True

Position
Basics

NOTICE :
This presentation was given at the October
2007 Lunch N Learn at J&H Machine Tools
in Charlotte.
The presentation is meant to be viewed
with the narration and detailed
explanation of the presenter.

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Position
Basics

Understanding
True Position
Part 1 : Grasping the Basics

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1.000.01
2.000.01

The Part

Position
Basics

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1.99

Position
Basics
2.01
1.01
0.99

1.000.01
2.000.01

The Tolerances

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Position
Basics
1.01

Part 1
Center

Part 2
Center

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1.99

The Tolerance Zone

2.01

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Position
Basics
1.01

Part 1
Center

Part 2
Center

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1.99

2.01

The Question Which Part is Better?

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Position
Basics
1.01

Part 1
Center
0.99
1.99

2.01

Part 1 is within the tolerance

zone, but

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Position
Basics
1.01

Part 2
Center

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1.99

2.01

Part 2 is closer to the Nominal Center and

will assemble easier than Part 1

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Position
Basics

How can we set up a tolerance

band that fairly and functionally
judges the position of features?

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1.99

Position
Basics
2.01
1.01

Part 2
Center

Part 1
Center
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Use a Circle instead of a Square!

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Position
Basics

Definition Time!!!
The result of a True Position
Characteristic is the diameter of a circle,
centered on the basic dimensions from
the specified datums, that contains the
actual center point.

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Position
Basics

Mathematically Speaking.
True Position =

X2 + Y2

*2
X = Difference from Basic X value from Actual
X value
Y = Difference from Basic Y value from Actual

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True
Position
No
Tolerances

Position
Basics
Diametral
Toleranc
Zone
e
0.01 A B C
Primary,
Secondary,
Tertiary
Datums

1.00
2.00

B
C

New Part Print w/True Position

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Position
Basics

0.01 A B C
A

1.00
2.00

B
C

Heres an Example Calculation

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Position
Basics

0.01 A B C
A

Actual
Measureme
nts:

1.00

X=2.003
2.00

B
C

CAN WE SHIP IT?

Y=1.004

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Actual X = 2.003
Basic X=2.000

Position
Basics

Actual Y=1.004
Basic Y=1.000

X = 0.003

Y = 0.004

TP =

0.0032+0.0042

TP =

0.009+0.016 * 2

TP =

0.025

TP =

.005 * 2

*2

*2
or

so..

or

or

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Position
Basics

0.003

Nominal Center
at X=2, Y=1
from Basic

0.004

True Position
Result =
0.010

0.
00
5

True Position =
0.010

Hole Center
0.005 from
Nominal

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Position
Basics

0.01 A B C
Our True
Position is
within the
Specification
.

1.00
2.00

B
C

CAN
YES,WE
WESHIP
CAN!

Barely!

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Position
Basics

Lets do this very

example in Calypso
and see if the math
works out!

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Position
Basics

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Position
Basics

This is a
Theoretical
feature with X Y
coordinates
placed exactly at
2.003 and 1.004.

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It

Wo
rk

s!

Position
Basics

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Position
Basics

0.01 A B C
A

1.00
2.00

B
C

Same Print, this time a Real Part

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Position
Basics

On a Real Part:
X= 1.9619
Y= 1.0081

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Position
Basics

Actual X = 1.9619
1.0081
Basic X = 2.000
X = -0.0381

Actual Y =
Basic Y = 1.000
Y = 0.0081

TP =

-0.03812+0.00812

TP =

0.0015+0.0001 * 2

TP =
TP =

0.0016 * 2
.0390 * 2

or

so..

*2
or

or

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Position
Basics

Hole Center
0.0390 from
Nominal

0.0081

True Position =
0.0779

Nominal Center
at X=2, Y=1
from Basic

0.03
90

0.0381

True Position
Result =
0.0779

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Wh

at
??
?

Position
Basics

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Position
Basics

Explanation Time!!!
The GD&T standard specifies
that the FUNCTIONAL center be
used for calculations. This
means for a hole, that the
Maximum Inscribed fit be used.
Calypso does this
automatically!

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Position
Basics

Lets see how this

changes things.

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Position
Basics

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Watch out
for Outliers!

Position
Basics

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Position
Basics

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Position
Basics

Now that we
have that sorted
out,
ONE MORE TIME!
X= 1.9504
Y= 1.0104

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Position
Basics

Actual X = 1.9504
1.0104
Basic X = 2.000
X = -0.0496

Actual Y =
Basic Y = 1.000
Y = 0.0104

TP =

-0.04962+0.01042

TP =

0.0025+0.0001 * 2

TP =
TP =

0.0026 * 2
.0507 * 2

or

so..

*2
or

or

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Position
Basics

Hole Center
0.0507 from
Nominal

0.0104

True Position =
0.1014

Nominal Center
at X=2, Y=1
from Basic

0.05
07

0.0496

True Position
Result =
0.1014

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YE
S

!!!

Position
Basics

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Position
Basics

ONE MORE THING..

You might
say :
So if True Position only gives me distance from
center, how do I know how to make my offsets?

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Turn on Additional Position

Result in the Characteristic
Settings Editor.

Position
Basics

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Position
Basics

Youve got Questions, We have answers.

Understanding
True Position
Part 1 : Grasping the Basics