of it and that's why he was being Subpoenaed.

23

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Q A

Did you tell him you had signed it as well? Yes, sir. that time. And I told him that I had not been Subpoenaed at

And did you discuss whether Mrs. Filkins was in Hermann's that morning?

A Q

No, not that I recall. Did you talk to Mr. Blackburn about your testimony here today?

A Q A Q A Q A Q

No, sir. Have you ever discussed this issue with Mr. Blackburn? No, sir. Have you ever discussed it with anybody other than Hermann? My husband. How about anybody other than your husband? No, sir. So other than Hermann and your husband, you have not talked about this issue regarding this case and the Nominating Petition?

A Q A Q A Q

Well, with the exception of Mr. Wotila, who -With the exception of Mr. Wotila. -- when he came down to the office. Other than those three people -No, sir. And I just want to be clear with respect to this Nominating Petition, you did not see anybody else sign this; is that

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correct? I saw my husband sign it. So you saw your husband sign it. When did he sign it? But I see

I don't remember if it was before or after me.

that his name is there, and I remember he signed it, and then I spoke to Mrs. Filkins about what we talked about, the yard signs and then I have -- you know, I can't hang around too long. I'm at work. Did he sign it before or after you signed it? I don't recall where he was in

I understand.

Maybe before; I'm not sure. the numbering.

You testified earlier that you saw Mrs. Filkins come in? Yes, I did. When she comes in, does she come right to you and ask you to sign it? I don't think so. section number 1. You think that why? Because she recognized people and usually the gentlemen come in at section number 2, come in later than we are -- than we do or our group does. my husband's in there. So now I want to -- I just want to clear this up. Sure. Your testimony is you see her come in? I just consider it our group because I think she went to the coffee group at

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A Q

Yeah. And at what point then does she come to you and ask you to sign it?

No. do.

I go over to section 1, sir. I do daily faxing.

I have things I have to It has to be

It has to hang here.

put here, you know. her come in. Q A Q You saw her come in? Uh-huh (affirmative).

I will be doing my work and then I saw

And you testified that she handed you the Petition.

I'm

trying to get an idea between when she came in and when she handed you the Petition, how long of a time period that is. A Q Maybe three, four minutes, sir. So she comes in and within three to four minutes, you're signing the Petition? A Q A Q A Q A Yes, sir. I believe so.

Did you see Mr. Blackburn sign the Petition? No, sir. Did you see Mr. Nelson sign the Petition? No, sir. But you testified that you did see your husband sign it? Yes, sir. Well, I went over there to see what was going on,

and when she turned around, she said, "I have a Petition here to run for mayor," and I said, "Okay." it. And I signed

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So I want to make sure I got this right. about a three-to-four-minute time span?

We're talking

A Q

I believe so, sir. I understand.

It's been a year.

She comes in, she goes over to section 1 and

asks people to sign the Petition? A Q I believe so, sir. And so Mr. Blackburn signs the Petition and you don't witness it? A Q No, sir. Your husband signs next and you say you are there to witness it? A Q I could be. Then you testify, did you know, that you signed the Petition? A If that's what I said, I said it, but at the moment, you know, it was a year ago, sir. Q I understand that. That's why I'm trying to figure out how

you know precisely on some questions what happened and on others then you'd say, "I don't remember." So I'm just

trying to get an idea of your testimony with respect to the timing of the signatures. saw your husband sign it? A Q Uh-huh (affirmative). I'm trying to figure out why there is two signatures in between your husband's and your signature, if you see your So you said -- you testified you

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husband sign it and Mrs. Filkins then passes the Petition to you? Maybe I was chatting with Mrs. Filkins or someone else there at the group at the time. I don't recall.

So the bottom line is you just don't know? Yeah; the bottom line is I did sign it and I know it was in the morning, because of the -- specifically I asked her about yard signs. And who handed you the Petition? Mrs. Filkins. Well, I think it was just being -- she was

standing there and it was just -- there were three or four tables and it was probably -- I know you can't record this, but, you know, here's (indicating) the Petition and it was slid in front of somebody and then maybe somebody else, or picked up and taken to the table across. But you don't recall whether Mrs. Filkins was there the entire time? She was when I signed the Petition and she was a couple minutes later when I asked about yard signs, sir. By then she had gone to the sofa? Yes, sir. Did you ever see Mr. Blackburn with the Nominating Petition in his hand? No, I did not, sir. Do you know whether he circulated it to Mr. Nelson?

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A Q A Q A

No, I don't, sir. Or Hermann Suhs? I don't believe so, sir. How would you know? Because Mrs. Filkins was standing there and I don't recall -It was Mrs. Filkins.

You just testified -- and correct me if I'm wrong -- that the Petition was laid on the table and then pushed around the table.

A Q

It could have been. Well, I'm trying to get -- I'm trying to separate your speculation from what you actually know.

I know Mrs. Filkins was there.

She was either handing the

Petition or hovering around or it was being slid, I don't recall exactly. Q A So how do you know she was doing any of those things? Because she was there. for the mayor. Petition or -Q You just testified earlier that you didn't talk to her about any of that. A Q Maybe I overheard it, sir. I understand that. I don't have total recall, sir. What I'm She was there talking about her race

Or she needed so many signatures on a

I'm not expecting you to.

trying to do is separate fact, what you do know, from what you are speculating to know.

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I do know Mrs. Filkins was there. Petition.

I do know I signed the

I do know a few minutes later I walked over to

the sofa where she was sitting and asked about yard signs, sir. Q A Q A Q A Q Where did you sign the Petition? On the table. Number 1? Well, it would be this (indicating) one right there. Not number 1? Number 1 is the just the one with the circle on it. Just the section. table? A Q A Q A Q A Q No, sir. Number 1 we're just referring to the section? It's just a section, yes, sir. So your testimony is you signed it on the table? That's correct. I wouldn't have signed it in the air. Okay. Number 1 -- is number 1 is a It would be --

And this is a table just east of what is marked number 1? Yes; that's the one where my husband generally sits. And so you signed the Petition, and then you turned around and left?

I probably chatted for a minute with somebody that was sitting there, and then I walked over -- I looked over and I saw Mrs. Filkins. And I live on Dandy Street where Mr.

Barnett had a bunch of yard signs himself, so I thought,

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"Well, I would like a yard sign, too." to -- how to go about getting one. Filkins. Who was not in section 1? No. At that time she was at the sofa.

But I don't know how

So I walked over to Mrs.

Give me one second. Sure. Do you know why Mrs. Filkins may have testified that she didn't ask you to sign the Petition? No, I don't, sir. So if her testimony is that she never witnessed you sign, is that correct or incorrect? I believe she was standing there. Whether her eyes were on

the Petition at the time I signed it, I don't know. You testified -- I just want to make sure I have this clear. You testified that it was around 9:00 a.m. that Ms. Filkins was there; correct? Yes. And I think we went through these people, but I just want to make sure I get this covered: You said Mr. Dillon, Mr.

Reiser, John Jones, Jim Peterson and Bill Rzepka were all regulars? Yes, they are, sir. But you don't know whether they were that day or not? No, sir. They come in later than the first coffee group.

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Q A Q

When do they come in? Oh, probably about 9:30. So between -- you don't remember whether you saw them there that day?

A Q

No, sir. At 9:30 in the morning -- well, let me rephrase that. testified Ms. Filkins was there at around 9:00 a.m. time did she leave? You What

A Q

I'm not certain, sir. Was it before 9:30? MR. WOTILA: several times. I think she's asked and answered that

I'm not certain, sir; more than likely I was busy in the office doing my duties.

Q A

Do you know what hours Ms. Filkins works? No, sir, I don't. MR. HOMIER: MR. WOTILA: I have nothing further. Nothing. Thank you.

(Deposition concluded at 9:45 a.m.) -0-0-0-

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