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Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

To
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From :
Re
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Date :

Professional Coworkers, Male and Female


BlueRibbon
Older Guys and Younger Women: my routine for slamming the issue that Im 55
and shes only 22 years old
May 2, 2005

So youre 55 years old and youve met a beautiful, 22 year old woman. You want to develop an exciting, passionate, vibrant sexual relationship with her. A predictable element of this story will be that at some point she
will raise the issue of age, as in I dont date old men, and youll have to deal with it. Or, get to deal with it.
Follow my guidance and your advanced age becomes a great advantage.
Not sure that you, as a man over 50, should even consider dating younger women? Is it a matter of ethics,
culture, or one of possibilities open to you? While the short answer is, an intelligent 60 year old who makes
a point of picking up basic gaming skills can easily date [meaning, enjoy mutual, enthusiastic sex with] women age 20-25, I expand on this unfamiliar notion for those in doubt in an appendix to this memo.
If you already believe that you are entitled to date any woman you want, even those so young or beautiful as
to be seen as out of your league by misinformed neighbors, then you can probably use some guidance on
how to get past objections to your age.
I have experimented with methods to make age a non-issue in pickup interactions and offer my experiences.
Ill assume that you have some minimal Game; that is, you understand basic seduction theory as espoused
on Fastseduction.com or by David DeAngelo, Mystery, Style and similar teachers. If, on the other hand, you
have no idea what Game is and this requirement is a mystery to you, then this memo will be premature. Get
game firstlearn the Science of Pickupand this memo will round out your education.

Notes on Age Limits: the Envelope


Age 55 is not the upper limit by any means. I am simply age 55 writing this. Indications are that everything
here will work just as well for a guy 78 years old so long as he remains intellectually active, sexually capable,
and either possess now, or determines to develop, the necessary pickup gaming skills to make a woman
attracted to him. If youre 78 years old, substitute in your mind 78 years old wherever I make reference to
a younger male reader and then write me about your experiences [field reports] so I can include them in
the next edition of this memo.
As an aside, I watched a 78 year old retired airline pilot run his habitual game, without seemingly noticing
that he was still doing it, routinely capturing the attention of women 19 to 22 years old. One pretty little grocery store clerk immediately asked
around to discover his name and then phoned, while I was visiting him, on the pretext that he had left pocket
change at the store and she wanted to return it to him! This shit works.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Getting Started
First steps remain unchanged. Ill assume you found, met, opened, transitioned, and have worked your attraction game to the point where the target (the pretty thing that just happens to be much younger than you) is
now interested in youbut she has begun to shit-test you on your age and you note this is where things are
likely to start coming apart. E.g., Ew. Old men are icky! may be right around the corner.
So. What do you do next?

Handle the Age Issue for Her Benefit and Yours


AA single woman in isolation is not the problem because if she is attracted to me, nothing else matters. It is
up to me to prosecute the contact in a way that I do not overstep her developing attraction for me, and that
I manage my behavior so that she feels safe where she needs to feel safe, threatened where she
wants to feel threatened (which relates to her need for exciting sex, and in no way suggests violence or meanness on my part), and that I remain high value, interesting, and non- needy. Standard attraction
material works well.1 I am cool and I can walk away. I am the Tao of Steve. If this is how our relationship
develops over the first few minutes and hours, then age is not likely to be an issue. As the clich goes, its a
matter of Mind over Matter: If she dont Mind then it dont Matter.
Next, the age issue arises quite predictably when gaming a 2-set or 3-set, and is invoked typically not by the
target (who is getting into me) but by one of her obstacles, who suddenly dislikes my presence because
she, too, was getting into me but now perceives that I am focused on her girlfriend such that (1) she loses the
prize, me, at the same time she is threatened with (2) losing her girlfriend, the target, to me and with it (3) the
good vibe she has been enjoying with her girlfriend. A 2-set is much more problematic than a 3-set or larger
because the loser-obstacle will be left lonely after the target seeks isolation with me.
I know that it will be the obstacle that will shit test me on age, and so I can expect the attack from her. Handle the obstacle and the interaction with your target will continue.

Statistical Norms
I acknowledge that not all girls in their twenties will respond to a man nearly 60 years old, but enough will
that it makes virtually no difference to my perceived outcome. If a third will never consider dating a
man my age, then a third will after a period of babysitting adjustment as they grow into the thought, and a
third will ignore the age thing altogether and go for it if their emotions tell them to. If youre a 60 year old man
(or even much older) and you have some adequate gaming skills, you will never have to sleep alone, or in the
alternative, never be without one or multiple girlfriends.

Attraction is a subject which could easily divert this memo by several hundred pages as it is a major topic worthy of majorbut separatestudy. How do you act, what do you say to get and keep her into you, after you have found her? If you already have Attraction
Theory down cold, congratulations; if not, and if this subject is a mystery to you, youll have to dedicate major study to learning it before
you continue. This memo, then, is not about how you gain attraction but a series of assurances that if your previouslky acquired skill at
gaining attraction is otherwise good, youll be able to pull it off quite easily with women much younger than you.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

The fact is that if a woman is in a headspace where she cant picture you as her lover, possibly because of
age, then that is her issue and not yours. She loses out on me, the best lover she ever might have had if
only she hadnt been so narrow, stupid, and unlucky. As an operational matter, I will open many but end
up prosecuting only those that turn into me and engage. Thus my approach and technique is entirely selfcorrecting.
The best I can do is preserve my status with the younger, stupid ones by leaving them with something like,
Pleasure for you to meet me and politely disengaging. With luck they will either see me later as pre-selected
by other women, often physically hotter than they were, and they may later change their minds and re-open
me. This business of keeping options open must be automatic, bearing in mind that it may pay off months
or years later. Some women just need some time to think about it. Im 55. Im patient. I have the time.

Prior Method of Dealing with the Age Issue: Methods I Dont Like
David DeAngelo, from his lofty perch of 33 years of age (!), suggested that when the girl asks for your age
your options are limited. He said this is how he handles it.
First, it is a shit test and one way of handling it is to ignore it or pretend you didnt hear the question. Shit
tests truly do not require that you pay attention to them. I dont like this approach because while this
technique works with neutral subject shit tests (on subjects other than age), not answering the age question
makes you look as though youre ashamed of being older. You lose.
Second, when she demands, How old are you anyway? you can fire back a dominant (and as they say, not
domineering) counter-question, How much do you weigh? While this is funny it tends to kill the good vibe
you were working on, plus it also sounds like youre hiding something. Worse, if she answers, 126 lbs! then
you
have to be ready to fire back your actual age, 64 years old! with equal or greater enthusiasm. Risky, and
in the best of circumstances a little too harsh. It does offer the advantage of making her jump through your
hoop before you jump through hers.
Third, others have suggested that if you look good you can lie, where the most common lied about age is
39. Yeah, right. As if shed believe that. Plus that would make me seem as though I had something to hide,
and that I am ashamed of my age as being somehow disqualifying. So while I have lied about my age on the
older side I have never lied on the young side, and never will. Weak.
Fourth, DeAngelo says he will look the girl straight in the eye and calmly answer, Old enough to know
not to answer THAT kind of question! Of course, in this delivery your vocal tonality is key. If the girl restates the question you have set up an argument which can do nothing but kill the vibe and make you look
weak. This has all the weaknesses of the other answers above, which means it is not an effective answer for
managing your game.
Fifth, it is always good policy before you answer any of her questions to consider whether she is shit testing
you with interview-type questions, or what Mystery called, Questions o Death. If these questions come

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

fairly early in your interaction, before she has started what feels like the melting into me phase of comfort
building (or into rapport, where the real game takes place), then the questions are certainly of the qualifying
frame type which you cannot allow to get started. So to prevent the feeling from taking root that she is
the interviewer and you are the interviewee, nip it in the bud by making her jump through one of your hoops
before you jump through hers.
Her: How old are you, anyway?
Me: Guess. If youre close, maybe Ill tell you.
Her : 37 [obviously guessing low]
Me: Wow! Thats SO amazing! NO. [humor]
With this routine, you can either game off the answer or tell her your age, your choice. But even this was
suboptimal as it did not deal with the shit test side of it, to demonstrate a natural alpha dominance
over the person who puts that shit test to you. Of all the conventional methods of dealing with the shit tested
age issue, this started out as the best.
Sixth is the direct approach my buddy suggests, which is to announce, Im FIFTY- SIX. Yeah, yeah, I know I
look younger than that and I LOVE THAT ABOUT MYSELF. The key is to be over-the-top self-confident, and
he says it reduces the shit-test to a footnote.

Pace of Rapport
The game is played in rapport. If you are an older guy you should plan on hovering longer in rapport. There
is a tricky balance to explain because on the one hand you dont want too move too quickly that a possible
gets scared away (and reports to her friends that that older guy tried something creepy on me), but you
need to keep the sense of escalation going so that she doesnt get bored or lose interest in you. Some
women are easy this way; others, their comfort and too fast curves never cross and there is no solution
set possible, in which case you politely excuse yourself to prosecute other contacts, use her as a pawn, or
LJBF her to gain access to her friends, or for future use as pivot.
I discovered that in successful game I was occasionally noting that rapport was going flat, and so would go
back into Mysterys A2 and DHV a little more. This is a consequence of women being generally attracted but
occasionally taking notice of age, and then compensating for that.
(If anyone sorts this out theoretically, or can offer some practical experience in this rapport
building phase, please let know so I can add it to this memo.)

BlueRibbons Age Routine: What You Came To Learn


Assume you have gamed a 2-set (FF) and things have been going pretty good. Both girls are laughing and
touching you and having a good time, and theres a good vibe going with both of them. You have decided

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

to focus on one, and get her to self-extract with you, so it is time to let this 2-set know or figure out who
the winner is and who the loser is. This is a tough time, and uncomfortable for all concerned, because the
girl who loses is not only losing you, the cool guy, but she is losing her girl friend and the cool vibe they had
going. The loser girl knows she will have to walk home alone, and will experience a humiliating deep funk.
While there are exceptions to this rule, most obstacle-loser girls do not like to be the loser.
I know that shortly after focusing on one girl, the targetwhich I try to do very subtly, but there is no subtlety
in lovethe obstacle is going to try to break us up by shit testing me, so that I will go away and she can
resume her vibe with the target girl. The best way to attack me without being obvious is to ask me my age. I
know this, and she knows this, so the only question is, Who gets to trigger the question?
Since I like to be in control of the interaction (and at this juncture I start thinking of it as being in control of the
combat), I want to be the one that controls exactly when she pops the age issue shit test. Properly done, she
will know, falsely but with very high confidence, that she thought of the shit test all by herself, with no input
from me at all,
and that it is all 100% her idea. All by herself she thinks up and executes this oh-so- clever attack. In reality, I
am pulling the trigger.2
To pull the trigger and get the obstacle to act, two things must occur. First, you must have switched your
focus to the target so that the target knows you find her sexy and that you see her as a potential sex partner.
Specifically, I have made my Juggler SOI [Statement of Intent] to the target. (I am also thinking at this point,
as part of my mind-set, so long as you play your cards right.) This requires the obstacle to note that she
is not the target or potential sex partner, and thus to feel a range of emotions centered first on alarm, then
disappointment, then anger, and then the worry of an impending humiliation and isolation that she desperately
wants to avoid.
Good. It was inevitable. And since it was inevitable we must accept this fact and deal with it, since we now
have locked in the coming age shit test. At this point we dont know exactly when, and the obstacle may not
have even thought of the disruptive shit test she will use, so we must seize control and make the age shit test
happen. In this way we deal with the obstacles shit test and the age issue in one fell swoop.
We trigger the age issue shit test by clearly mentioning something that is so outrageously historical, old, and
before their respective births that neither can ignore the fact you said it. It can be true or made up; it can be
reasonable or ridiculously long ago. So long as it was before their births they will not listen to the actual fact
but be occupiedeven overwhelmedwith the idea of you being older than their grandfathers!

If this principle of I pull the trigger on her assault sounds like martial arts, it is. In the successful stand-up fight, your adversary
should feel as though he has decided what technique to throw when in fact I have manipulated his weight, foot position, and the
apparent targets available on me so that that thought is the only one that can occur to him. As in the seduction or social arts, this
further ensures that that technique he then throws, but which I have designed for him, will completely fail him. And the fact it feels
as though I have been pulling his strings during a dangerous and stressful event (for him, anyway) gives me a certain intellectual
satisfaction that is hard to describe.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Examples:
But you see that was when I was a child, before electricity was invented.
That reminds me of when I served with General Washington during the American Revolutionary
War a cold and difficult time.
You have it easy! When I went to college there were no cars. There were trains, sure, but they
were big smoky, cumbersome affairs. So I much prefer the silent gliding along in traffic of the
Mercedes Benz to that rude clattering from my youth.
Thats not true: I remember exactly where I was, how I felt, when I heard that President Kennedy
[or Garfield, or even Lincoln] had been shot!
All of these remarks are clearly gross exaggerations! I was born in 1950 and the world already had
computers, atomic bombs, jet aircraft, color movies, telephones, and sex toys. In retrospect you can bust on
them for their gullibility, but for now have faith that if you set up the obstacle correctly, your age issue shit test
is only milliseconds away:
Her : [Blurting out] How old are you, anyway?
But now you are ready for her!
You must respond without delay, but in a voice that is at least 20% slower than the girls voices, and with
great pride and volume in your voice. You must swell up your chest in an exaggerated power posture and
proudly announce:
You : Im SIXTY SEVEN years old!
This is not true, of course. You are much younger than this. At the time I came up with this idea I was 52
years old, decided on its possible efficacy only by eliminating everything else that was known not to work,
and ended up with this. To my real age I added the impossible figure of 15 years to make it 67.
In what type of voice do you announce this? Think of a 4 year old boy who has just learned to hold up 4
fingers when asked his age, and hear his response: I am FOUR years old! Use that attitude, tone, and
voice.
Why do they believe you? Lots of old lamers have lied about their age by saying they were younger than they
were and in so doing condemning themselves to losing. But no one has ever said something as improbable
as Im 67! and so they can accept it at face value. But what you are really saying by the tone of your voice
is, I am high value, and this is the highest value age any human could be!
This gambit is an exercise in frame control. If you are okay with something then the girl is going to be okay
with it, no matter how freaky or counter-intuitive the issue. Women are wired this way.3 Say it proudly and
you establish the frame that being 67 is something to be massively proud of, and she cannot object without

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

sounding petty, foolish, uninformed, and wrong.


The curious thing is what happens next: the girls will stare at you and do what I call the Female Control-AltDelete. They re-boot. You see, up until this point they held two irreconcilable beliefs. First, that they were
getting into me and seeing me as an exciting, valuable, current, and possibly available sex partner. Second,
that they did not fuck guys older than their grandfathers! The way they deal with this is to do what only can
be called a mental re-boot of their operating system. (As a man, I have never felt this but have only observed
it in women. It seems to be a case where emotions versus logic confront each other, and the emotion crushes
logics attempted interference with feeling good and is thus overridden.)
Heres what the Female Control-Alt-Delete, brain re-boot looks like: their stare goes blank, they blink hard
and very slowly, twice, and then after a few seconds (of what they describe as having to think about it) life
returns to their face, they smile, and they are happy again.
To me it seems as though the clean re-boot has left them with only the first belief, that they are into me, and
that the second obstructive belief has been banished like a bad virus.
But youre not through, yet. The obstacle has some more managing to be done. When they come back from
their re-boots, the obstacle will now say something, again, that she thinks she thought of and which seems
really original to her. Of course, we know it is coming so just smile like the alpha male you are and wait:
Her: Gee, you look pretty good for 67
It is appropriate to lightly punish her for shit testing you, while retaining your strength, dignity, and polite
demeanor. You will set her straight by slightly frowning, disapprovingly, and saying:
You: Excuse me but I look pretty good for ANY AGE.
If the obstacle only nods and seems properly cowed4 it is now time to pull her back into your circle a little by
adding this half-thought, which gives her something to hang onto:
You: Its good DNA

Frame control, where your comfort discussing something becomes her comfort, just as your discomfort signals her discomfort, too,
logic aside, is useful when later discussing sexual practices with which she might not yet be familiar, like anal sex. Remember: if youre
cool and comfortable and not freaked out by a subject, then she will also be cool and comfortable about that subject. But if you get all
freaky about something truly benign, like holding her hand, she will get freaky and reject your move.
On the other hand if the obstacle is not cowed and just continues an unrelenting barrage of snotty shit tests, you may have entered into
a Banter Battle during which you can still achieve ascendancy over her by being better at the battle than she is, and therefore a cooler
person than she is. This gives you a solid second chance at recovery and carrying the day with the target. See the appendix on Generic
Shit Test Methodology for guidance.
4

This suggests a natural, physical superiority on your part which is not a bad thing to add in itself. Plus you
are letting her off the hook by saying it in an upbeat manner. Both girls will nod as though approving of your
explanation, but in reality you have just initiated a shift into sex talk because of the way girls think.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Yes, I know that you know everything there is to know about DNA. Deoxy- ribonucleic acid. Watson-Crick
complementary pairs. The Double Helix. Adenine, guanine, cytosine, thymine. But she knows none of this,
because when it was taught in high school she wasnt really listening but doing her nails. So she can only
pretend to understand what you meant by saying Its good DNA
Except that she is a big fan of CSI: Miami and to her DNA in every episode means only one thing: semen.
Sex. Some guy cumming on or near the body. Samples. She drifts off and thinks about you cumming on
her, or in her. A pleasant, warm fantasy. So while you are offering a conciliatory explanation of why you look
so good for being 67, she is thinking about sex, semen, and getting horizontal with you.
You have reached an important juncture in the game: do you want to next her, because she is not really up to
your standards? To end the game you can let the interaction expire naturally. Or do you want to advance her
and shift the game to sex talk? 5
If you want to transition to sex talk, answer their unspoken question:
You: So what? Did you want a sample?
This pokes fun at their sexual state, setting and reinforcing the frame that they want you and makes it clear
that you understand them, can read that they are feeling sexual, and that you approve of them feeling sexual
towards you. The game is now clearly on.
They should laugh with that OMG Im feeling so sexual face they display, and if you like you can feign a
misunderstanding when you suddenly realize that they were thinking about SEX and pretend that you only
meant to offer them a hair plucked from your head (e.g., for a locket, to hold against your heart that you can
feel my strength and safety when you need it)!
You: OMG! I just realized, like, youre having impure thoughts! Ughh. Now I feel dirty, used. Like a mere sex
object for you to fantasize about. Oh, I need a shower. Or a beer. Go buy me a beer, stat!
A friend suggests his follow-on to the Its good DNA line: At least Im strengthening the gene pool. And
you? This is an expression of supreme self- confidence so it could fit in anywhere.
I can think of a dozen more ways to riff off this but the goal is to keep the discussion playful, light, humorous,
sexual, a little outrageous; and making certain they realize you approve of them chasing you.

The Alternative View: Fuck her anyway, even if shes not in MENSA.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Supportive Technique to Reinforce Frame if Interaction Begins to Stale Out


There are times when the interaction is going as well as can be expected, but it seems that she is becoming,
well, distracted. It might be that for her this is the first time she has been with a man whose very existence
proposes a new experiencethat of age and sexual experience where she feels out of her depth, unskilled,
not up to the task, or even amateurish. How to bring her back?
You: Look, I know youre getting into me
Her:Whaaa ?
You: Yeah youre into me, its obvious Touching my arm, laughing at my jokes, doing that hair thing
youre into me.
Her: Oh, yeah, right. or I am not that into you or blah,
blah, blah.
You: I get this all the time, so its alright but Ive got to tell you, youre not doing that good with me right
now so if you want to have any chance of taking me home later on? Well, youd better start getting your
act together.
You: So lets make a good start on that tell you what, go get me a beer (or order me a glass of wine) and
well talk about it
You: [Gesturing with your hand] Come on. Lets go. Go
As silly as this seems, it is funny, establishes you as the dominant party, sets the proper frame, and most
important tells the girl exactly what simple task she has to perform in order to seal the deal with you. Plus, it
is sufficiently innocuous that she can do it in front of friends without leaking to them her attraction to you.

Addendum: Re-frame Her Age as Older, in Woman Years


Sometimes a full-on response isnt necessary, as when a woman pops the statement, Youre WAAAY
too old for me, by the way, at the last minute, or sometimes right in the middle of an interaction.
You must divine what she really means by this before responding, although your response must be immediate.
Is it a shit test, where shes nasty? If so, you can say something in the strongly re-framing category such as:
You: Its alright. I know youre feeling insecure. But as long as you stay close to me, and I approve of you,
and you continue to be seen as being in my favor youll feel stronger.
You: Whoa. I know youre attracted to me no, dont try to hide it, its obvious laughing at my jokes, the
sexy eye contact its obvious but blurting out a Tourettes thing isnt the smoothest way to announce it.

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If she had been in pretty good rapport with you and this sudden objection is a little surprising coming from
her, assume she is impliedly asking the question, You wont embarrass me in front of my friends, because
they wont understand how cool you are, will you? In this case, give her a discrete knowing smile that
transmits, Yeah, I own you, dont I, princess? and consider extracting her for game continuation in a less
intrusive environment; basically, away from here.
My favorite method of dealing with this question, assuming she is testing out of her own insecurity, is to point
out that adjusting for woman years you are actually much younger than she! When she blurts out something
off-topic, like
Her : Youre waaaay too old for me
you look calmly at her and let a few seconds of silence build before you answer,
You: Weeelllll that was random. Was that a Tourettes thing? But of course, in woman years we both
know youre actually much older than I am
As an aside, young women have a personal desirability horizon which extends just 2 years from their current
age. That is, an 18 year old girl believes that while she now has an excellent body, in just 2 years shell
exhaust that limited commodity of her youth and be reduced to one of the haggard old 20 year olds she sees
hanging around the campus. If she is 20 she believes she has achieved an attractive balance of body, beauty,
and personalitybut in just 2 short years those qualities will have completely played themselves out and she
will be left, bereft of all that men find desirable, just as with all those 22 year old girls hanging out in the office
cafeteria. And so forth. Twenty-eight year old girls feel they can hold it together a little while longer, given
their new, aggressive, and sexual personae but in just 2 short years they face the impending horror of that
slouching senility that represents their future 30 year old self! Thus, the woman years defense strikes deeper
and instantaneously more emotionally than any man could ever understand. Use it carefully.

Distraction Issue: Her So-Called Preferences, vs Attraction


Attraction isnt a choice says David DeAngelo. If a girl does not feel attraction for a man then no amount
of appeal to her logical brain will make her feel that overwhelming desire to be with him. But in the opposite
case, where she does feel attraction, no logical appeal to the contrarythat he will be bad for her, that he is
from the wrong side of the tracks and so forthcan prevent her from acting on that attraction.
Our goal is to generate attraction by discovering and acknowledging the womans emotional needs, including
for sex [with you] and excitement, while not acting in a needy or creepy way.
Unfortunately, women will often interpose at first, before they have been given the opportunity to feel
attraction for us, that we do not meet their preferences qualifications. Generally this is stated as some
variation of tall, dark and handsome. Youre not my type. But the cool thing is that while women sincerely
believe that their preferences are a powerful determinant they end up having virtually no influence as they
yield to the excitement of their biological attraction mechanism!

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

11

How do you handle it? Well, treat statements of their preferences as the shit tests they are. Cute, but a little
annoying. Then keep doing attraction material until she is giggling that shes never met a man like you before
and all that nonsense of preferences is once again set aside in favor of her attraction for you.

Escalation: Getting Her to Kiss You


You need to escalate and kissing is on your agenda. You are still carefully calibrating the situation and taking
things at a slightly slower pace, but let us assume you calculate that she is ready and needs kissing to keep
the interaction from going stale. Youre right about this, of course. Time to kiss. So how do you go about it?
One simple technique is to start by giving her the Hug Test, which works when you starting getting Indicators
of Interest [IOIs] soon after meeting her and where the playfulness factor is moderate to high.
This Hug Test routine is a great way to begin getting physical with a woman while showing personality and
sub-communicating that you are screening for particular qualities in the women you date. It also implies
that you and her are having a flirtatious, as opposed to platonic, conversation, which can help you avoid the
friend zone.
Okay. Weve been talking for five minutes, and I want to be sure Im not wasting my time. Hug test.
(She responds.) Blah, blah, blah blah.
I have to see if you can hug worth a damn, otherwise I have to stick you in the friend zone. So you better give
it your all.
When you hug her she always gets a B minus. If she is annoyed with the substandard rating, tell her do to it
again; shell almost always give an amazing hug, for which you can give her a reluctant A.
Its just a couple of sentences and seems innocuous on the surface, but like all good routines, its quite
powerful. It gets you touching. It gets you leading. It gets her trying to live up to your standards. It
establishes a romantic/flirtatious vibe instead of a friend situation. All in a couple of sentences, doing
something silly that wont trigger any alarm bells. 6
There may be times when the Hug Test doesnt really fit, in which case you can start with various Hands
Tests. Her hand will never lie about her interest in you and there are at least two ways to get there. First,
you want to be touching her arm right from the beginning. It should go without saying that youre not pawing
at her and it should appear natural. If you do it to everyone, women youre interested in as well as not, and
frequently men as well, then you have an idea of the natural touch.

See Mystery Method - The Routines Book (2007).pdf and Love Systems Magic Bullets.pdf for hundreds of more great routines to

use as icebreakers and to accelerate your game.

The goal is to continually escalate the touch until your hand reaches down and touches her open hand. What

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kind of response did you get? If she jerks away, she is simply not ready yet. Move back up the arm, do some
more natural touching, and try again in :05 minutes. If youre getting some attraction signals, some IOIs from
her, then shell probably be aware of her earlier reaction and be looking forward to a warmer one the next
time.
The best reaction is where she lightly squeezes your hand, or either interlocks her fingers with yours or allows
you to do this momentarily. But only momentarily! Do not give her enough time for her defenses to creep in,
and then you must separate your hands after a short while so that she feels good about the physical contact
but is left wanting more. You can repeat the hands test in a few seconds.
If she allows your hands to touch and stay there but is otherwise neutral, you have some more work in
attraction to do. As before, attract then wash, rinse, repeat until you get the response youre looking for.
One advantage of the hands test is that unlike kissing, she can lightly contact and then hold your hand
concealed from the view of her friends, whom she is not sure will judge you as highly as she feels for you at
that moment. Simply pull her hand behind you, then hold it for a moment. One method for getting there is to
High Five her lightly at shoulder height, then at the moment of contact take her hand and while holding it,
pull it down so your arm is around her and your hands are holding each other in the small of her back, out of
sight of her friends and a secret the two of you share for the moment.
Remember: the hands never lie. If she is getting into you, she will want to explore hand touching and her
eagerness signals that you are ready to move on.
Second, there is Mysterys subtext method of hands testing which works great but requires a little more
speaking skill, stage presence, and self-control. Since these are all qualities an older guy should be DHVing
to the target woman, this should not be considered a negative.
When talking about some subject, since youll be carrying the wood 90% in this conversation, simply hold
your hands out in front of you palms up. Make sure that your words and this action are entirely unrelated: it
should look as though your hands appeared in front of you all by themselves.
This is an implicit invitation to the girl to do something, which is to place her hands in yours palm down, or
palm-to-palm. If she does, then that is a strong IOI. Squeeze her hands lightly for a second, then lightly
throw them down as though dropping them. This gets you the best of both words: she has the experience
of touch, and she is left wanting more.
If she holds her hands out in front of her, not touching yours but palm up, mirroring your postureshe is not
yet into you at all but being polite. Amp it up or eject. If she interrupts you and asks, What are you doing
with your hands?! be prepared to treat it as a mildly rude interruption, and say, What? Oh this? Thats all
subtext. NowI was saying and finish your conversational distraction thread. She may still reach out and
take your hands, and in so doing, mission accomplished.
So youre successful at your hands test? Good. Press on with the escalation to get her to kiss you.
One major difference between the young man and the older man at this juncture is that the older man can

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

13

anticipate one response that younger men rarely get. If using Mysterys kiss routine, which is to ask her, Oh.
Did you want to kiss me?, younger men can expect one of three answers.
One, she can say Yes in which case you just lean in and kiss her. Go slowly, and make the feeling one
where she is a deliberate part of the kiss, a cooperative kiss, but do not delay. Go for it.
Two, she can say anything to indicate that shes not sure but if the answer isnt no you say, Lets find out
and lean in and kiss her anyway.
Three, she might say no, in which case you say, I didnt say you could. You just looked as if you wanted to
be kissed. Then you keep gaming for another :05 minutes, repeat the question, and this time she will give
you one of the first two answers.
Older men can also get a fourth response which is, Not here. This is good and essentially a yes, but she
is telling you that she is uncomfortable kissing you in front of her friends.
Calibrate. You can say, I understand, and let the moment pass because she has given you a calculated
answer that is a yes but says she wants discretion. The next obvious idea is to take her hand and say, Come
with me, and lead her into a more private area and kiss her there. It is not weak to do the first and most often
that is the probability move.
Neil Strauss as Style created the famous Evolution Phase Shift, as he wrote in this article inserted below:

Evolution Phase Shift


by Style
1. I tell her that she smells good and ask what she is wearing. Then I lean in, brush her hair
aside, and sniff her slowly, moving up from the shoulder to the ear. Mmmm, that smells good.
People dont pay enough attention to smell. But youll notice how animals, before they mate, will
always smell each other. Evolution has hard-wired us to respond to certain things. You are wired
to respond when someone smells you.
2. Its like when someone pulls the back of your hair. Youll notice how lions, when they mate,
always bite and tug at the end of each others mane, right here. (Since Im shaved bald, Ill add
here, This is what I miss the most about not having hair; if you have hair, say, This is one of my
favorite things.) Then I run my hand up the back of her neck and grab a fistful of hair at the roots
and pull it, downwards. She says mmmm... And I say see.
3. Then I talk about how no one knows this, but the most sensitive places on the body are
places that are usually hidden from contact with the air, like the back of the elbow (touching it)
and knee (touching it). Any place where your body bends, twists, or folds, there are millions of
sensitive little nerve endings that release endorphins. Then I take her arm, bend it a little, and
erotically bite the area on the opposite side of the elbow (that crease where it bends). She usually
gets the chills, and I have her ratify how good it feels.

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[NOTE FOR THE LESS EXPERIENCED: If you dont know how to erotically bite a girl, learn before
you do this. You want to take a big chunk of skinnot a little pinch!and slowly and firmly slide
your teeth together until they meet and release the skin. You may want to practice on your own
elbow first ]
4. After, I say, But do you know what the best thing in the world is? ... A bite ... right ... here.
And I point to the side of my neck. (Every now and then, Ill add, that this has to do with the
fact that it is where the jugular vein is most exposed, and since most sexual fantasies have to
do with submission and vulnerability, it sends all the fantasy signals flying.) Then Ill expose my
neck and say, Bite me right here as if I EXPECT her to do it. Fifty percent of the time she will. If
she doesnt, I just turn away calmly (punish), wait a few seconds, and then turn back and repeat,
Bite me right here. Usually here she will.
5. Half the time, her bite is lame. If so, I correct her and say, Thats not how you bite. Come
here. Then I give her a good bite on the neck and instruct her to try again. This time, she
ALWAYS does a great job.
6. Now you look her in the eye, smile mischievously/approvingly, and say, very slowly, not
bad. Then glance down at her mouth, back up at her eyes (i.e., triangular gazing), and ... yes
... finally ... you ... may ... if you want ... and if shes ready ... um ... kiss!
Style

Kiss Trap: A False End Game


There is a trap with kissing and that is for many women kissing is their entire end game. If they can get the
stimulation from the kissing, especially if it is in front of their friends and lends them your status as though she
has conquered you, then she may have had enough. In this case she may recuse herself with some excuse
about using the ladies room, and when she returns she may flip a remark at you about how nice it was to
meet you and shes going back with her friends and maybe shell she you here later on. Shes blowing you off.
The correction is to limit the kiss. First you kiss her for a second or two, then push her away and tell her that
shes bad, then pull her in and kiss her again, then push her away again and tell her shes still bad, smile,
and say, This is moving pretty fast. Lets get back to your friends and you can get back to work on making
me feel comfortable again. Or after a second or two, say, Thats all you get. Funny, and a creative sexual
tension builder.
If you get a sassy No that you believe is really a playful yes, but one challenging you to
demonstrate a caveman skill and go for it to express dominance, go in and kiss her for 1 second before
pulling back and looking pretend-shocked, and say, Youre right. This is where you are likely to get a punch
in the arma good thingif you calibrated the situation right.
This may seem counter-intuitive, but if you interrupt the kiss after a few seconds you prevent it from becoming
the culminating experience of your interaction. Furthermore, you teach her that you are capable of restraint

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

15

and it builds her sense of security around you ... and by putting things off slightly you build more sexual
tension.
The seduction has more elements to complete which are beyond the scope of this
memo, but once youre this far the fact that you are older is essentially irrelevant.

First Sex: Survive the Mission


I have a serious bias about sex partners and that is that first sex is always bad sex, and that the best sex only
comes from cultivating a longer term sexual relationship with someone whose character and interests match
your own.7 Call it love, if you like. First sex is any sex you have before the sexual relationship starts; and I
believe the sexual relationship starts generally on the third or fourth sexual seduction. Until that time,
youll notice that you have to repeat the seduction-to-sex ritual in its entirety, if not at quite the same pace or
intensity.
Bad sex? Yes, absolutely. First sex is always awkward if for nothing else than the elbows problem. You
dont know how each other moves, their sense of natural grace, and more than once I have taken a small
womans elbows right to the chops. One gave me a serious black eyeaccidentally of course, and she was
horrified at what she had done, but my friends found it amusing that a woman with no martial arts experience,
half my size, could get past my defenses and clock me good. All she had wanted was to flip herself over so
I could fuck her from behind and that sailing elbow found my face because we werent yet familiar with each
other.
First sex has other awkward moments, of course. She has to watch her elbows and yours but she wonders
whether she is pretty enough, and what you want her to do? What can she ask for? First sex doesnt give
her much guidance or comfort, and her overall experience (nominally described as her orgasm or orgasms) is
suboptimal. On a ten scale, figure that in first sex she can hit a two. Maybe. (Yeah, its that bad.)
Your goal in first sex is simply to survive the mission. Plan the mission, execute the mission, survive the
missionand you can sort out the details later. Of course you will inadvertently have great fun but the
pleasure will be in making a new sexual friend and not in the intensity, frequency, duration, and variety of the
sex you have during the first few sessions.
This is a mindset, that you can properly plan the longer term sexual relationship, for your benefit and hers.

7 My friend, Jeff, whose skill as a natural is undisputed, strongly buy ever-so-politely disagrees with this premise. In his world the best
sex is passionate and with someone just recently met. Hard to disagree with this guy, hes so good.

Incidentally, I had a girl shit test me after first sex by saying, Well, that was a let down! I interpreted this as
an expression of her fear, that she thought she hadnt been good enough for me and that I would therefore

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dump her and not call again. I responded by taking her to dinner (at a modest place for food, not for
celebration) where I made certain the discussion topic was narrowly focused on the following Principles
to Teach the Girls, and To Live By paragraph, infra; and it worked to perfection, and she became a happy,
willing, love struck porn star sex slave who said every time we met, I thank God every day that He brought
you to meI dont know where Id be or what Id feel without you.
This is a mindset, that you can properly plan the longer term sexual relationship, for your benefit and hers.
Incidentally, I had a girl shit test me after first sex by saying, Well, that was a let down! I interpreted this as
an expression of her fear, that she thought she hadnt been good enough for me and that I would therefore
dump her and not call again. I responded by taking her to dinner (at a modest place for food, not for
celebration) where I made certain the discussion topic was narrowly focused on the following Principles
to Teach the Girls, and To Live By paragraph, infra; and it worked to perfection, and she became a happy,
willing, love struck porn star sex slave who said every time we met, I thank God every day that He brought
you to meI dont know where Id be or what Id feel without you.

Follow-on Sex: Make it Worth Her While


Older men have tremendous biological advantages over younger guys. Imagine the goal is a 25 year old
bikini model and you are a 65 year old guy, 56 tall and 220 lbs, balding or bald, who gets some exercise but
hasnt officially hit the gym for 20 years. Youre cool, you have worked on developing your game, and
you follow good grooming habits. Compare this to a 28 year old guy, basically gorgeous build at 62 tall
and 180 lbs of solid muscle he works on every day at the gym. Got that in mind? Good. You as the older guy
can kick the shit out of the younger competition by rocking this girls world in a way the kid cannot.
First, embrace the principles at the bottom of this memo. This isnt about high school sex; its about
managing the relationship to rock her world, and teach her to rock yours. Second, if you havent heard of the
One Hour Orgasm, find the material from the San Francisco group called The Welcomed Consensus and
make it part of your own.
Third, find the material from David Shade (Give Women Wild Screaming Orgasms.pdf) and Steve Picuss
(aka Hypnotica, who teaches the use of hypnosis to send, and keep, women over that wild, crazy sexual
edge) and do the same thing with that material.

The Rle of Alcohol in the Sexual Relationship


Are you there to drink, or are you there to successfully pick up a beautiful, intelligent, talented woman to a
successful sexual first close, and thence to a successful, high intensity longer term relationship?
Alcohol reduces the one advantage you have, which is your cool demeanor and intellect. Why would you
give up even a small percentage of your attractiveness for the privilege of drinking? If the girl asks what you
are drinking simply state I dont drink with no apology or weakness, setting the frame that your response
is the coolest, strongest possible. Sometimes it is just as easy to say club soda with lime and let the issue
drop.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

17

If you need alcohol to calm your nerves, or give you courage, or make you relaxed enough to approach and
game women, you are making a huge mistake. The remedy is not to drink but to work on your game and then
stay alcohol-free during the interaction.
There are times when the interaction is going well and refusing a drink could be seen as socially inept,
such as a glass of wine over lunch with a girl whose progress has been regular and the outcome seems
comfortably secure. Sure, go ahead and drink a glass, but be aware of the principle and maintain 100%
control over your game and the outcome by not letting the alcohol go to your head.
What about her? Isnt it better if she is drinking, so she loses her inhibitions and comes to you more easily, or
faster?
No, not in my opinion. Alcohol lends nothing to the equation I find remotely helpful. She has to stay 100%
conscious in order to appreciate what I have to offer, which is the experience of being with me. Worse, if she
does sleep with youand the next day has buyers remorse and self-justifies her sleeping with you as you
having taken advantage of herthe fact she was seen as drunk or even just happy could fuel witnesses
recollections that perhaps you did take advantage of her. If alcohol was involved and you brought a drink to
her, it even raises the spectre of you having drugged her with a roofie.
This is more than a hypothetical. An acquaintance picked up a girl at a night spot and the evening went well,
so well in fact that she took him home and had sex with him. He didnt think much of it as she seemed to be a
party girl, and there wasnt much prospect of a long term relationship in that tryst, so he forgot about it.
Forgot about it, that is, until the police knocked at his door, asked and confirmed his identity, then arrested
him for the rape she had sworn had taken place. Sure she was a nut case, but that wasnt apparent to the
guy at the time. (Think Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction.) The witnesses his attorney found all corroborated his
story and the case was dismissed but not before he lost 20 lbs, 6 months of his life to depression, and
$10,000 in attorneys fees. In my opinion, alcohol can be very bad. Avoid it when
gaming. Stay focused: dont drink.

To all my friends, good luck and good hunting!

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Appendix A Old Men With Young Women: An Ethics Issue?


In teaching friends to connect with younger, beautiful women I encountered the attitudes that there is
something just not right about a 50 year old man picking up and enjoying the company of a much younger
woman. They accepted that the women entered these relationships willingly but usually disparaged the girls
motives. Those young women are with him for his money or travel or car, or some other variation which
shifts the focus to a thing rather than the cool man behind it. Their objections were fragile and quickly broke
down under any sort of analysis (i.e., you can and should date the woman without bringing money into the
issue by doing very cool, but not excessively expensive things), but were initially powerful, emotional barriers
to considering the issue. I believe they were propagandized into accepting less than what they deserved, and
I aim to correct that.
As to objections we start with the cultural. In American and other Western societies (except Italy
and Brazil, it would seem), the church, state, and Oprah Winfreys viewership have persuaded us that it
is a mans duty to tie himself to one woman of approximately his own age. If this occurs by virtue of a long
and successful marriage then I am all in favor of it: two 80-year olds, still active and into each other, have to
be a beautiful thing.
The rub occurs with a single man, 50-60 years old. Our society abhors the thought that he might find comfort
and enjoyment in the arms [or bed] of a 20 year old girl because this essentially relegates women his own
age to ancillary roles. When older women, 50 years and up, are forced to compete with 23 year old HB10+s,
it is clear these older women will rarely if ever prevail and their lifelong strategies are thereby constrained.
Society cannot tolerate this age-based unfairness! So it defines the relationship of older men, younger
women as immature or unethical. (It is also terrifying to women that the remaining best strategy, as I
hinted above, is to take care of their first husband and not divorce him; make their first one count and they
have exploited their one advantage over the younger women: the Home Court Advantage.)
When a single 50-60 year old man becomes known, he is often set up on dates. Do you know who he is
set up with? Most often fat, old women of his own age and with little or no resources or professional skills to
bring to the relationship. Her sole qualification is that they look good together to outsiders, and that theyll
each have someone to grow old with. Never mind that she is sexually unsatisfying to him or reduces his
quality of life. And never mind that several or perhaps even most of the women that he is set up with claim to
be his age but in actuality are 10 years older. (Isnt that a pretty picture!) It is as though our society demands
that every healthy, successful man has an obligation to identify one parasitic femalethat is, she brings little
to the equation except taking herself off the rolls of old, single womenand agree to split his assets and time
with her whether she is deserving or not.
The amazing thing is that American men are so propagandized, starting in our childhood by our mothers and
continuing on with unrelenting fury throughout our entire lives, that they embrace this duty as an ethical one.
How many men do you know that divorced, met a woman approximately their own age (through friends)
shortly thereafter, and then seemed hurriedly rushed to the altar for a replacement marriage?
My belief is that all men should identify what they want in life and then go after it. If women your same age
appeal to you, then do it! But if younger women appeal to you, then apologize to no one for who you are or
what you want in life and let your chase begin!

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

19

This belief is expressed in another way when women (and Hollywood movie writers) say that all men should
date within their leaguewhatever THAT means. But when we hear the objection that that woman is out
of your league, we understand that society is telling us you do not fit our societal model of who should
be dating whom, because if this rend in the universe is allowed then there will be no men left for the old,
parasitic females who comprise Oprah Winfreys viewership. My view is: ALL WOMEN ARE IN YOUR
LEAGUE. More important, there is NO WOMAN that is out of your league.
Riding on the coattails of that cultural assumption is the belief by many older men that young women will have
no interest in them. Nonsense! The game is different but the joy open for you to discover is that younger
women are dying to find a cool older guy. You know things the young guys dont. And it isnt about lavishing
money or travel or high living on them; its about having a better emotional and sexual life for their time with
you.
I recall having dinner with workmates, where a pretty 21 year old girl was desperately trying to gain the
attention of a 55 year old guy. She tried everything, even down to unbuttoning the top two buttons of her top,
then leaning forward (so he could examine her tits) while twisting and contorting her body so as to appear
to be checking the door for a friend when her real purpose was to give him permission to look while she
was conspicuously looking away. He still didnt take the bait and look and finally she left, frustrated and
crestfallen, for the ladies room.
I asked my buddy, Are you interested in her? and he answered, No, shes too young for me.
If by that he had meant, She is so young that she does not appeal to me then I would have agreed. It is his
right to determine what appeals to him and what I think or desire is of no matter. He should never be out to
conform to my expectations, as a high school boy might subject himself to peer pressure. A four hundred
pound Pacific Islander girl? If shes okay by him then I approve, too, not that my approval matters.
But what he meant was, I believe that she thinks that I am too old for her, as she
has already commented that her father is nearly 10 years younger than I am. When I
heard that I was dispirited. He had raised the barrier Shes out of my league. Nothing I could say in
the time allowed could convince him otherwise. She went home, upset and lonely to her bed and he went
home, ignorant and deprived of her wonderful company because of his having unwittingly embraced that
detestable cultural rule that all men should date within their own league. (Whatever that means.)
Ignore what others say. If young women appeal to you, and if youre willing to put in the time and effort to
gain the skill of dating and enjoying them, then JUST DO IT. The world will be a better place for it, and your
life will improve as well.
Note: my reference herein to 20 year old women and the like is not meant to impose a preference on my
male readers, but to set a lower boundary that the reader should feel free to raise in his own mind as he
reviews this memo. Substitute 30 year old or 40 year old as the expression if that makes this memo more
understandable to you, but be aware that young, beautiful women have no problem developing an interest in
men as old as their grandfathers, so long as that man practices good game.

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And by the way, even 20 year old women are not the lower limit since I have had interested 18 year old women
approach, open, and game me. The simple rule is that if the girl is age-legal, you can be 78 years old with
a healthy, strong game, and get her attracted and sexually pursuing you and To Hell with the opinions of
those lesser mortals in Lifes bleachers!
Age appropriateness has even made its way into Wikipedia. Note the pseudo- scientific tone of these experts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_disparity_in_sexual_relationships
A suggestion: read the article then celebrate by picking up, entrancing, and fucking the brains out of a
gorgeous, intelligent, sensitive, sweet 22 year old womanand make her your girlfriend, so long as she
promises to be a good girl for you.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

21

Appendix B A Simple NLP Television Pattern: Overcoming Cultural Resistance


A full discussion of Neuro Linguistic Programming [aka NLP] is beyond the scope of this little memo, but
there are occasions where a particular pattern (using NLP-speak) will help ease a girl into thinking that you
are a possible. It doesnt create attraction, but once attraction is to be had then this television pattern
recalled here as well as I can, although the original Ross Jeffriess version is likely superiorcan assist her
over the hump by providing an emotional logic for her to see herself with Exciting You, without interfering with
her relationship with her current boyfriend.
This pattern is an excellent lead-in to discussing the notion that to women, an infidelity with some men
doesnt count. That is, many women report that they have been 100% faithful to their boyfriends or
husbands even when it is clear that they have had sex with another man, because in the womans mind he
didnt count. If she takes to the discussionand in my experience, women usually dothen this sets you
up as the next guy that doesnt count so she can safely have sex with you without jeopardizing her main
relationship.
Specifically, in telling the television story below you imply that there is more than one channel on the
television, and that sometimes a well-lived life should try other channels to see whats there.
You: Do you have a television? Do you ever watch television?
Her: [Usually she says yeah, sure and you continue; but if she says no you can riff it over to radio or different
iPod MP3s. Or you can neg her with a joke comeback and ask querilessly, Do you have electricity?] Blah,
blah, blah.
You: So when you go home, you probably have a favorite television show. You walk in and turn it on, and
you dont so much watch as you rejoin your family, there on the screen. You know all of them, intimately, just
as they know you. Theyre your friends, and youll probably never give them up.
You: But some days you walk in and youre just in the mood for something new, something a little
different. Its not that youre mad at your old friends its just that youve SEEN that show before. Its a little
too familiar. Youre not going to feel that way forever, but for today you desire a little change.
You: So you pick up the channel changer and you begin to surf around. Surf around, that is, until you
come across a station thats a little more exciting, that fits your mood for today. The exciting, new ROGUE
station that maybe even your friend wouldnt approve of. But it appeals to you today, and you want to do
it.
[Note: by this point she definitely knows youre not talking in the abstract about television, but the words
strongly convey the fantasy of having sex with you. So know that, and go with that. By this point youre not
talking about the television any more.]
You: So you have already felt it, havent you? That Im that ROGUE television station, that rogue lover that
will take you places your regular boyfriend would never take you, and that you could never ask him to take

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you, because he might think you were a pervert and reject you.
You: Tomorrow youll return to your steady, reliable, regular boyfriend and hell be there, as always.
You: So its going to happen, you and me. So relax and enjoy being with me, so we can clear the air of all
this silly sexual tension you keep creating, and then we can get back to just hanging out, and feeling good.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

23

Appendix C - Stock Memorization Items for the Banter Battle


Sometimes a shit test really isnt a shit test so much as challenge flirting and is said in a playful, or at least
mock serious voice. In this case you have entered into the Banter Battle which is a flirty, funny series
of exchanges to establish who is dominant, cooler and more unflappable, and thus of higher value. The
loser of the banter battle may still remain a cool and desirable person but it is better to prepare with stock
languaging so you never come across as a tool when challenged.
Here are just some stock examples to give you the general idea.
When she teases you with a mock insult, say My moms told me worse. This isnt said in a self-deprecating
way but with the attitude of, Hey little girl, there is no way that you can hurt my feelings because Im that
strong.
Are you at least rich? Suggesting that if shes going to be a pain in the ass, that she should have at least
this redeeming value to you.
You look familiar. Have we had sex?
Whenever she touches or moves any of your stuff, Youre fucking up my Fung Shui!
If youre into Direct Game and she says, You just want to fuck me, answer laughingly (but otherwise serious
as it is not a joke), Girl, I will do you in every hole youve got! Another answer in the same vein is, Girl, you
couldnt handle me. Id fuck you twelve different wayssix of which you wouldnt even like! These answers
fit better when you sense her challenge had a negative edge to it, as a challenging shit test.
Did you come over here just to flirt with me?
Stop undressing me with your eyes!
Dont get your hopes up, Im not easy. Stop trying to impress me.
Are you always like this, or just with guys youre attracted to? If I wasnt gay youd be SO my type.
You better be getting back to your friends before they realize youre flirting with me, but before you go
a false time constraint you impose upon her when she came over to you or is separated from her group, just
before you run another routine or tell her a story.
You know, youre a pretty cool [good] [nice] girl, despite what everyone says about you.
Youre pretty cute for a tall [or short] girl. Clearly, your boyfriend isnt spanking you enough.
You think you can take me? I doubt it. I will tickle you until you pee your pants.
OMG!8 Saucer of milk, table two!, if shes acting really bitchy [catty].

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Youre looking at me the way a fat kid looks at a cheeseburger. This is a really great spot for me: Im really
well lit.
Youre getting me all emotional. I promised my friends I wouldnt go home with anyone tonight.
Something smells great in here. Oh wait, thats me.
You guys are trouble. or You guys are bad girls. Ill have to watch out for you.
Youre cool. You can help me pick up chicks.
Why are girls always so logical? Why cant they just feel and be in the moment like guys?
What kind of girls do you like? Stated calmly and directly, this seeks to elicit a bisexual response in addition
to being cocky-funny.
Are you drunk or are you usually like this? Is she always like this? Did you forget to take your
medication today?
Wed never get along, were too similar. Youd never take my shit and I wouldnt take yours. You know, wed
always fight. And I would always win. Youre like my little sister. Lovable, but annoying.
Youre bad. Youre making me think impure thoughts.
Okay, youre my new girlfriend. Oh wait! Can you cook? Youre such a dork.
Youre a Republican, arent you?
Youre a shy girl arent you? You guys gotta get her out more. You usually hang out at the library, dont
you?
Youre just so cute! Im going to take you home in my pocket and ask my roommates if I can keep you! Wait a
minute are you housebroken?
Dork! Im going to get you one of those little hats with a propeller on it.
When she drops or spills something, look a little exasperated and say,
See? This is why we cant have nice things or
Thats okay. You dont have to be nervous or

Obviously, OMG is an abbreviation for the exclamation, OH MY GOD!

Offer to get her a sippy cup, or ask the bartender if he has a sippy cup for her, and then say, Easy, tiger!

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

25

Now youre just talking while youre thinking of something to say.


If I wasnt gay we would have such beautiful children. Seriously, imagine how cute our children would be,
and you can continue if you like, Theyd have my good looks and well, all my personality, too.
Repeatedly ask her name, then nickname her Muffin. Other mildly deprecating names are Missy, Princess,
and Doris.
If she does something stupid say, Its a good thing youre pretty. Works best on 7s and 8s that arent that
pretty, though.
Challenge them to thumb-wars, and if you beat them say, OMG you SUCK at this but you can cook, right?
You have a strange resemblance to a friend of mine ... if you shaved your head you would look EXACTLY like
my friend Paul ...
You have a very unique dress sense ... I like that about you ... I can tell youre probably high maintenance.
My girl of my dreams must love kids, in fact I plan of having 14 of them (I pat her belly) yep ... a WHOLE
soccer team and well travel the world playing other countries, France, Germany ... Ill coach them and you
can be the manager... All the boys will be named Alex and all the girls will be named Alexandria (but choose
male and female takeoffs of your own name).
The interaction has gone well but she hasnt given you her name and it is time for you to do a Takeaway, so
here is a playful way of giving her a name. You remind me of a girl I used to travel around Australia with.
She was always doing these weird awkward things [making a reference to some awkwardness the target
displayed] but she was cool and adventurous so I really liked her. Her name was Elizabeth but we all called
her Berthaso Im just going to call you BERTHA.

The Mean Girl Shit Test


[Edit this in when I have the chance ]

Mini-Remarks, fired back when they fit:


Which one of you guys would win in a fight? Youre taking this way too seriously.
Stop flirting with me.
You couldnt handle me.
If that were true, you wouldnt [already] love me. You mustve driven your parents crazy.
Give me a kiss on the cheek and maybe Ill let you forgive me. Im too high maintenance for you.
What else do you like about me?

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Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Im so out of your league.


Lets play a game. Lets see how long you can hold your breath. Youre back to square one, missy.
Youre so outside the circle of trust.
Youre such a player.
Do your parents know where you are?
Isnt this a school night?
You girls arent tourists, are you?
Okaaay You really dont know what youre doing, do you?
Your ex-boyfriend sounds just like me. Im so emotionally unavailable right now. I think you might make a nice
friend.
We need to find you a man.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

27

Appendix D - Generic Shit Test Methodology


Tests come in many forms, and when she does something that might be a test you have to determine whether
she is being playful and with a good, flirty, cooperative attitude or possibly even showing appreciation to you
for flirting with her; or whether she is trying to show ownership and dominance over you. In the first case you
can either reward or ignore her, and in the second you must either push her away or rebuke her.
Examples of these ambiguous tests include:
Your game isnt strong enough. Im bored.
Buy me a drink and you can find out how good a kisser I am. Let me see your hat.
She starts grabbing you even before you have talked to her, or she starts making out with you, or she touches
your crotch.
Tests like these are often a way of the girl trying to show value relative to you, and one sure way to pass the
test is to raise her value even more, implicitly making you alpha to her for the ability to do this. For example:
Respect
Awesome! Point for you.
A more classic, counter-dominance response might be:
I dont know who your boyfriend is but he definitely isnt spanking you enough. (Response to
lightweight test.)
OMG, you totally shot me down! Thats awesome, I bet you do that all day. (To other person) Check this out,
this girl is AWESOME, you come up to make conversation and she blows you out of the water. (To girl) Wait,
do it again. Im gonna roll up on you, do exactly what you did before. (Response to harsh test.)
(Responding to the demand that you buy her a drink.) Buy you a drink? Is that the best pickup line you could
think of? I thought youd be more creative, or at least, less nervous, than that.
Generic counters:
Looks like someone put her crankypants on this morning.
God I LOVE THAT about me! (in answer to any accusation of being a man, a jerk, a dick, arrogant, etc.)
If she calls you a pussy, always re-frame it as Seriously, if you dont stop hitting on me, Im getting a
restraining order. Then to her friends, Is she always like this around good looking guys?

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Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Appendix E Swinggcats Doggy Routine. Modified by Zed


Lets pretend you are my dog
A role-playing scenario that is lots of fun to do with women is to ask them: if you were a dog, what kind of dog
would you be and why (this is a great follow up to the pug/beagle conversational opener)?
After they answer, I might say, I like that kind of dog. I might have to buy you from the pet store.
Then I will say with a suspicious look on my face, while turning my back on her, You dont pee on the floor ...
do you?
If they say no then I will grab their hands while pulling them in close to me and say, Good, then I am taking
you home with me.
Then I might look at her in the eyes, hold her hands but start to push her just a teensy bit away from me, and
say, Are you an adventurous doggy? Because if not I am going to take you to the pound.
If she says that she is, then I pull her even closer to me and say, good doggy (you might even want to pat
her on the head at this point).
Then I might hug her and tell her that she is such a cute doggy. Then I might say to her, you know why? She
will say, why. I might say, Because you remind me of Sam. She will ask, Who is Sam? I will respond by
telling her that Sam was the only dog that I ever loved, but he is dead now and since she is almost as cute as
Sam I am going to name her Number Two.
Then I might grab her really close to me as if I am going to kiss her, look in her eyes, and say: Eew ... you are
trying to kiss me and you are a K-9. No worries, I am going to get you a date on that new Internet dating
website for K-9s.
By playing this little make-believe game with her, I evoked emotions of her wanting my acceptance and
validation. Put in other words, through playing a make believe game, I was able to get her to chase me.
Very powerful, indeed! Now see the next Appendix F, Zeds Dog Groomer Routine as an alternative,
and more aggressive, variation.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

29

Appendix F Zeds Dog Groomer Routine


Me? Im a dog groomer!
This routine was devised to deal with some girl who starts asking too many job interview questions during
your interaction, the problem being that if you let her ask these questions the frame becomes that she is the
interviewer and you are the supplicant, and that she is qualifying you. That is, she is investigating whether
you are good enough to hang with her ... and if you let that frame prevail you are toast because no man
ever passes that test. The fact you let her test you in the first place clearly establishes in her mind
that you are lower value than she. It is a classic shit-test, however nicely phrased.
Bullshit on that. If anyone is doing the qualifying, it will be me.
Telling her that you are a dog groomer, and then cleverly making it stick through the application of a Dan
Akroydesque delivery, is also something of a neg. It tells her, I am not really attracted to you and will not
suck up to you, which tells her emotional operating system, wow, this guy is way higher value than me if he
isnt doing the AFC- bit and going ga-ga over me. It also has the advantage of letting her friends see that
you are cooler than she is, which in taking her down a peg from her Queen of Sheeba social position, endears
you to them. From that position of dominance, you have a chance. A really GOOD chance, if you play your
cards right. But this is a good transition to get you started.
The dog groomer introduction transitions into a qualifying routine devised by Swinggcat [see the foregoing
Appendix E discussion], where you ask the questions and she answers. Note that the questions follow a clear
push-pull [or IOI followed by IOD, if you prefer] methodology, which makes the whole thing work. And it is
funny and her friends will think youre cooler by the minute.
One quick thought: when you bring up dogs and later ask her, What kind of dog would you be?, she and her
friends will naturally assume that at some point you are going to refer to the sexual position, Doggy Style
but the routine scrupulously never goes there, and for good reason. The thought of Doggy Style will be
carried in their brains, waiting for you to drop the other shoe by bringing it up; and the longer you go without
mentioning it will make the tension build. Theyll keep wondering, So when is this guy going to say Doggy
Style? You get way more mileage from the concept of doggy style by not mentioning it than by doing the
obvious and using it, as an AFC would. Dont go there.
Her: So what do you do for a living?
You: [Matter of factly, quickly] Im a dog groomer.
Her: Whaaa ?
You: A DOG GROOMER. An Inter-NATIONAL dog groomer, and dont laugh: I make more money than
YOU. [Said with slight neg implied in voice.]
Her: Blah, blah, blah, etc.

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Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

You : I get paid, IN ADVANCE, first class expenses for travel and accommodations plus $200 per day
per diem, plus $2000 per day for the first 6 hours of working timeAND Im fully subscribed through next
March if you wanted and could afford an appointment.
Her: Blah, blah? Blah, blah, BLAH, blah?
You: It is a matter of talent, and artistic expression. I have it. Whether a Cardigan Welsh Corgi, Lhasa Apso,
Pomeranian, Giant Schnauzerit doesnt matter because these hands can find the AKC show winner buried
beneath the matted coat [looking at her hair, and seemingly distracted]say, what do they call your
hair style? The Waffle, isnt it? [Conspiratorially] You know, I could probably DO SOMETHING with oh,
nevermind!
You: As I was saying, its a matter of MALE STRENGTH, too, because you have to have strong hands to
command the respect of the larger breeds.
You: Here [holding out your hands for her to put hers in yours]. Let me see your hands. [Take them.] Now.
Squeeze. SQUEEZE THEM. Squeeze my hands as hard as you AAAGGH! [and throw her hands down, but
playfully].
You: You have prissy hands. No dog would ever respect you. Male dogs would try to MOUNT YOU. Have
you ever been MOUNTED BY A DOG? [Look at her suspiciously]
Her: NO! Blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah!
You: Hmmmm. I dont know about you [suspiciously, then brightly]
You: So! if you could be just one type of dog, what type of dog would
you be?
Her: Blah. A blah, blah dog.
You: [Hesitate as though reflecting on her answer, and then you seem to understand that she gave you a cool
choice after all.] A BLAH DOG? Awesome, good choice! In fact if you were a [Chihuahua] and I saw you at
the pound, Id take you home with me. Id put you in my pocket and walk out the door with you.
Her: Blah, blah, blah.
You: But wait a second. Are you house broken? Because if you PEE ALL OVER THE FLOOR Ill take you
straight back to your pound cage!
Her: ME? Pee on the floor? Blah, blah [energetic] BLAH!
You: Okay, cool! So you and I would go on great adventures together. Id teach you tricks and youd do them
for me, and wait a minute! [Suspiciously] You are an adventurous little doggie, arent you? Because in
order to hang with me you have to be ADVENTUROUS to share in AMAZING things with me.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

31

Her : [Some variation on Of course Im adventurous, which is a pre-set for later sexual attitudes, too!]
You : Come here. Let me check you out [and then slowly lean in, and deeply smell her neck]. See? If you were
my little puppy I would now know everything about you, by sense of smell. Whether you were afraid or
aroused either way, feeling fully dominated by me, the literal Alpha Dog.
You : So, cool [Stop as though considering carefully, then] Okay ILL KEEP YOU. But youre going to
be a good and obedient little doggie for me, arent you?
Then later on, and through the evening, you can occasionally reinforce the doggie frame by saying, Good
Girl! when she does something you approve of. You can pat her knee or head, or even her hand. This will
be a call-back to the push-pull and fun feelings she had earlier when you pulled the routine.
By the way, some have suggested to me that for the under 35-crowd females, adventurous is a euphemism
for anal sex. I cant say I disagree from the feedback Ive gotten. Swinggcat advances that view, too, as an
ancillary benefit to his contribution to the routine. Just so you are aware of what she thinks you are implying
within the questioning sequence.
I have been asked, Why not take pride in your profession and tell her what you really do? Shell be
impressed, wont she? Answer: NO SHE WONT because you allowed her to take the superior interviewer
position, so you lose. Go ahead and keep trying it that old way and let me know how it goes; or try this
and see if your results are a little more spectacular. Then for extra credit, see if you can start to unravel the
esoteric female psychology that explains why Dog Groomer works. If you have the time, Ill explain it over a
beeror better yet, demo it to show how it works.

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Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Appendix G Principles to Teach the Girls, and To Live By


These principles, discussed before or after first sex, are crucial to inculcate into all women you intend to have
sex with because it tells them what they want to hear, that their life will become better and better by being the
best lover possible for you.
You must be perfectly comfortable in your own skin talking about these subjects, without the slightest
leakage of doubt. The notion is that if you are comfortable talking about a subject, then the woman will be,
too, no matter how she might have felt about the subject in your absence. Anal sex? Videotaping her as you
cum on her face? If you make it sound perfectly sexy and fun, and a naughty secret you share, then she will
adopt your comfort level as her own. On the other hand, if she detects that you are even a little freaked out
about the subject matter, even if it is something as innocent and uncontroversial as hand holding, she will
resist and be freaked out by the subject. These principles will help her become happy, even if they are a new
way of thinking to her, so long as she sees that you are comfortable with them and so will she.
Although this may be a little out of sequence I offer them here for their ubiquitousand essential utility. Dont
leave home without them!

Principle 1:

To get good sex you must give good sex. Become an expert at giving great sex and
you will experience in return the kind of sex life your friends can only fantasize about.

This establishes that she can expect great things from and with you, and does her the great service of telling
her that she is allowed and expected to become adventurous and skilled in sex, and that this is a formula for
her to hold on to you. She will also see this as a path to increasing her value overall, which may serve her
when she is with you and for that possible period after you have left.

Principle 2:

While it is the privilege of men to love, savor, appreciate and embrace the taste of a
womans pussy, so is it the womans great privilege to learn to savor and appreciate the
taste of a mouthful of cum.

Many women will say that they dont give head, where the real reason is that they are afraid of allowing you
to see that they are inexperienced, and that they might humiliate themselves by doing a poor job.
Explaining this as a natural right of beautiful, sexual women, you set the stage for them to learn how much
fun it is for them to suck your cock.
Although I have written on this subject elsewhere, let me add here that I usually mention large numbers of
blowjobs, where they can learn and refine their cocksucking skill, so they can relax and know it will not be an
infrequent experience but a regular event in their lives. I also adopt the tone that when they blow me, and
when I comedown the back of their throats, that I am doing this for their benefitwhich so far has always
been adopted as their experience with me.

Principle 3:

Good sex involves frequency and timing. Men have priority as to timing, and
women have priority as to duration. That is, since men take some period of
recharging between orgasms, the man is pleasured first and according to his desires

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

33

so that he may be physically recovering for a second orgasm while the woman has her turn.
After the man has cum then the woman enjoys hours, or as much as she wants, of slow,
languid, intensive attention. When the mans recharge period has run and he is ready again,
the cycle repeats itself as he takes priority, then transition priority back to the woman, and so
forth for as much time as is available.

Simultaneous orgasm is one goal young women fantasize about achieving, but it is harder than it sounds and
comes at a great cost. In the beginning, you should encourage the alternative view of maximizing each
others individual pleasure at independent moments and save the simultaneous cum for when you both really
know each others responses.
Then you need to discuss a fundamental difference between men and women, that men have an orgasm and
usually require a refractory period where we recover and reload. For an older guy this can be a couple of
hours, in some cases, much longer. What this suggests is that for the man to experience the greatest sex he
should be allowed to cum 2 or 3 or 4 times in the day, and to achieve this he must get started earlyhave an
orgasmwait a couple of hourshave anotherand so forth, until he runs out of time.
Therefore, the man cums first.
Women can have many, many orgasms throughout the day with a much shorter refractory period. If the man
has cum first and then it is their turn, she will have a couple of hours at the minimum to enjoy a full-body
pleasuring at the hands of the man.
While this may sound a little mechanical, it works out great in practice so long as the woman adopts this
philosophy as her own. In practice it may work like this:

9:00am

Woman blows man, man cums after :20 minutes


9:30am to noon

Man pleasures woman with massage, eating pussy, and fucking as she
cums three times


Noon

Woman massages man, gives hand job then fucks him until he cums for
a second time

Lunch

1:00pm


1:30pm to 5:00pm

Man repeats womans favorites, 69ing with her (where she is the
privileged cummer), and fucks her as she cums 4 more times

Break for dinner and a movie

5:00 pm to 7:00pm


7:30pm


34

In cab on way home from movie, woman gives man a hand job then
sucks on him as he cums because although this was a little
inconvenient, she believed that this was the optimum time for him to cum
and so created the opportunity for them both

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Trust me, this can be a very good thing for you both.


Principle 4:

Good sex is about learning and trying new things, and expanding your sexual
envelope. Your mantra must be that you will try everything if to do so is to enhance
your and your partners pleasure.

This is a variation on the first principle.



Principle 5:











My goal is to discover exactly what turns you on the most, what makes you hottest,
and craziest, and gets you up for the longest, most intense experience, and the most
frequent orgasm at the highest intensity that lasts for the greatest duration; that makes
your body feel like it is exploding with the power of the sun. And once I discover what
that is and the cool thing is that you probably dont know exactly what that is at this
time, that that experience is buried deep in your DNA and it is our privilege to dig it out
and discover it together. And then once I discover what it is that makes you hottest,
that you enjoy the most, the gives you the greatest most unimaginable pleasure ever
no matter how weird or strange or common or pervertedIm going to do nothing else
for you but that over and over and over and over, 20 or 50 or a hundred times, and Ill
only stop when I discover something new, something that you like even better, and then
Ill switch to that. Because youre that important to me, and because youre lucky
enough to have met me.

I explain this to women as a matter of fact, and it has never failed to elicit a happy smile. When I point out
that what turns them on is something that I dont at the moment, and neither do they, but that we will find out
togetherI am explaining that even if in their deepest dreams and desires, they have something really
immoral and kinky they want to do but feel it is too dirty or too uncomfortable to reveal to me, then when I
discover this (and they are not responsible because I am the one who discovered it, without much of their
help) I will keep doing it until I find something they like that is better.

Principle 6:





Men can cum a few ways, some very pleasurable, kinky, fun, perverted, and
emotionally bonding, and all are worth the effort. But women can cum dozens of
different ways and combinations of ways, in so many different parts of their bodies and
in some cases, all at once, with so many different intensities that it must surely be a
great privilege to be a woman. So my pledge to you will be for so long as we are
together, to constantly strive to make your sexual experience better than you thought
possible, and the envy of every woman you know now or shall ever meet in the future.

Read David Shade.



Principle 7:




Good sex is absolutely required for good health. The man and the woman that have an
intense, exciting, varied, and kinky sex life are mentally sharper and happier; they enjoy
their work more and achieve better results; their bodies remain healthier both from the
sex itself and from the general feeling of well being, which allows exercise and good
eating and other factors to keep the body fit. Women especially are vulnerable to
depression without great sex in their lives, and the experience supplants any need for

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

35

Prozac-type drugs. And when difficulty in life strikes, the memory of recent,
overwhelming, intensely pleasurable sex can be the difference between responding to
the difficulty constructively or collapsing under the stress. Repeat after me: Good sex
is absolutely required for good health. It is a duty we owe to one another.

Self-explanatory.

Principle 8:


Good sex is the glue that binds two people together. Love is ephemeral: if you want to
stay together, have good sex regularly. If you dont care about the relationship and you
want it to come apart, ignore the other partners health and sexual needs and the
relationship with wither.

This states a truism. There cannot be love long term, without sex. If they want to keep you, then sex is part
of the bargain. If the sex goes away, then the love ends and so does the relationship.
Women are propagandized that this is not the case, that love is eternal even if and when they decide to give
up on sex. Coincidentally, and quite conveniently, our culture has taught them that even if the sex dies, that
the man retains an absolute duty of taking care of them. That this is a one-way bargain and patently unfair
and unacceptable to men is an element never taught to them.
We correct this misapprehension early on so that the sex, and the love, stays forever or as long as you
desire it to.

Principle 9:



Good sex is so important that it is not always possible or desired to wait until the
mood strikes you. If the opportunity for good sex arises (bearing in mind the
priorities of Principle 3, supra), start! Become a performance artist for the one you
love! Your interest will catch up shortly and youll honor the other principles above with
greater fidelity than waiting around for the mood that may decide to never reappear.

This is another myth to be busted, that sex should occur when both parties feel like it. If this were the case
there would be very little sex. Your job is to note when she seems sexually interested and then offer her great
sex; and her job is the same, in reverse. While this may seem obvious to the man it must be explained to the
woman, and again, early on.
Follow all of these guidelines and you are mostly the way home to a good sexual relationship.

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Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Appendix H Lay Report on Age by Zardos Another Mans Experience


Editors Comment: I was of two minds about including this. First, there was Zardoss notion that, at age 30,
he might somehow be called old. I am over twice his age, have dated pretty 19 year old girls for sex only at
this age, and I do not and did not consider myself at a disadvantage against a guy so young. On the other
hand, Zardoss conduct illustrates principles that would have worked for someone much, much older as
well and it is in that spirit that I include his report.
By the way, to AMOG someone (as a verb) is to exhibit Alpha Male Other Guy behavior with the purpose of
intimidating another guy away from your target; of tooling him so he loses face, respect, and status and is
better off leaving. You therefore have AMOGd someone. As a noun, an AMOG is any guy who is attempting
to use size and alpha male behavior to take your target away from you using similar tactics.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Re
:
ZARDOZ : LR : YOURE TOO OLD FOR ME
From :
Cliffs List Newsletter
Date :
May 2, 2004
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
I met her at a bar, did a little role paying, push pull, kino and Facebook closed. Nothing much came of it. Then
I met her again outside a different bar. I happened to be hanging out with a mutual friend, so there was social
proof. Some random guy was chatting her up when I re-opened.
Me: Oh, its you again ... are you stalking me?
Her: No, I would never.
The other guy looked worried.
Him: Hah. Are you a stalker?
Her : Yes. Yes, I am. And youre next on the list.
They both laugh ... but he still looks nervous. Hes touching her, vying for attention ... Im looking around,
leaning back, waiting for my friend.
Me: You are on my Facebook list.
Her: I am?
Me: Yeah, we talked for while at <xbar>. You kept hitting on me.
Her: I did not! (But! shes fixing her hair!) The other guy looks really worried.
Me: Hey those are nice earrings, let me check them out.
She moves over to me, so I can touch her neck, her hair. We chat a bit. The other guy says something dumb,
trying to AMOG me ... and thats why he loses. He tries.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

37

I number close her with, We should hang out sometime.


Three days later I see her on Facebook. We chat. She invites me over. I agree, and then at the last moment I
flake.
We arrange another meeting at her place. I go this time. Within five minutes, her legs are on my lap. I put them
there. Five minutes later were kissing. She asks how old I am. Im 30, shes 19, and has issues with the age:
Her: Why do you go for much younger women?
Me: I dont. I go for girls Im attracted to. I just hope theyre mature enough to handle me.
She talks about her maturity, she believes she is. But she still has an issue with my age. I go home that night.
We chat on Facebook and she tells me Im much too old for her. I agree completely. But we should be friends.
I want to talk to her about my dating life and girls Im seeing. She doesnt like this too much, but agrees.
She invites me over for tea. I get resistance, the age issue. I say ... thats great. Im glad we can just be
friends, because I have some dating issues you can give me great feedback on. She doesnt like this again,
but agrees.
She hasnt had sex in 6 months, although shes very beautiful and has many suitors. She prefers to stay at
home and read, watch TV, paint. Shes a bit out of the loop and has some social anxiety. Thats because you
need to get laid. Ill take you out to meet guys, and you can help me. She is hesitant about this idea, but
agrees, since she does need to get laid.
I post pictures of myself having fun with some attractive girls. She messages me, I ignore it. She messages
me the next day with an invite for coffee at her place. I agree ... but flake at the last minute. Shes quite
disappointed. Then, I text back an hour later, It looks like I have a few hours after all.
I get to her place, there are candles, wine, shes all done up and theres a blanket on the floor. Thats where
we got naked, and eventually had sex. Her idea.
The key was non-resistance. I didnt try to sell her on me; I sold her on her need for sex. Six months is a long
time.

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Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

Appendix I Dealing with the I Have a Boyfriend Shit Test; Notes from the Field
I ordered dinner and the only place to sit was next to an interesting looking woman. (Actually, there were lots
of others places free but the proper mindset is, Right next to HER is the only place left to sit and then do it;
a variation of the 3-2-1-GO! directive.) She was athletic looking, about 40-42 years old, slender, and had an
Office Professional look to her as though she might be a lawyer. Perhaps a 6 but she was the only one near,
and thus a target for practice, and she proved to have a lively personality.
I simply sat down at the table with her, smiling as I sat, and delivered the peremptory Mind if I join you?
introduction. She had calm eyes, smiled with her entire face and said, Of course not. Id love the company.
(This is the usual reaction, by the way.)
While pleasant I could tell that the conversation wasnt going anywhere, other than me making her day a little
brighter, so I was preparing to exit when she took a call on her cell, turned slightly away, and chatted with
a girlfriend for a minute. I wasnt really listening as it seemed a good omen to me for leaving, that she was
disconnecting herself from me to concentrate on her cell call, when I overheard her remark to her caller that,
I told him I already had a boyfriend so hed leave me alone.
So I stuck around for the required :02 or :03 minutes before she finished her call, and I asked her, Did that
really work? Telling some guy youve got a BOYFRIEND? And that was enough to make him go away?
Big open mouth, surprised smiling face: Uhh, yeah. It worked. Rather, it works. I just didnt want to talk to
that guy anymore.
And this lead me into a discussion, and a practice session with her that is worth reporting here, about how a
guy who knows what he is doing can easily get around that bit o bullshit.
I said, Look, all guys who get it know that all beautiful women [sic] have boyfriends all the time: no woman
will ever admit she doesnt. So I would never ask, and if you just spontaneously blurted out a Tourettes
Thing about having a boyfriend, Id either ignore it or deal with it so it would have no power over me. A
discussion ensued but it was clear she was suddenly turned on by the idea of what Lance Mason calls The
Banter Battle.
I gave her the challenge. Permission for some fun. Hit me.
Go ahead, just keep saying I have a boyfriend and Ill show you I can outlast you, that you cant win if the
guy knows what hes doing. She nodded and calmly fired off, I have a boyfriend in a tone suggesting she
was not interested me, an excellent bit of role play.
Here is the list of responses I gave her back, one right after the other, as well as I can remember them. Trust
me: its easier to do it into their faces than recall them while typing, because you can calibrate, and feel
buoyed by their facial expressions when you can see theyre getting into the play fighting.
I HAVE A BOYFRIEND!

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

39

Right. [Ignoring it.] Seven oclock will be too late. So make it 6 oclock and bring a bottle of wine. [Note:
this first one surprised her, as though she had thought no one could ever have a comeback for her, and so
she smiled so big and broadly I thought she was going to start laughing. The subsequent responses just
added to this response. And I dont even consider this one of the more powerful answers, either.]
She says her line; I respond by quietly leaning in as though whispering something conspiratorially, as though
Im a little surprised at her lack of sophistication and say, Actually, Im not inviting the boyfriend, Im inviting
you [and switching back to ignoring the thought] so wear some nice blue jeans that show off your ass and
some cute shoes to go with them. Big smile from her at my use of the word, ass, too. You cannot over-use
the word ass in a conversation with women.
Again. Whoa, princess, come here (and she leans in). You know, having a boyfriend is actually a pretty
normal thing, so making a big deal of it makes you look ... a little ... weird, you know? So wed better get
going, because theres not much time!
Once more. Cool. Good thing Im not the jealous type. And dont forget that bottle of Merlot I told you to
bring.
Another. Okay, okay. So well invite him over to fix us breakfast tomorrow morning... but I have to tell you, if
he doesnt make us fresh squeezed orange juice? Ill have to CLUB HIM. She burst out laughing at this one.
One last time: I have a boyfriend. Whoa! Stop. Come here. [I lean in a little as she leans in more.] You
know were going to have sex later on, right? Because thats the ONLY WAY we can clear the air of all this
SILLY SEXUAL TENSION you keep making, so we can GET THAT BEHIND US and get on with just getting to
know each other as real friends. [Shocked but smiling broadly] Really. Itll happen. Dont worry ... so! ... you
were saying you were going to select a nice Pinot Noir to bring to my place, wasnt it?
There was some minor interruption, so she dealt with that but then came back immediately to the discussion.
Wow. [Long pause.] I had no idea. That was really effective. Really, really effective. I just had no idea. That
was good.
I could have added one more but it just didnt seem to fit into the quick positive vibe wed established, and
that would have been to say something like, Wow, you have a boyfriend! How cool! Im glad you met
someone who can meet all your needs, and is the 100% perfect man for you, with no reservations of your
lifelong commitment to him.
When are you getting married? The problem with this is that it is more of a neg than dealing with the
boyfriend thing and so has limited use. Also it doesnt naturally lead into anything unless you forcefully shift
the discussion into something like the Television Pattern which I like to use.
I have a boyfriend can also have a secondary meaning which you should be on the lookout for: she might
be trying to say, I have a boyfriend SO WE MUST BE DISCRETE, where she is checking to see if she can
play with you without compromising her current relationship, which she may not be ready to concede for so
many reasons. Any of the earlier responses will work there also so long as you thereafter give her enough
feedback that she believes you will not embarrass her either in that venue, where there might be witnesses,

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or to her boyfriend should you be the stalker-type who might call her home repeatedly.
If the boyfriend thing keeps coming back and isnt easily dismissed, cavalierly as I hint might be
accomplished above, you might want to add a discussion about how women almost always embrace the
concept of It doesnt count when calculating their own loyalties to their boyfriends. For example, many
women will say, I have never cheated on my husband/boyfriend!but if you answer, Really? But what
about me? Youve been fucking me for 4 years. Dont I count?, they will say, That may be true, darling, but
YOU DONT COUNT.
YOU DONT COUNT. If they are using you for sex, and friendship, with no intention of leaving their primary
male sponsor (whether it be husband or boyfriend), then they consider themselves exhibiting perfect fidelity
... after the slight mathematical adjustment to leave out of the calculations those infidelities that dont
count. Seriously, I have discussed the concept with womenwho then quickly agreed, Oh yeah, thats
absolutely right. I have known guys that didnt count [in my personal life], either! The point is, if you discuss
the concept of I DONT COUNT, you are continuing to lay the foundation for her to accept you as her new
temporary boyfriend, which will not replace or harm her current, main supporting boyfriend.
Thats all for now. Both an interesting field experiment because I had the balls to bring it up and practice
driving her expectations around with it, followed by some later thinking about how I could have extended the
conversational thread if circumstances had allowed.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

41

Appendix J Body Language and Tit Displays; Notes from the Field
================================================
Zip Note: Ruminations on Airport Big Tit, Cleavage Girl (2008)
================================================
As I waited in the airline boarding area, I chatted with TWO of our colleagues. Both nice guys, both deeply
religious, and both likely to be highly disapproving of one of our number running [practice] game on a girl
sitting next to us. So I couldnt do anything but some body language stuff and some sideways eye contact
but since both guys were actively engaging me there wasnt much else to do. An opportunity missed.
But not completely. She was about 30 years old wearing nice, tight blue jeans and with short, dark brown
hair. She had a workout body with the exception of really, really nice tits which she compressed under a
sweater top except for an obvious perfect showing of 4 deep cleavage. She was about 57 tall, a 9 in my
book (but based on a lot of things of which hotness was not the biggest element); she just looked like she
might be perfect for me. She probably weighed 130 lbs but was a size 2. Just a lot of muscle.
The first guy that I saw, who I saw before I saw her, was actually sitting across the wait-aisle (chair-row facing
chair-row) and about 3 seats down from the girl. Since I had watched him walk over there and sit down about
50 ahead of me, it was clear that he had seen her and was seeking proximity to her. (God Damn! We male
primates are SO predictable!) I noticed her only as I SAT DOWN, opposite him and with one chair space
between me and the girl to my right. That was not a bad setup, given the terrible limitations of the moment.
She glanced up and gave me a quick shit-test smile. It transmitted, Oh, youre OLD and youre NOT
IN MY LEAGUE with a kind of smirk before her eyes darted down to her magazine. This is my FAVORITE
RESPONSE, by the way! If she had done anything else I would have suspected that she would not be high
quality enough to trigger my interest after :02 minutes. So I shot back my automatic squinty eyed smile that
says, Oh, yeah, RIGHT. You WANT ME, dont you, you little VIXEN!
Its all about the mindset. The rest of the time I merely did passive demonstrations of value. I dominated the
drama side of the equation and when Supervisor T.G. came over (whom you probably know as a really decent
guy in the office) I strongly accredited him by pointing out his credentials. You just have to visualize how I
do this but anyone within earshot will know hes both a high value male plus a REALLY COOL GUY, and of
course, my tone of voice implies that I am his equal or even superior so EVERYONE HERE wins. Except for
the dumbshit other guy who kept proving how mono-tonal, boring, one dimensional and stupid he was ... so I
had to marginalize him, vis a vis the girl.
At one point Supervisor T.G. mentioned that our company was bidding on a contract with the Saudis that
required NO WOMEN on the personnel listso I riffed off about how much TROUBLE WOMEN WEREwhere
the tone of voice clearly established playfulness and not misogynist viewsand then I turned to the girl, who
was ignoring me but leaning towards me, and turned away, which is another basic form of primate proximity
seeking behavior, a really good IOI [indicator of interest]. Turning in her direction but ostensibly talking to my
friends only, I said, take Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolieshe was reading a Hollywood-type magazine article
prominently featuring those two Angelina is clearly the source of all problems there, its just so OB-vious!

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She did not look up or towards me but she smiled. Notice this was an emotional computer activating remark,
full of drama, and it demonstrated that I clearly was not supplicating to herI was not the suck up type
and did not care what she thought, but that I was willing to engage in play-fighting about harmless but fun
subjects. These are good, anti-AFC traits to demonstrate.
Unfortunately, I kept getting pulled back by the other two. They were clearly aware of the girl and were also
aware that in order to feel in their own comfort zones, they needed me to keep engaging them. I suppose
thats a common AFC/guy thing and we do it all the time.
This girl gave me three more IOIs and I mention them as instructive of how important it is to carefully read
their body language and responses.
(1) When I got up from my seat to get my boarding pass, she also got up but circled the opposite way to get
around the chair-row. All she could do was move to a place near the ropes as though waiting for her section
to be called for boarding. So she allowed me to seek proximity with her. This in no accident but ROUTINE
female behavior! And 99% of the guys would miss it, and I dont want you to miss it. She was giving me a
go for opening (as if I needed her approval!)
(2) On board I had to sit in the way-up-front part, so I got on later and then stood in the companionway
and looked aft. Her vision must have been adequate (and remember that many cannot see well because
they dont like to wear contacts because it makes their eyes red, and they dont like to wear glasses, either)
because I made eye contactheld it until she looked away firstand smirked at her again. DOMINANCE.
When you ask women, When did you first realize that you were attracted to me? the answer is usually
something about an eye contact thing like that. Sometimes they like to quote that line from the movie, Jerry
Maguire: You had me at hello.
(3) When I got off, I couldnt open the door right away for some technical reasons so when I did step out I
stepped out about 3 or 4 behind the girl! Pure blind luck. And I did not see her until she was abreast of me
and turning the corner because she had been concealed behind a big fat guy in the aisle. As she walked by
she smiled and SHOOK HER HEADwhich was another cool shit-test that said, You blew your chance with
me by being tentative but I know it can be seized back by being playfully dominant. All I had to say was,
Hey! What was up with that Im so hot you cant talk to me look you gave me back there? Yeah, yeah,
princess: I saw what you thought. No, I just wanted to give you a chance to APOLOGIZE to me ... no, no,
wait, Im not done yet ... and buy me a cup of tea. You know. To MAKE UP for it. And I might decide to forgive
you.
I guarantee that would have worked. Cool playful fucking DOMINANCE! Also of note is the fact I was in
civilian clothes so I could get away with it. Because of the risks of being in costume I would never be so
normal: in costume you have to dial it back a bit, in case shes a psycho and wanted to complain to my
employer. That would be bad.
But it was a loss. For her, mainly, because there will always be another perfect girl coming along momentarily
for me and you.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

43

Other thoughts: Tits! She knew she had nice tits; the cleavage thing was not an accident. So you have to
expect to get shit-tested on her tits fairly early in the game. This is a neat subtlety I have experienced before
since if a woman can CONTROL YOU with her TITS she will never like or respect you. The trick is that you
cant IGNORE THE TITS: you have to appreciate them while letting her know that you arent controlled by
them. This sounds like doublespeak but there is a solution.
The basic principle is this. She knows she has nice tits. Her tits are the source of her pride and joy. She
has almost certainly NAMED THEM. (Yes, really. This is fun to talk about later as in intimate riffing source
of material. Youll learn of Thelma and Louise, the Girls or the twins, Laverne and Shirley, Daphne and
Rachel, or Pamela Andersons Pancho and Leftie. I kid you not.) She flaunts them and wants all women
and all non-AFC men to look at them and admire them.9
She also uses her tits as a quick first screen. If she can determine that you are amazed at her tits and slightly
distracted, then she will think, this guy is a LOW VALUE guy since he obviously doesnt have any experience
handling babies like these and she will lose attraction. You get blown off. But if you are NOT CONTROLLED
by her tits, then she thinks, What?! He is not supplicating to me! OH, NO! He must routinely have access to
boobs better than mine so he is [GASP!] HIGH VALUE! And she feels attraction, just like that.
Her behavior reflects these beliefs. Shes going to do tit displays for youarching her back after
accidentally undoing a button or two so you can accidentally look down her cleavage, plus leaning forward
for a better angle and turning her head to look for someone over there to give you the opportunity to
really, really check them out during your tea/coffee together, and then see if she can bust you looking at
them. If she can arch, look away, and suddenly snap her attention back at just the right momentand shes
spent a lifetime practicing that timing and sequenceshe will win. SHE IS BETTER AT THIS SHIT TEST THAN
YOU so dont even try to compete.
Dont stare but also dont care. If she accuses you of looking at her titsa common thing is for them to point
at their eyes and say, my eyes are up here, misteryou have to do a couple of things.
First, be non-reactive. Just laugh at her like shes a little girl who is nervous and intimidated around you. BE
NON-REACTIVE. This should be easier because youre being apprised of the risk here, now, so you can
prepare yourself mentally. One simple method to is simply not hear her; that is, react as though she has
said nothing at all. There is no requirement that you even acknowledge a shit-test so sometimes this simple
answer is the best available to you.
Second, call her on the tactic. There are a couple of things you can say, depending on the level of aggression
you feel like lofting her way. Re-frame the issue as her trying to point out how pretty she is to get your
attention. Say this, for example,

Another subtlety: women do NOT want low class, beta-males, faking alpha-wannabes, weak men to look at their tits; and to these
men, they will transmit the message I am not a sex object and stop objectifying me with your creepy stares! Sometimes theyll even say
those words out loud. Just be aware that that is NOT how they want you to be affected, and that they want YOU to look at, enjoy, value,
and be controlled by their wonderful, special, amazing tits. Do everything there except the part about being controlled by.

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Whoa! Princess! I get it. Yeah, I do: youre pretty. But pretty is just the basic cover charge to
get into the game. Look around: pretty is common. Its everywhere. But pretty always fades.
Whats important is whats in here [holding fist against your sternum].
Another response re-frames her shit-test as her being into you, and being too obvious about it,
Oh, my God! Youre INTO me, arent you? Otherwise you wouldnt be arching your back and trying to show
off your breasts so much!
Listenyoure doing OKAY with me ... so far ... so just relax and be yourself. Dont be nervous. Youre
actually doing pretty good right now ... so long as you DONT SCREW THINGS UP in the next few minutes ...
10

That last part is criticalso long as you DONT SCREW THINGS UP in the next few minutes ... because
that is humorous and is the compensating neg to the compliment you just gave her, which can NEVER be
allowed to sit there as though spoken by an AFC. YOU MUST DO THAT LAST CLAUSE to get the thing to
work! MUST MUST MUST.
Heres something else Ive said. Would you stop squeezing your boobs like that? [Then nicely, as an aside]
Its coming off a little TRY-HARD. And grin to let her know that HER TITS are NOT CONTROLLING YOU,
and it is a playful flirt. You called her on her bullshit, which is a good thing, but you did it in a nice way and
that keeps you in the drivers seat.
Your body language is important and here is the general idea. Most guys [wrongly!] will lean back slightly,
drop their chin, and cross their armsin a defensive posture known to primates everywhere. Better is to
open your chest posture slightly and either step in a bit if youre more than 3 away, or if standing close then
LEAN IN SLIGHTLY. How much to step in or lean in? It has to feel like you are sliding into her personal space
and perfectly comfortable being there and OWNING her.
After dealing with the initial shit-test distract her by asking her something, to shift gears before her brain
catches up. Anyway ... so whats with this COMPANY you work for, anyway? Cant they just let you stay in
one place so you can actually get some work done? And why havent you worked up the courage to offer to
buy me a cup of tea while you continue to hit on me?
One girl had been trying to own me for several days and in a fit of frustration, because I had been nonreactive to all her high intensity Im so pretty shit-testing, was to suddenly open her coat and flash me. A
long, wide-open, :10 second flash. Her gaze, however, was cold, focused, and evaluating: not sexy at all. I
didnt react except to point to one tit and say, It its a little bit SMALLER than the other one, dont you
think? And then I laughed. At that moment I OWNED her ass! Or more precisely, her breasts.

10

If shes doing something that you can interpret [frame!] as trying to gain favor with you, you can nod approvingly while slyly
observing, Okaaaay now youre SUCKING UP to me I LIKE THAT in a girl! And if you dont get the double-entendre here, youre
not paying attention!

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

45

My last thoughts about her tits: if she is really obvious about showing them off and comfortable with her body,
she may try to point out that you are a PIG for looking at her in an inappropriate way or some other shit.
The way to handle that is to BE NON- REACTIVEslowly RAISE YOUR HAND as if to tell her to be quiet
and SLOWLY and DELIBERATELY say, W h o a Im not yet finished as you slowly continue to
examine her body as though she were a manikin. This is funny, dominant, and has the amazing ability to turn
women on right there. (Ask me to demonstrate if you cant picture this working.)
Years ago in college this one average nice looking girl with HUGE PERFECT titsIll never forget the black
T-shirt she was wearing: Why Dont You Come Up and Simi Sometime? Simi Valley Vineyards knocked
on my dorm room door. She was nice to me but as she talked she shit-tested me by arching her back and
doing a seriously impressive tit display and I collapsed. Totally. I crash and burned: Ahh, ahh, ahh, ahh,
ahh and so forth. Her face went cold, she backturned me and never spoke to me again. Theres a lesson
in there amidst my pain and that is that its important to get this tit thing under control. The lesson she
handed me is reflected in everything Ive discussed in this note.
From the girls perspective, her initial sense is that she wants you to look at her tits but then, based on your
reaction and her assessment of your reaction, you get slotted into one of two categories. If you confidently
check out her whole body KNOWING SHE IS WATCHING YOU and you DO NOT PAUSE at her tits? She
knows you are accustomed to being with girls like her, so big tits are cool but nothing special to you, and
she sees you as high value. But if you initially make eye contact and then try to surreptitiously STARE AT
HER TITS when she looks away, and she then busts you? Her reaction will be that you must NOT be
accustomed to girls like her, those with big tits and concommitent high value, and so she experiences
revulsion and disgust as to youand youre dead in the water. Worse, to her friends she will describe her
feeling about you as being creepy. Never a good thing.
One way to practice, without having to be in the actual presence of a woman shit- testing with tit displays,
is to watch videos of such encounters and then reverse-program yourself by asking, and practicing, What
would I do in such a situation?
One place to find these is Metacafe on the internet. This service downloads mini-ideo links posted by
subscribers and is not unlike Youtube. While most of these are to games and photo collections, one series
is from a Russian skit-comedy television show that features beautiful girls suddenly made naked in a Candid
Camera-type setting. For example, a pretty blond girl is demonstrating a washing machine to a customer
and her clothes are accidentally pulled off by the spin cycle! Man is surprised, shocked and OWNED.
Or the girl is standing at a bus stop to ask a man for the time and her clothes are suddenly ripped off
when the bus leaves! Sometimes a nurse who is taking a mans blood pressure and when she pulls out
the stethoscope her tits pop out, too! The Russians seem to love watching girls in all kinds of unexpected
situations have their [perfect, large] tits pop out; but then again, I like that, too. So funny! Silent Russian TV,
in the Benny Hill tradition, except with sexy nudity 2 or 3 times every week.
Another genre are mini-videos where some American girl shit-tests and OWNS a guy working in a clothing
store. One video has a big-titted blond in a bikini have some nerdy male AFC clerk help her to fit test
several bikini tops. Naturally he gets OWNED, where getting owned is the opposite of passing her shit-test.
Another girl asks for help selecting clothes from the rack and suddenly pulls her tube top down and asks, Do
my boobs look crooked to you? Same result, everybody laughs.

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This is all in good humor but it inspires the question, If you encountered something like this how would you
handle it? This is not suggesting preparedness for television but to practice the more likely tit display shittesting you will face in real life.
Another author suggested that one useful purpose for strip club titty bars was to grant men proximity to big,
flashing, shaking breasts where the men can practice being non- reactive, recognizing that our DNA-driven
impulse is to be anything but non-reactive! Were supposed to get aroused by titties being shaken in our face,
even as such reaction defines us as of lesser experience, fewer prior opportunities, and current lower value!
Just, get used to being around big, perfect tits so that they no longer have the power to distract and control
you. (This might be an expensive education, and it might be one that subjected you to a lot of distractions
from the intended lesson, but I think the guy is on to something.)
How do you react? BE NON-REACTIVE. Show no emotional reaction. Do not come across as being
owned. Non-reactivity signals that you are superior to her status and that she has no special power over
you, except such power as you shall graciously grant her. The power of your conversation, and proximity to
your Alpha character. By being non-reactive she cannot control you with her tits, and that means you pass.
Next, be prepared with a standard response. It is delivered in a calm, helpful voice with only a tinge of
embarrassment but the embarrassment is for her awkward situation, which she created due to her social
ineptness. Yeah, thats the FRAME you project: that she is a little off-kilter and you are the guy noticing it and
helping her back to a secure social place. Any of the responses I suggest above would work wonderfully.
And if you cant remember them (which should never be the problem when youre watching a MINI-VIDEO to
TRAIN YOURSELF!) you can always just go like:
Ahhhhh nice try, princess, but that will come soon enough so long as youre a good girl.
Now I think you should buy me a cup of coffee, to celebrate the fact that its official, that youre
really into me
Well, thats it for now. Good luck and good hunting.

Getting Younger Girls As An Older Guy

47

Appendix K Its Never Too Late to Adopt a New Life Plan


=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Zip Note - Chad the 57 Year Old Welders Exquisite Recovery! (2008)
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Chad and I were friends in kindergarten and the first grade (before the 1960s!), but by the end of the first
grade our sensibilities about who our peers and playmates were divided along class lines. That is, I (apparently) was perceived as one of the smart kids and he was not. So I didnt really notice or remember him until
we were accidentally reacquainted a few years ago. Chad reminded me of our earlier times together on the
church dirt mound, which substituted for a playground (circa 1957) and in Miss Smiths first grade class, room
3 (1958-59). It seems I also attended not only his first wedding but his second, ten years later (but my memory here may be forgiven because I attended as caterer with my moms business and not as an invited guest).
I remembered Chad as being religious. Actuallyextremely, righteously pious- religious, the type that always
carried a pocket Bible. He was never preachy but everything he did was in conformance with church edict.
When he had a decision to make he consulted with his pastor. (Im not sure about you but in my world this is
a RECIPE FOR DISASTER ... but no one was asking me.)
His marriages in each case dissolved when his wife left him for another man in his church, in one case one of
the assistant pastors. He assumedwronglythat the church would side with him since it was clearly
his wife (later, wives) who had been adulterous, and that the parishioners would join him in forgiving
her and helping her come back to the light. (Since you and I live in the Real World we can already see how
THATs not gonna happen!) Instead, because she was better connected to the church hierarchy, because
she had been literally screwing them, it was HE who was ostracized ... and he was ultimately forced to leave
his church. This was devastating to him.
We were reacquainted just before his second marriage went from fine to troubled to suddenly terrifyingly
out of whack destroyed. He actually asked me what to do, which was a little weird because I didnt know
him that well, but he was distraught and for a physically strong guy to appear like that ... well, I gave it a shot.
I gave him a quick summary of how a man should decide and think in life, and it goes like this. Trust yourself
and try to think things through. I explained the concept of war gaming thought possibilities out and give
him practice. If life is confusing trust only those with proven track records for advice; and then never take
it out of hand but continue thinking through the problem. Your preacher is not on the list of advisors, by the
way.
As to your faith, keep the faith but never believe those lying sons of bitches that call themselves pastors,
rabbis, ministers, priests, or imams!11 Stop looking for guidance in the Bible! If you havent picked up the
general, moral thrust of the Bible by now, carefully reading individual passages for guidance in specific situations is NOT going to improve your life.
11

Yes, I know that by the doctrine of just about everyone else except Non-theistic Darwinists that I will burn in some multi-denominational Hell for my apostatic beliefs; but as a matter of rational functionalism, consider giving my advice a go before taking
whatever plunge youre considering.

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Oh, yeah. And STOP PUTTING WOMEN ON A PEDESTAL. Youre more valuable than they and you can have
any of them you want. Did I mention, and never even THINK about getting married ever again?
This took maybe :05 minutes. And it stuck. He absorbed all of it. Over the next 2 years, every time he ran
into me at the shopping center or gas station hed stop and pleasantly chat. He was always discrete and
his questions were always well thought out. He took notes and on a few occasions stopped by my house for
clarification, but in doing so was an exceptional model for discretion. He is one of a handful of guys whom I
know can be trusted to never violate OpSec just because he wants to know something.
Our reacquaintance was ten years ago. Want to hear how things turned out for him? First, he found a new
church but he worships and prays for himself and generally seems to discount anything from the pastors.
This might be due to the fact that his prior experience with his exes was that these men were not to be trusted as a breed, a warped view I happen to share from prior professional experiences. For him now his faith is
a personal experience, not yet another variation on Jim Jones and Jonestown.
Second, he made the obvious decision to never get married again. He believed me when I said he was
higher value than any of the women hed meet, and that despite what his former churches and wives said,
there were HUNDREDS of beautiful women out there for him. In fact, he runs into new women every day.
He has some challenges. He is still 58 years old and his hair is thinning, but his weight is good. As a Master
Welder his skill is in demand and he is likely to remain employed for as long as he can handle his equipment.
But he has a problem with his voice box, which is deteriorating for some unknown etiology, and his ability to
speak is slowly abandoning him. He has perhaps 10% of his voice left, and he sounds like a case of lethally
degenerative laryngitis.
So I saw him at the supermarket last summer and he was buying picnic supplies with his girlfriend, a very
tarty looking 35 year old Ukrainian girl. Slender, blond, no bra and short short shorts. Big smile, half closed
eyes, and, a pleasure to meet any friend of Chads, sir.

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Appendix L Body Language and the Experience of Age


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Zip Note Body Language, an Officers Bearing, John Travolta and You
Date: May 2, 2009
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My friends and I are what most students of the social arts would call old: mostly in our
50s, several in our 60s, and a handful or two younger than that. So a common question arises in any of our
discussions, What advantages, if any, accrue to us as older men that give us the advantage over younger
men? Assume I see a much younger woman I would like to check out to see whether shes good enough for
me to have me sexually. In her eyes, what advantages would she feel that would pull her to me and away
from college boy over there?
OH MY GOD! Where to start?! We have SO MANY advantages over these 25 year old boys that my mind
boggles at the opportunities to exploit and expound upon them. However, given the fact that I have already
titled this one based on the notion of Body Language, Ill go with that.
Before I describe the advantage that YOU, my friend, have over younger guys I want you to engage in a small
thought experiment.
Picture John Travolta in the movie The Generals Daughter from 1999. It doesnt really matter if youve seen
it but it isnt a bad movie. The point here is that John Travolta is a professional actor and in this film plays a
senior grade Army Sergeant, an Army Internal Affairs Criminal Investigator that investigates the murder of the
Commanding Officers young West Point graduate daughter, a young, beautiful and new lieutenant.
In every scene Travolta bears himself like a proud, self-confident Army sergeant. His posture is correct, his
movements are graceful (if that word applies to a stubby body like his), and he exhibits no extraneous movements that might be called fidgeting. He does this because he is an actor.
Its great body language. When the commanding General (played by actor James Cromwell) tries to AMOG
him, Travoltas character doesnt flinch; he acts correctly, deferentially in accord with their relative ranks; but in
body language treats it as just another shit-test and keeps moving. Pretty cool picture to have in your head,
wouldnt you say?
Now picture John Travolta in Pulp Fiction from 1994 where he plays a greasy, low class thug buddy of Samuel
L. Jackson. Travolta now slouches, even when he seems to be trying to stand up straight. He bobs his head
in agreement with anyone superior to
him who is talking. Sure, hes a sympathetic guy; you might even want to hang with him someday, if you ever
moved into his trailer park. But his body language conveys his low value. BECAUSE JOHN TRAVOLTA IS AN
ACTOR.

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Back to you and me! You and I have spent a lifetime developing and perfecting the body language that says
I am leader. We hit the right note every time. We dont come across as Try Hard or pretentious; were not
begging for others to let us be the leader. We are what we are and thats the natural group leader. It feels to
us and appears to others that we have achieved this as a natural birthright.
When were around others of our profession we tend to overlook this, but to outsiders looking in were never
competing for the attention but look like a gaggle of guys who are all leadership skilled. Heres the point:
YOU NATURALLY LOOK LIKE JOHN TRAVOLTA IN THE GENERALS DAUGHTER!
The major difference is that Travolta is a chameleon who can be the Pulp Fiction thug, and you cannot. If the
movie director paid you a million dollars you might look the part if you stood still, but the instance you moved
you would lose credibility because you have the FIXED NATURAL look of a leader.
So you got THAT going for you, which is HUGE.
Not that you cant improve upon it, by improving your posture, studying yoga or taekwondo, or adjusting
your wardrobebut the basics of your leadership self- confidence are unchangeably hardwired in to your
personality. When you walk into a room, women notice.
The point of this memo was to give you the recognition you deserve so the next time you walk among mere
mortalsanywhere where women congregate to shop, walk, work, or drink coffeeyoull understand what
they see, and that knowledge will lift your game.
[If you didnt FEEL anything after reading this [Appendix] memoREAD IT AGAIN. I want you all to internalize
the value that the world sees you as the natural alpha. Your game may have many deficits, and you may have
just started your journey out of AFCdom towards the Light, but get this straight: you do NOT need help in
learning how to display and DHV yourself as Alpha. NOW GO OUT THERE AND LEARN!]
Good luck and good hunting!

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Appendix M Things to Add to Memo Re: Shit-Testing On Age


Regarding women shit-testing me, and often on my age, I have two in my kit for auto- responding. First, men
must plan on carrying the wood for at least 95% of the conversation until we can get the new girls settled
down enough to ... talk ... slowly. Second, we can bust on them for being tongue-tied in the presence of a
cool, good- looking guy like me. I like to say, Oh, are you nervous? Oh, dont be. Youre doing fine. Relax
and enjoy the moment. Ill let you know if you start to screw things up ...
(Note: I like to use double-entendre words here, like suck or screw, to get their mind warmed up in an NLP
sort of way. Another example, not used here: Okaaay, so youre sucking up to me ... GOOD ... I like that in a
girl! I use that last one a lot.)
As to being shit-tested incessantly and it a particularly nasty, bitchy way: you are not affected because while
other guys may be scared and turn away, your mindset and the presentation of body language that you send
back is that you can see she is really just afraid, and that behind that tough girl facade is a frightened little
girl with feelings ... etc.
(Research: This may be in the MM Routines Book, or in Magic Bullets, in Frank Kermits Everything doc,
Lance Masons routine notes, Styles notes, or even OFBs. Copy that routine here, and tie it together with the
shit test, Eeewwwww, old men are icky!)

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Appendix N King Karl is Nearly 70 and Dating Women in Their 20s


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Cliffs List : I Could Be Older Than This Hotties Grandpa (2010)
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KingKarl: Heres the deal.
I was married for 32 years. Got divorced in my mid 60s, and didnt have a clue what I
was gonna do as far as the dating scene.
Got into the game about a year ago, and its been awesome. Im a big fan of Ross
[Jeffries] and Swinggcat, and their material has helped me out a lot. But when I first started out, I had a real
problem.
I was 65, and I realized I was only into girls who were 18, 19, 20 years old.
Women my age just dont do it for me. And women in their 30s and 40s ... some of them are fine, but my
experience has been they usually have too much baggage by that age. At least for me.
Thats not to say theres anything wrong with them. I know a lot of guys have great success with women this
age and Im not knocking that at all.
But I like the carefree, unburdened, adventurous spirit that blossoming young women have. Id be out
sometimes right after my divorce and just walking past these pretty young things in their sandals and halter
tops made me feel alive like I hadnt in years.
Seemed like a far cry to me though. I know a lot of guys in the community tell you looks dont matter, but lets
face it: Im a short, bald guy with a belly. I figured Id have to settle, and maybe if I was lucky Id get to bang
some frustrated housewives in their 40s.
Didnt change my reality though. I wanted the young hotties.
Theres a city college not far from where I live. Id go to the coffee shop there sometimes just to check out the
girls. Of course Id always take a book or something so I wouldnt be too obvious.
Everything changed for me one day when this gorgeous little blonde sat down next to my table with a friend.
She couldnt have been more than 19. Her friend was ugly and fat, and kept looking at me suspiciously like
she thought I was a dirty old man or something. But it didnt matter because pretty soon the HB thinks hes
stressed or something, and her fat friend keeps telling him once hes back home hell realize how much he
missed her. Pretty hard for me to keep quiet, but I manage.
Then the whole game changes: the friend leaves.

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Heres my chance. I dont even need to think of an opener, the conversation is right in front of me. But I
hesitate. Seriously, what hope do I have? I could be older than this hotties grandpa. Hell, I probably am.
But I keep thinking ... I used to bang chicks like this all the time. Only thing thats changed is the way I look.
The rest? Same old me who always had success. In fact, Im better now because I have so much more
experience.
Think of it this way: the average 18 year old guy has probably been with a few girls. If hes good looking
maybe hes been with more than a few.
But the best-looking 18 year old on earth cant have more experience than a guy whos been getting laid for 4
and a half decades.
So there was no reason for this girl not to want me, and every reason why she should. I turn to her and say,
Your friend is wrong, you know. She looks up. Excuse me?
About your boyfriend. He doesnt want you anymore. And I think deep down you know that, dont you?
I couldnt believe what I was saying. Where did I get the balls to talk like that? I fully expected her to get up
and slap me then and there.
Instead, she just looked at me in silence for a moment and then nodded. Feeling bold, I
went on.
Problem is, they just dont raise em to be men anymore. Notice by implication Im saying that the real men
are the older generation, like me. I see the way these young guys act, theyre worse than girls.
Again, for a second I think Ive gone too far. But she laughs. You got that right! she says.
Then she spends a few minutes gushing about how much shes done for this guy, waiting for him all this time
and the whole bit. Theres no way Im gonna sit here holding this girls hand like her fat friend. I interrupt her.
You know, I hear this a lot from girls. You want him to be upfront with you, but in my experience, most girls
cant handle complete honesty from a guy. They want everything sugar-coated. Are you saying you could
really be open to a man telling you exactly whats on his mind?
Yes! Thats what I want! she says. And then almost like she expects me to have the answer, she asks, So
what do you think it is!?
I scratch my chin, looking thoughtful. Well, youre an attractive girl, so thats not the problem. After
qualifying her I wanted to give her a little value . but only a little. Honestly, in my experience? Its probably the
sex.
She looked confused. What do you mean?

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It was time for another gamble. Im going to be blunt with you, okay? Girls your age are beautiful. And you
know it, dont you?
She smiled and nodded, probably expecting some kind of elaborate compliment from this sweet old man.
Thats the problem. You think your looks are enough to keep your guy satisfied. And so does he ... until he
meets a woman who has more than just looks.
What do you mean? she asked, puzzled again. Weve always had good sex.
She was opening up to me nicely. I decided to keep it up. You met this guy in high school, right?
She nodded.
See? You only think thats good sex because you dont have anything to compare it to. Havent you noticed
a lot of young guys these days are into the whole cougar thing? They might run around with these little cuties
in high school, but then they get to college. They meet an older woman who has been around the block a few
times and really knows how to please a man . and they dont look back.
I was being pretty sneaky: qualifying her and playing up the advantages of an older lover by explaining why
guys do it. It seemed to be working, but then she tried testing me:
Then how come you never see younger girls with older guys?
I was completely unshaken. Oh, you do, from time to time, I said. Rich old guys like Hugh Hefner keep hot
young girls around as trophies. But the truth is, older guys like older women for the same reason younger
guys do . experience always makes you better in bed.
She couldnt believe it. This chick was used to having the edge from her looks, and I could sense her getting
desperate as she realized that they werent enough to keep her boyfriend around ... or even a 65 year old
stranger in a coffee shop. So youre telling me you would turn down a younger woman who was interested in
you? she asked.
That would depend on the girl, I said. Dont get me wrong: some girls your age definitely know their
way around the bedroom. But theyre pretty rare. And those girls make up for lack of experience with other
things.
Like what?
If this went too much further, extraction was going to be a problem, so I decided to do it now. Listen, I said.
Id like to help you, but ... maybe this isnt the best place. Take a walk with me.
She looked around, then giggled; shed actually lost track of where she was and what she was talking about.
Thats got to be a good thing, I figured.

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55

There was a park across the street so I took her there. As soon as we were relatively alone she asked me, So
what is it these girls have?
I wanted her to spell it out, so I played dumb. Which girls?
It was cute: she looked around and then in a low voice said, These young girls that can keep a man
satisfied.
Well, a sense of adventure, for one.
Right on cue, she answered, Im adventurous!
But I wasnt going to push that one. Thats good, I said. Then youve taken the first step. But the next one
is much harder.
Whats the next step?
Honesty, I said. Which is really just freedom with what you want. What do you mean? she asked.
Well, when was the last time you saw your boyfriend? I asked. She told me it had been almost a year. And
youve been faithful to him all that time?
Of course, she said.
So you havent had sex in an entire year, I said. Thats not easy to live with. Sometimes, you
really want it badly, dont you? She blushed. See? I said. Thats what I mean: freedom means not being
embarrassed about your desires.
We walked in silence for a moment, then in a low voice she said, I do. Do what? I asked.
You know, she said. Want it.
So youre telling me it hasnt been easy being faithful to this guy? I asked, and she shook her head.
Because youd like to be having way more sex, wouldnt you?
She nodded.
It feels good to admit it, doesnt it? I asked. To just let all your desire out and say what you really want.
She laughed a little shyly and said that it did. Then a moment later she added, Its weird but ... this is really
turning me on.
Thats what I mean by being free, I said. You have no idea how good sex can be when youre really free.
She was quiet for a moment, then looked at me and said But I want to.

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Id timed it perfectly, because my flat was just on the other side of the park, and wed reached it. I smiled at
her slyly and said. This is my place. Are you coming up?
She just grinned and didnt say anything, which I decided to take as a yes. Seems I was right, because she
followed me inside.
When it was over she told me that her military boyfriend never fucked her like that. Which probably means the
chump never bothered to turn her on like that. Go figure.
Since then, Ive been working that angle with these much younger girls: taking the wise older guy approach
but then qualifying them a lot and playing up their lack of experience as a disadvantage with all men.
I cant say that Ive had success every time-sometimes the age gap is just too much for them-but so far I have
been getting fairly consistent results with this.

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