The Secret History of How Cuba Helped End Apartheid in South Africa

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Democracy Now!

WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 11, 2013 As the world focuses on Tuesdays historic handshake between President Obama and Cuban President Ral Castro, we look back at the pivotal role Cuba played in endin apartheid and why Castro was one of only five world leaders invited to speak at !elson "andelas memorial# $n the words of "andela, the Cubans%destroyed the myth of the invincibility of the white oppressor ### &and' inspired the fi htin masses of (outh Africa#% )istorian Piero *lei+eses ar ues that it was Cubas victory in An ola in ,-.. that forced Pretoria to set !amibia free and helped break the back of apartheid (outh Africa# /e speak to *lei+eses about his new book, 01isions of 2reedom3 )avana, /ashin ton, Pretoria, and the (tru le for (outhern Africa, ,-456,--,,0 and play archival foota e of "andela meetin 2idel Castro in Cuba#

TRANSCRIPT This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form. !7R"77! ()A$8)3 /e turn now to the historic moment Tuesday when President 9arack Obama shook hands with Cuban President Ral Castro as both men participated in the memorial service for anti6apartheid leader !elson "andela in (outh Africa# The /hite )ouse said the handshake was unscripted# $t marked the first time a :#(# president has shaken hands with a Cuban leader since ;<<<# $n /ashin ton,

Republicans e=pressed outra e over the e=chan e# >urin a hearin in the )ouse, Republican Representative $leana Ros6?ehtinen of 2lorida sparred with (ecretary of (tate @ohn 8erry, who said it did not represent any chan e in :#(# policy toward Cuba# R7P# $?7A!A RO(6?7)T$!7!3 "r# (ecretary, sometimes a handshake is +ust a handshake# 9ut when the leader of the free world shakes the bloody hand of a ruthless dictator like Ral Castro, it becomes a propa anda coup for the tyrant# Ral Castro uses that hand to si n the orders to repress and +ail democracy advocates# $n fact, ri ht now, as we speak, Cuban opposition leaders are bein detained, and theyre bein beaten while tryin to commemorate today, which is $nternational )uman Ri hts >ay# They will feel disheartened when they see these photos# Could you please tell the Cuban people livin under that repressive re ime that a handshake nonwithstandin , the :#(# policy toward the cruel and sadistic Cuban dictatorship has not weakenedA Thank you# (7CR7TARB O2 (TAT7 @O)! 87RRB3 ?adies and entlemen, today is about honorin !elson "andela# And the president is at an international funeral with leaders from all over the world# )e didnt choose whos there# Theyre there to honor "andela# And we appreciate that people from all over the world and from all different beliefs and walks of life who appreciated !elson "andela andCor were friends of his came to honor him# And $ think, as the president saidD$ ur e you to o read his speech, or if you didnt see it or havent read it, because the president said in his speech today honorin !elson "andela, he said, 0/e ur e leaders to honor "andelas stru le for freedom by upholdin the basic human ri hts of their people0D R7P# $?7A!A RO(6?7)T$!7!3 And would you say Ral Castro is upholdin their basic human ri htsA (7CR7TARB O2 (TAT7 @O)! 87RRB3 !o, absolutely not# A"B *OO>"A!3 The uproar over President Obamas handshake with President Ral Castro has drawn attention to the close relationship between the (outh African anti6 apartheid movement and Cuba# $n ,--,, !elson "andela visited Cuba with then6 President 2idel Castro# This is a clip when they first met# !7?(O! "A!>7?A3 9efore we say anythin , you must tell me when you are comin to (outh Africa# Bou seeDno, +ust a moment, +ust a moment, +ust a moment# PR7($>7!T 2$>7? CA(TRO3 &translated' The sooner the better# !7?(O! "A!>7?A3 And we have had a visit from a wide variety of people# And our friend, Cuba, which had helped us in trainin our people, ave us resources to keep current with our stru le, trained our people as doctors, and (/APO, you have not come to our country# /hen are you comin A PR7($>7!T 2$>7? CA(TRO3 &translated' $ havent visited my (outh African homeland yet# $ want it, $ love it as a homeland# $ love it as a homeland as $ love you and the (outh African people# A"B *OO>"A!3 /ell, for more on Cubas key role in the stru le to end apartheid in (outh Africa, were +oined now in /ashin ton, >#C#, by Piero *lei+eses, professor of American forei n policy at the (chool of Advanced $nternational (tudies at @ohns

)opkins :niversity# )e uses archival sources from the :nited (tates, (outh Africa and Cuba to provide an unprecedented look at the history in his latest book, 1isions of 2reedom3 )avana, /ashin ton, Pretoria, and the (tru le for (outhern Africa, ,-456 ,--,E# Bou can read the books prolo uepretoria on our website at democracynow#or # Professor *lei+eses, welcome to >emocracy !owF Talk about this key relationship, why Cuba was so seminal to the anti6apartheid movement# P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 Cuba is the only country in the world that sent its soldiers to confront the army of apartheid and defeated the army of apartheid, the (outh African army, twiceDin ,-4G, ,-45, and in ,-..# And in )avana, when he visited )avana in @uly ,--,D$ wont to be able to repeat e=actly the words of !elson "andela, but !elson "andela said, 0The Cuban victory,0 referrin to the Cuban victory over the (outh Africans in An ola in ,-.., 0destroyed the myth of the invincibility of the white oppressor and inspired the fi htin masses of (outh Africa# Cuito Cuanavale,0 which is a victory of the Cubans in An ola, 0is the turnin point in the liberation of our continent and of my people from the scour e of apartheid#0 (o, inD A"B *OO>"A!3 2or a country that knows very little, Professor *lei+eses, about the Cuban e=perience, its military intervention in An ola, can you step back for a moment and e=plain what President CastroDwhat 2idel Castro and these Cuban soldiers didA P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 (ure# $n ,-4G, you have the decoloniHation of An ola, Portu uese colony slated to become independent on !ovember ,,, ,-4G# There is a civil war between three movements3 one supported by the Cubans, the Cubans that supported over the years in its stru le a ainst the Portu ueseI the other two supported by (outh Africa and the :nited (tates# And the movement supported by the Cubans, the "P?A, which is in power in An ola today, havin won free election, was on the ver e of winnin the civil war# And it was on the ver e of winnin the civil warD a paraphrase from what the C$A station chief in An ola at the time told meDbecause it was the most committed movement with the best leaders, the best pro ram# And in order to prevent their victory, the victory of the "P?A, in October ,-4G, ur ed by /ashin ton, (outh Africa invaded# And the (outh African troops advanced on ?uanda, and they would have taken ?uanda and crushed the"P?A if 2idel Castro had not decided to intervene# And between !ovember ,-4G and April ,-45, J,5<<< Cuban soldiers poured into An ola and pushed the (outh Africans back into !amibia, which (outh Africa ruled at the time# And this had an immense psycholo ical impactDtalkin of (outh AfricaDin (outh Africa, both amon whites and amon blacks# And the ma+or black (outh African newspaper, The /orld, wrote in an editorial in 2ebruary ,-45, at a moment in which the (outh African troops were still in An ola, but the Cubans were pushin them back Dthey had evacuated central An ola# They were in southern An ola# The writin was on the wall# And this newspaper, The /orld, wrote, 09lack Africa is ridin the crest of a wave enerated by the Cuban victory in An ola# 9lack Africa is tastin the heady wine of the possibility of achievin total liberation#0 And "andela wrote that he was in +ail in ,-4G when he learned about the arrival of the Cuban troops in An ola, and it was the first time then a country had come from another continent not to take somethin away, but to help Africans to achieve their freedom#

This was the first real contribution of Cuba to the liberation of (outh Africa# $t was the first time in livin memory that the /hite *iants, the army of apartheid, had been forced to retreat# And they had retreated because of a non6white army# And in a situation of internal colonialism, this is e=tremely important# And after that, the Cubans remained in An ola to protect An ola from the (outh African army# 7ven the C$A acknowled ed that the Cubans were the uarantee for the independence of An ola# And in An ola, they trained the A!C, the African !ational Con ress, of "andela# And very close relations developed between the two# $ dont know if you want me to o on and talk about the ne=t moment, or you want to interrupt me with some Kuestions# !7R"77! ()A$8)3 Bes, Professor Piero *lei+eses, if you could speak specifically about the role of Che *uevara in AfricaA P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 Beah, Che *uevara had nothin to do with (outh Africa# The role D !7R"77! ()A$8)3 $n Africa, thou h, in the Con o and An ola# P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 Bes, $ understand# The role of Che *uevara in ,-5L, ,-5GDin late ,-5L, Che *uevara was sent by 2idel Castro as 2idel Castros top representative to (ub6(aharan AfricaDit was the first visit by a top Cuban leader to (ub6(aharan AfricaDbecause the Cubans believed that there was a revolutionary situation in central Africa, and they wanted to help# And Che *uevara established relations with a number of revolutionary movements# One of them, the "P?A, the "ovement for the ?iberation of An ola, that was based in Con o69raHHaville# And in ,-5G, the first Cubans fou ht in An olan territory to ether with the "P?A# 9ut the ma+or role played by Che *uevara is that he led a roup of Cubans into Con o, the former 9el ian Con o, where there was a revolt by the followers of the late ?umumba a ainst the central overnment enforced by the :nited (tates# And the :nited (tates had created an army of white mercenaries, the /hite *iants, mainly (outh African and Rhodesians and then 7uropeans, to crush this revolt# And the Cubans went at the reKuest of the rebels, at the reKuest of the overnment of 7 ypt, Al eria and TanHania to help the rebels# A"B *OO>"A!3 :hD P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 AndDyesA A"B *OO>"A!3 Professor, $ wanted to o back to An olaD P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 Bes# A"B *OO>"A!3 Dand this time brin in former :#(# (ecretary of (tate )enry 8issin er# This is 8issin er e=plainin why the :#(# was concerned about the Cuban troops that 2idel Castro had sent to fi ht in An ola# After 8issin er, youll hear 2idel Castro himself# (7CR7TARB O2 (TAT7 )7!RB 8$(($!*7R3 /e thou ht, with respect to An ola, that if the (oviet :nion could intervene at such distances, from areas that were far from the traditional Russian security concerns, and when Cuban forces could be introduced into distant trouble spots, and if the /est could not find a counter to that, that then the whole international system could be destabiliHed# PR7($>7!T 2$>7? CA(TRO3 &translated' $t was a Kuestion of lobaliHin

our stru le vis6M6vis the lobaliHed pressures and harassment of the :#(# $n this respect, it did not coincide with the (oviet viewpoint# /e acted, but without their cooperation# Nuite the opposite# A"B *OO>"A!3 That was President 2idel Castro and, before that, (ecretary of (tate )enry 8issin er from the film C$A OampI An olan Revolution# Professor *lei+esesA P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 O8, two points# One, 8issin er didnt mention that the Cubans intervened in response to the (outh African invasion and that the :nited (tates had connived with the (outh Africans and ur ed the (outh Africans to invade# (o here, there is a rather important issue of chronolo y# The second point is that in the last volume of his memoirs, 8issin er, who in eneral is a very arro ant person, acknowled es that he made a mistake# And the mistake he made was in sayin that the Cubans had intervened as pro=ies of the (oviet :nion# And he writes in his memoirs that actually it had been a Cuban decision and that the Cubans had intervened and confronted the (oviets with afait accompli# And then he asks a Kuestion in his memoirs3 /hy did Castro take this decisionA And 8issin ers answer is that 2idel Castro was probablyD$m Kuotin D0was probably the most enuine revolutionary leader then in power#0 (o, there are two 8issin ers, if you want, and there is the 8issin er of his memoirs, where he says a few thin s that actually are true# A"B *OO>"A!3 Piero *lei+eses, what do you make of the furor ri ht nowA Bou +ust heard Con ressmember ?ehtinen from 2lorida attackin @ohn 8erry, you know, the si nificance of the handshake between President Obama and President Ral Castro ri ht there at the (oweto stadium at the memorial service for !elson "andela# P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 $ think its pathetic and reflects the ethics of the :nited (tates and the policy of the :nited (tates# Obama, President Obama, was received with applause in (outh Africa when he spoke, etc#, because he is the first black president of the :nited (tates# 9ut the role of the :nited (tates as a country, as a overnment, past overnments, in the stru le for liberation of (outh Africa is a shameful role# $n eneral, we were on the side of the apartheid overnment# And the role of Cuba is a splendid role in favor of the liberation# This handshakeD oin beyond this particular issue, the handshake was lon overdue# The embar o is absurd, is immoral# And we have here a president who bowed to the kin of (outh AfricaDof (audi Arabia, $m sorry, which certainly is no democracy# $ mean, even Obama should know it# (o its an absurd situation# The problem with Obama is that his speeches are ood, his estures are ood, but there is no follow6up# (o, unfortunately, it is +ust a esture, a lon 6 overdue esture that does not chan e a shameful :#(# policy# !7R"77! ()A$8)3 Professor Piero *lei+eses, before we conclude, lets turn to 2idel Castro speakin in (outh Africa on his visit in ,--.# PR7($>7!T 2$>7? CA(TRO3 &translated' ?et (outh Africa be a model of a more +ust and more humane future# $f you can do it, we will all be able to do it# !7R"77! ()A$8)3 That was 2idel Castro speakin in ,--. in (outh Africa, with former president, who +ust passed away, !elson "andela applaudin him# Piero *lei+eses, we +ust have a minute# Could you talk about what most surprised you in

your research in the Cuban archives about this historyA P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 /ell, there are a lot of thin s# One is the independence of Cuban policy vis6M6vis the (oviet :nion# There are clashes between 2idel Castro and *orbachev# There are clashes between the leaders of the Cuban military mission in An ola and the (oviet leaders, which $ Kuote actually in my book and which make really fascinatin readin # This is one thin # 9ut another thin that impressed me very much is the respect with which the Cubans treated the An olan overnment# This is very important, because the An olan overnment really depended on Cuba for its survival, the presence of the Cuban troops as a shield a ainst (outh African invasion, which was a constant threat, and the very lar e and enerous technical assistance that Cuba was providin to An ola# And the tendency would be to treat a overnment thats so dependent with some kind of superiority# And this is somethin $ve never found in international relations, this kind of respect with which Cuba treated what, by all ob+ective counts, should have been a client overnment# And its particularly strikin for someone who studies the :nited (tates and lives in the :nited (tates, because seriously the :nited (tates overnment does not treat overnment that depends on /ashin ton with much respect# A"B *OO>"A!3 Piero *lei+eses, thank you so much for bein with us# P$7RO *?7$@7(7(3 "y pleasure# A"B *OO>"A!3 Professor of American forei n policy at (A$(, the (chool of Advanced $nternational (tudies at @ohns )opkins :niversity# /e will post the prolo ue of your book on our website# The book is +ust outI its called 1isions of 2reedom3 )avana, /ashin ton, Pretoria, and the (tru le for (outhern Africa, ,-456 ,--,, +ust published by :niversity of !orth Carolina Press# *o to democracynow#or to read that prolo ue# /hen we come back, well talk about Russia and ay and lesbian policy# (tay with us#