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6 TRANSCRIPTION FROM DVDs

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13 DATED:

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18 REPORTED BY: LAURA L. SPRINGATE

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2 [START VOB]

3
4 [Music]

5 "ABC Protecting Marriage"

6
7 DR. JIM GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

8 CHURCH

9 DR. GARLOW: Well welcome. We welcome you.

10 We're glad you're here for our third and

11 final simulcast. Celebrating marriage.

12 Celebrating marriage.

13 [Applause]

14 DR. GARLOW: Because...

15 [Applause, cheering]

16 DR. GARLOW: In... in 15 days, in just 15 days,

17 we're going to do what no state has ever

18 done before. We're going to reestablish

19 once and for all, one man/one woman. And

20 we're going to turn back the tides of evil-

21 -

22 [Cheering, applause]

23 DR. GARLOW: --marriage will be established in

24 California. Going for it.

25 [Music]
3

1 DR. GARLOW: Now in these next--in these next

2 15 days, in the next 15 days, we want to

3 make sure you know how to talk to

4 everybody you know about this. And so

5 we're going to do a crash teaching lesson

6 tonight. And we're going to use a very

7 difficult system. Simply ABC. If you know

8 ABC, you'll be able to remember everything

9 we say tonight. If you know your ABC's,

10 you all know your ABC's?

11 [Audience says yes]

12 DR. GARLOW: And now this is a heavy topic. So

13 we're going to lighten it up with some fun as

14 we go through this. The first three or

15 four things we're going to talk about are

16 going to work for your secular, un-church

17 friends. And as we go further down the

18 line we will--we'll talk to you about how

19 you talk to your church friends about this

20 issue. But to help lighten it up is my

21 buddy, one of my favorite comedians,

22 Nazareth, welcome Nazareth.

23 [Cheering, applause]

24 DR. GARLOW: Back to Skyline.

25 NAZARETH CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Thank


4

1 you. Wow. Pastor Jim.

2 DR. GARLOW: Glad you're here, man.

3 NAZARETH: Yes

4 getting a Middle--getting a Middle

5 Easterner to teach you the alphabet, that's

6 a sign of the end times, huh?

7 DR. GARLOW: [Laughing] Now I've always wanted

8 to ask you and never have. Nazareth, is--

9 is--is--that your--your real name?

10 NAZARETH: Yes. I

11 was born in Nazareth, Israel and it's a

12 family tradition to name you after the city.

13 I feel sorry for my brother Waikiki.

14 [Laughter]

15 NAZARETH: My

16 other brother Albuquerque.

17 [Laughter]

18 NAZARETH: And my

19 poor sister Buffalo.

20 [Laughter]

21 NAZARETH: See?

22 You like me? I lost weight. I've been on

23 the, uh, Fannie Mae diet.

24 [Laughter, applause]

25 NAZARETH: I lost
5

1 my retirement.

2 DR. GARLOw: [Laughing]

3 [Laughter]

4 NAZARETH: It's

5 good to be with you, thank you so much--

6 DR. GARLOW: [Interposing] Hey, you're going to

7 be helping me. We're going to work through

8 the alphabet--

9 NAZARETH:

10 [Interposing] Yes.

11 DR. GARLOW: --and you're going to be working

12 with the crowd to help me out on this

13 right--?

14 NAZARETH:

15 [Interposing] Yes--

16 DR. GARLOw: --okay.

17 NAZARETH: --to

18 make sure they remember them. So.

19 DR. GARLOW: Exactly what we're going to do.

20 We're going to start with the letter A.

21 NAZARETH: Okay.

22 DR. GARLOw: So I'm going to let you go down,

23 I'm going to start with the letter A and

24 what happens when we get to the letter A.

25 We'll be back to you in just a moment--


6

1 NAZARETH:

2 [Interposing] You've got it. Thank you.

3 DR. GARLOW: --okay. When we talk about what's

4 taken place over these recent years in

5 California, we start with the letter A.

6 And that stands for activist judges.

7 Activist judges said no--4 judges to what

8 4,000,000 people said yes to. And to help

9 us on this we're going to go all the way

10 across the country to, uh, Liberty,

11 Virginia where we're going to talk to Matt

12 Staver, he's one of the persons that argued

13 this case before the Supreme Court, along

14 with Bob Tyler, join me up here if you

15 would, Bob. And let's bring on--let's

16 bring on, um, Mat Staver on--on--on the

17 screen here.

18
19 MR. MAT STAVER, LIBERTY COUNSEL

20 MAT STAVER: Well

21 this clearly is activist judges. As you

22 know you go back to 2000 and 61.4% of the

23 people passed Proposition 22. I argued

24 this case at the trial court, the Court of

25 Appeals and at the Florida--at the, uh,


7

1 California Supreme Court. We've litigated

2 about 40 of these in the last 4 years.

3 This is the first case we've ever lost.

4 But this is a case we have a chance to turn

5 back the clock. Four of the seven judged

6 just simply ignored Proposition 22, ignored

7 over 4,000,000 people that passed this in

8 2000. Ignored the history, ignored the

9 Constitution and just out of their own will

10 instituted same-sex marriage.

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: Uh, and in terms of activist

13 judges, you're working with another

14 situation, I don't know the details, but

15 can you give me a 1-minute synopsis on Lisa

16 and Isabelle Miller. Help us understand

17 that case.

18 MR. STAVER, LIBERTY COUNSEL: Yes Lisa

19 and Isabella Miller are Christians. They

20 live in the State of Virginia. In 2000,

21 Vermont passed what was called a civil

22 union law which in that particular state is

23 an exact parallel to marriage but it's

24 called civil unions as opposed to marriage.

25 She got into a civil union relationship


8

1 with Janet Jenkins when she was involved in

2 the lesbian lifestyle. She gave birth to

3 her own daughter; Lisa did, by the name of

4 Isabella. After Lisa became a Christian

5 she separated from Janet, continued to live

6 in Virginia and now in just a few days,

7 we're having a court hearing in the State

8 of Vermont where under that law, that court

9 in Vermont has indicated that Janet Jenkins

10 who's still in the lesbian activist

11 lifestyle, who now has parent rights just

12 like anyone else, can actually possibly

13 take this child away from Lisa, her own

14 biological mother, take her from a

15 Christian home in Virginia, rip her away

16 and put her into an activist household in

17 Vermont. That's what happens when you had

18 this State of Vermont actually creating

19 this civil union law. It crosses the state

20 borders. It interferes into neighboring

21 states. And now it's threatening to take

22 away Lisa's own biological daughter.

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: Bob Tyler, you've seen a lot of

25 this. What would you add to that?


9

1
2 11 MR. BOB TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY

3 MR TYLER:

4 You know, here in California, uh,

5 especially where the Supreme Court's

6 located being in San Francisco, we've, uh,

7 with Matt and the, uh, litigating the same-

8 sex marriage case, it's a hostile

9 environment in the courts. And the great

10 thing about California is we have the right,

11 uh, through the initiative process to

12 overturn the courts, to overturn the

13 California Supreme Court. And with, uh,

14 Proposition 8 this is our opportunity, the

15 people, to steal democracy back and take it

16 away from the judges and bring it back to

17 the people because--

18 [Applause]

19 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

20 CHURCH: [Interposing] Yeah.

21 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: --right.

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: Thank you Matt. Thank you Bob.

24 Thank you so much. All you've got to

25 remember is this, 61.4% of Californians


10

1 said yes and 4 judges running against 4.5

2 million voters said no. Nazareth, help us

3 with letter A. We're just done--

4 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

5 [Interposing] Yes.

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: --with that letter. Okay.

8 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: This

9 man just doesn't seem to write it down so

10 let's talk to him. How are you?

11 MALE VOICE 1: Yeah I'm doing great.

12 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Okay

13 what does A stand for?

14 MALE VOICE 1: Activist judges.

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Okay.

16 We're going to give you like a hand signs.

17 There's hand signs we can do like this or

18 that but the hand sign for A is like the

19 judges, they use the Home Depot, uh, hammer.

20 So for A just remember that. A, is that

21 good? Can you remember that? A for what?

22 MALE VOICE 1: Activist judge.

23 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Thank

24 you.

25 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE


11

1 CHURCH: We got one here, thank you--

2 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

3 [Interposing] Thank you.

4 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

5 CHURCH: Okay. We're going to go to the

6 next one now. We're on letter B. The

7 State of California has given to homosexual

8 couples every benefit that a state can

9 possibly give. Talk to us about that,

10 we're back with you, Matt, once again, back

11 there in Virginia and then we're going to

12 bring Brad Dacus on with you at the same

13 time. Mat?

14 MAT STAVER, LIBERTY COUNSEL: Yes.

15 California has passed through the

16 legislature what's known as AB 205. And in

17 that particular law it does give all of the

18 same rights and benefits and privileges and

19 obligations to same-sex couples as are

20 already given in the marriage relationship

21 to heterosexual couples. And originally

22 when this whole situation began in

23 California, that was the argument, they

24 simply just wanted to have the parallel

25 benefits. So the legislature actually gave


12

1 the parallel benefits. And all of the

2 benefits that can possibly be given under

3 state law are now given under this AB 205

4 law. But now what the courts did is go

5 further and they say we're going to give

6 the name, marriage, we're going to give the

7 institution of marriage, notwithstanding

8 the fact that all of the benefits are

9 already given.

10 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

11 CHURCH: Right. What do you want to add to

12 that, Brad Dacus?

13
14 MR. BRAD DACUS, PACIFIC JUSTICE

15 INSTITUTE

16 MR. DACUS: [Interposing] Yeah.

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: --Brad Dacus?

19 MR. DACUS:

20 Yeah I--I think what's really interesting--

21 I agree with what Matt just said is what

22 actually--the benefits that have actually

23 been taken away from heterosexual couples.

24 The State of California in the case we have

25 ongoing right now told a--a couple, a


13

1 newlywed couple that they--on their

2 marriage application they couldn't have

3 bride and groom on it, they had to have

4 Party A and Party B. And so that--that's

5 what they've said to virtually all future

6 couples, uh, newlyweds to be married in

7 California. They're backing off on it but

8 let me make something really ce--clear. Uh,

9 if--if this--if Proposition 8 does not pass,

10 uh, the outcome of this litigation is up in

11 the air and could go either way. And

12 that's why it's important to pro--to--to

13 pass Proposition 8 because we're--we are

14 talking about actual heterosexual couples

15 losing benefits, losing the ability to

16 state who they are on their marriage

17 application, on their marriage certificate.

18 Very basic.

19 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

20 CHURCH: Thank you Mat. Thank you so much

21 Brad, both attorneys who give us a unique

22 perspective so that you'll all know even

23 secularists, un-church people, get this one.

24 They are aware or they need to be--made

25 aware through you, that all the benefits a


14

1 state can give has been given. But they

2 are aware, even un-church people, can focus

3 groups, know quickly that demanding the

4 term marriage is going too far. So as you

5 talk to people for 15 days, you can make an

6 enormous difference. Nazareth, we've got

7 two letters now.

8 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes.

9 Let's try this lady. How are you young

10 lady? You're married, right--

11 FEMALE VOICE 1: Yes.

12 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: So you

13 got all the benefits from him, look at him,

14 tired.

15 [Laughter]

16 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: What

17 does B stand for?

18 FEMALE VOICE 1: Benefits.

19 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Okay.

20 Benefits, did you see that? Benefits, yes

21 we--let's--

22 [Applause]

23 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --let's

24 bring the offering plates out. So. B for

25 Benefits, okay? Thank you young lady.


15

1 Thanks--

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: [Interposing] But what--what's--

4 what the hand motion so far?

5 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: The

6 first one for hammer is the first one for A.

7 Meh--activist judges and the B is the hand

8 out.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: Okay.

11 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes.

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: We're going to letter--

14 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

15 [Interposing] That's easy.

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: --we're going to letter C now.

18 Children in public schools are being

19 impacted enormously; even un-church people

20 realize how inappropriate it is for schools

21 to be teaching on this topic. Education

22 code 51.89.0. Say it with me. 51--

23 AUDIENCE: --89.0.

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: --89.0. Say it again.


16

1 AUDIENCE: 51.89.0.

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: Says that a teacher can teach

4 marriage as young as Kindergarten and if

5 you add in 51.93.3, say 51.93.3--

6 AUDIENCE: [Interposing] 51.93.3.

7 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

8 CHURCH: --the teacher has the right in

9 California to speak about sexuality in

10 whatever form, age appropriate, but guess

11 who determines what is age-appropriate.

12 Now to hear that firsthand, let's go--make

13 our way to, uh, a functional historical

14 model for us, that is the State of

15 Massachusetts that has had this kind of

16 arrangement for four years now. And let's

17 see what happens now when same-sex marriage

18 is legal. Dave and Tanya Parker have come

19 from Lexington, Massachusetts. What

20 happened?

21 DAVID AND TONIA PARKER

22 MR. DAVE PARKER, LEXINGTON,

23 MASSACHUSETTS: Uh, our son, uh, Jacob

24 Parker was only 5-years old and he was

25 enrolled in Estherbrook Elementary School.


17

1 And within a few months he was handed a

2 diversity book bag by his teacher. And in

3 the diversity book bag was a book entitled

4 Who's in the Family by Robert Skutch

5 [phonetic]. And this introduces children

6 to gay marriage and the homosexual

7 relationship. So we went into the schools

8 and found out that they have books like

9 this all throughout the school in every

10 classroom and that there's going to be

11 teacher-initiated discussions with the

12 children to affirm, embrace and even

13 celebrate gay marriage and homosexual

14 relationships. We asked for parental

15 notification before they do it, uh, to let

16 us know so we can talk to our children

17 first or have the option to opt out. They

18 said amazingly, no, you do not have that

19 right. Even though there's a parental

20 notification law in Massachusetts. They

21 stoked a fire of a protective nature of

22 parents. We had asked for 3.5 months and

23 it came to one meeting where we could not

24 bear it any longer. And we took a stand.

25 And we said that you must give us this


18

1 information. They said they wouldn't. I

2 said I'm prepared to sit here all night

3 until we get accommodation for just our 5-

4 year old boy. The accommodation they gave

5 was to arrest me, put me in handcuffs

6 behind my back and take me to the Lexington

7 Jail, then banned me from my own

8 Kindergartner's school.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: What happened after that?

11 MR. PARKER, LEXINGTON, MASSACHUSETTS:

12 We had to fight the, uh, criminal trespass

13 charge but then we filed a, uh, uh, a civil

14 Federal lawsuit and that worked its way up

15 all the way to the Supreme Court who just

16 recently refused to hear this very

17 important parental rights case. And all

18 along the way, when they rejected our case,

19 judge after judge said gay marriage is

20 legal in Massachusetts. Gay marriage is

21 legal in Massachusetts. We can teach it to

22 the children. This is a civil rights issue.

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: Just to let you know this is--this

25 is very, very serious. I was, uh, in a


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1 debate on the, uh, channel on the TV

2 channels up in Los Angeles. And I was up

3 against, it turned out it was supposed to

4 be two versus two, but it turned out to be

5 three versus one. And one of the

6 individuals I was up against was an atheist

7 attorney who is a First Amendment

8 specialist, Constitutional specialist. I

9 brought up your case and the scope of that

10 and showed the complete trouncing of

11 freedoms. And this so-called civic-minded

12 person who cared about our freedom so much

13 according to all he--what he said before,

14 when he heard your case, he says well, of

15 course we had to do that. Of course we had

16 to force homosexuality to be taught in--

17 taught to Kindergartners. "That's the only

18 way", an exact quote, "that's the only way

19 we can end prejudice". In other words you

20 are people of prejudice but he--he alone

21 and his ilk have the truth.

22 MR. PARKER, LEXINGTON, MASSACHUSETTS:

23 Exactly--

24 MRS. TONYA PARKER, LEXINGTON,

25 MASSACHUSETTS: [Interposing] Yeah.


20

1 MR. PARKER, LEXINGTON, MASSACHUSETTS:

2 --and what is going on is you have, uh,

3 people forcing their will and forcing their

4 worldview and beliefs not only on you as

5 citizens but now on the youngest, most

6 impressionable children who they know very

7 well are very easy to manipulate and--and

8 indoctrinate into their belief system,

9 behind your back and against their will.

10 And if you take a stand, they're willing to

11 do everything they can to--to undermine

12 your parental authority. Parental rights

13 are at stake here and the rights of--to

14 defend the childrens' innocence. And we

15 have got to take a stand. And one of the

16 ways you do it in a major way, in the

17 coming days, is voting yes on Prop 8.

18 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

19 CHURCH: This is an educated man. He has a

20 PhD in chemistry. His wife is a chemist as

21 well, highly educated people quite capable

22 of managing their home but they are telling

23 you, you have no right to shape and mold

24 the thinking of your child.

25 MR. PARKER, LEXINGTON, MASSACHUSETTS:


21

1 They--they are usurping, um, the primary

2 directorship, uh, that the parents have in

3 guiding the upbringing and moral education

4 of your own children. They are undermining

5 that authority. And they're using the

6 public schools because they know the

7 children are a captive audience before

8 teachers that are very powerful authority

9 figures in a--in a child's life. And they

10 know this. And they're leveraging it.

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: What has it cost you so far

13 legally?

14 MR. PARKER, LEXINGTON, MASSACHUSETTS:

15 It has cost over $200,000 in legal fees.

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: He did not know I was going to say

18 this and he didn't ask for this, but go to

19 DavidParkerFund.org, DavidParkerFund.org

20 and let's see if we cannot help--help that

21 with the tremendous cost that--that you

22 have at this time. And there are--I was

23 doing a debate on a local station here in

24 San Diego and the No on 8 Leader says oh

25 it'll never happen here. That won't happen


22

1 here. We've have opt-out policies. Well

2 of course you do to. And I tried to make

3 my case before them. The level of

4 dishonesty is--is pretty astounding.

5 Here's--I have before me the Palmdale case

6 of 2005 in which it in effect says parents

7 do not have a fundamental right or idea on

8 how to run the school or how the public

9 school should do what it does. Very clear

10 in a case here in California already. In

11 the newspaper a few days ago, teachers

12 union gave $1 million to No on 8, it had

13 already given $250,000 but the California

14 Teachers Association just gave $1 million

15 more. And then this I got as a brochure,

16 California Association of Teachers of

17 English, California Association of Teachers

18 of English, they have their 50th Annual

19 Convention coming. It's going to be in

20 February. Right up here is a section on

21 the seven program strands. One of the

22 seven program strands right here is how to

23 teach lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgendered

24 themes and work it into the curriculum.

25 This is from their website. You can go on


23

1 the website, California Association of

2 Teachers of English, and you'll find this

3 very thing on the website as well. I want

4 to compliment you for standing the way you

5 have stood. You have taken a beating. You

6 were informed that you had to leave the

7 school.

8 MR. PARKER, LEXINGTON, MASSACHUSETTS:

9 Right, uh, they told us, the judges said

10 that the solution is for you to segregate

11 yourselves from the public schools. I can

12 remember when segregation used to be the

13 problem, but for this civil rights movement

14 it's the solution.

15 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

16 CHURCH: Thank you--

17 [Applause]

18 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

19 CHURCH: --to David and Tonya Parker.

20 Stand firm. Go for it. Thank you. Now

21 listen. We have, I interviewed them, I

22 interviewed them last night for about 40

23 minutes. We're going to have it on a site

24 you can go to. ProtectMarriageCA, CA as in

25 California, ProtectMarriageCA.com. and you


24

1 can hear the whole 40 minutes. But more

2 importantly, most people aren't going to

3 sit down and listen to this incredible

4 story for 40 minutes, but there's a

5 shortened version of it done by Tony

6 Perkins. It will be on our website as well.

7 We have put that out recently. Over

8 200,000 people have seen and heard their

9 story in the last few days. We want to get

10 that in front of 1 million people across

11 California, from computer to computer by

12 November the 4th. Will you help do that?

13 [Applause]

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: Go to Protect Marriage--

16 [Applause]

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: Go to ProtectMarriageCA and it'll

19 be there for you to see. Well these--even

20 the secularists get it on this. They

21 understand. Parents ought to be the ones

22 to teach this. So help us Nazareth.

23 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes.

24 This is a very sad thing. But I mean, you

25 know, the sign for this, I mean I have


25

1 children and if they heard this they'd go...

2 and this is scary. So C--so C would be

3 like that. And to help us with the ABC's

4 my Amish brother here, right here, I didn't

5 know there's Amish people in San Diego--

6 [Laughter]

7 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --yes,

8 yes, please stand up. Can you help us?

9 What is A for? What is the sign for the A?

10 MALE VOICE 2: Bad judges should be

11 abolished.

12 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: No, no,

13 no, activist judges.

14 [Laughter]

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: A for--

16 MALE VOICE 2: [Interposing] No, those four should be--

17 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

18 [Interposing] A for what?

19 MALE VOICE 2: A for abolish judges.

20 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

21 Activist judges--

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: [Interposing] No, no.

24 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --B

25 for?
26

1 MALE VOICE 2: Benefits.

2 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: And C

3 for?

4 MALE VOICE 2: Children.

5 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

6 Children. Yes. Thank you so much.

7 MALE VOICE 2: You're welcome.

8 [Laughter, applause]

9 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: I know.

10 [Music]

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: Next time don't pick the Amish.

13 That isn't working for you--

14 [Laughter]

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: - - .

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: Let's go with the Mennonites next

18 time. Okay. They're good people. They're

19 good people. D, dads and moms. Every

20 little boy and little girl deserves a daddy

21 and a mommy.

22 AUDIENCE: Yes.

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: Let's let the experts talk to us.

25 Let's go to the screen right now--


27

1 [Applause]

2 [Music]

3
4 DR. JENNIFER ROBACK MORSE

5 RUTH INSTITUTE

6 DR. JENNIFER ROBACK MORSE: The function of marriage is to

7 attach mothers and fathers to one another

8 and mothers and fathers to their children,

9 especially fathers to children. And that's

10 what marriage has always done in every

11 known society. That's what--that's what

12 marriage has done--

13 MR. GLENN STANTON, FOCUS ON THE

14 FAMILY: [Interposing] All throughout time-

15 -

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: [Interposing] And why is that

18 important?

19 DR. MORSE, RUTH INSTITUTE: That's--

20 it's important because children need and in

21 fact long for relationship with both of

22 those biological parents. We're already

23 seeing, for instance, the first generation

24 of children who were born through, uh,

25 anonymous sperm donors. Those kids are


28

1 growing up and they're now saying, you know,

2 it was really weird for me, never having a

3 dad. When my friends got divorced I was

4 actually kind of jealous because my friends

5 at least got to visit their dad. I never

6 even knew who my dad was. I never got to

7 have a dad whatsoever. So we're--all of

8 the problems that we know about

9 fatherlessness, we're compounding.

10
11 GLEN STANTON, FOCUS ON THE FAMILY

12 GLEN STANTON:Same sex marriage would reduce every man to

13 a mere sperm donor. Not in practice but in

14 theory because if you want a man for your

15 family, that's fine if you want one. Just

16 like you'd like vanilla or chocolate ice

17 cream. But if you don't want one, you

18 don't have to have one. And we know that

19 fatherlessness has caused significant

20 problems for a whole generation of children

21 and same-sex marriage would send us more in

22 that direction of intentionally fatherless

23 homes.

24 DR. MORSE, RUTH INSTITUTE: Basically

25 what we're saying is that, uh, adults are


29

1 entitled to have their genetic offspring,

2 if they want to, even if that involves

3 getting an anonymous sperm donor. But kids,

4 oh, kids are not entitled to a genetic

5 relationship with their genetic parents.

6 That, it's just optional for kids. So

7 parents get to--adults get to have what

8 they want, kids have--get to take whatever

9 we give them.

10
11 FATHER RICHARD NEUHAUS, ROMAN CATHOLIC

12 PRIEST

13
14 FATHER NEUHAUS: In the case that for many, many

15 people, they think if something is legal is

16 must be moral. If it's legal it's okay.

17 MS. ANA SAMUEL, LECTURER, PRINCETON

18 UNIVERSITY

19 MS SAMUEL: Laws can have a tremendous

20 effect on the way we view marriage and if

21 we have same-sex marriage legalized, it's

22 really giving implicitly our political

23 blessing to this thing. It's not just kind

24 of an it's okay. It's an affirmation that

25 it's just as good. And then we're going to


30

1 have this society that eventually is going

2 to come to believe it over generations.

3
4 REV. WILLIAM DEVLIN, PASTOR, MANHATTAN

5 BIBLE CHURCH

6
7 REVEREND DEVLIN:For the benefit of the

8 children, for the benefit of society and

9 also for the benefit of the man and woman

10 who are involved in that relationship,

11 marriage must be, must be defined as

12 between one man and one woman for life.

13
14 REP. MICHELLE BACHMAN, R-MN 2006

15
16 REP. BACHMAN: Oftentimes we'll think there's not a lot we

17 can do for America. I'm just one person.

18 But if we do our best to be a good husband

19 or a good wife and have a strong marriage,

20 that provides the foundation not only for

21 great kids but for a great society. And

22 the--when we focus on the smallest unit of

23 government which is the family, making that

24 strong in our own back yard, that's really

25 what the founders said that America would


31

1 be all about, self-government. Because

2 when we can rightly govern our--ourselves,

3 the nation takes care of itself. So if we

4 have strong, well-grounded families we will

5 have a strong, well-grounded nation.

6
7 MS. MAGGIE GALLAGHER, PRESIDENT

8 INSTITUTE FOR MARRIAGE AND PUBLIC POLICY

9
10 MS. GALLAGHER: If you have your governments and your laws

11 teaching the next generation including in

12 grade school children in public schools

13 that two men in a union are just the same

14 as a husband and wife, that's a really

15 important cultural shift. It's going to be

16 very hard to teach the next generation that

17 children need a mother and father when our

18 own government has defined that ideal as a

19 form of bigotry.

20 [Music]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: Now we're up here, we're up to the

23 letter D now. I didn't even, uh, point out

24 that it's not Vanna White; it's my wife,

25 Carol, that's changing these cards for us.


32

1 [Applause]

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: As we go. So Nazareth, we're up

4 to four letters. You--can we--can we

5 remember four letters? Help us out.

6 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes.

7 Uh, we've got the letter D. And if it's

8 for fathers and dads, I know I'm embracing,

9 a hug would be with a--uh, A. J. here is a

10 Samoan friend. Can you embrace yourself?

11 'Cause you can't hug me because that will

12 defeat the whole proposition but--

13 [Laughter]

14 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: So if--

15 can you stand up? What is the D for?

16 MALE VOICE 3: Dads and moms.

17 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes.

18 Can you embrace yourself? You need help?

19 Uh, no.

20 [Laughter]

21 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Just

22 hug yourself. Yes that's embracing--

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: [Interposing] Let's hear it for

25 him--
33

1 [Applause, laughter]

2 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: -- - -

3 hug. So D is for - - thank you brother. I

4 know I'm going to die later.

5 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

6 CHURCH: Letter E, letter E, now are you

7 remembering these so far?

8 AUDIENCE: Yes.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: Huh?

11 AUDIENCE: Yes.

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: Okay. Nazareth, I'm not sure

14 about that. You're going to have to--we--

15 one of these times we're going to have to

16 go through all of them--

17 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

18 [Interposing] Okay what's A for?

19 AUDIENCE: Activist judges.

20 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: B.

21 AUDIENCE: Benefits.

22 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: C.

23 AUDIENCE: Children.

24 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: D.

25 AUDIENCE: Dads and moms.


34

1
2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: [Interposing] You're doing pretty good. You're a good

4 teacher--

5 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

6 [Interposing] Thank you.

7 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

8 CHURCH: [Interposing] Good teacher.

9 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Thank

10 you Sir.

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: Letter E, letter E. Everywhere.

13 In every culture. Marriage has been the

14 fundamental building block, one man/one

15 woman, whether it's a Christian culture, a

16 pre-Christian culture, a post-Christian

17 culture, an anti-Christian culture, a non-

18 Christian culture, in every culture. And

19 there's a reason for that. The reason is

20 simply because it works. Now ironically in

21 those places where same-sex marriage is

22 legalized, ironically marriage rates begin

23 to plummet. Why would that be? And where

24 you change the definition of marriage once,

25 what's to keep you from changing it twice?


35

1 And three times, and four times, and you

2 end up with all kinds of odd combinations.

3 Now one of the things that's been so

4 offensive that the other side has tried to

5 do, has tried to equate the permission for

6 same-sex people to marry with those who are

7 biracial, multi-racial marriages. Bob and

8 Jan Hughes, pastors here on the church

9 staff here at Skyline, step up here if you

10 would. And I want you to talk to us about

11 that. What do--what goes through your

12 heart and mind? Who wants to talk first

13 when you hear those kinds of comparisons

14 made? As the Connecticut Supreme Court

15 just recently made that and said same-sex

16 marriage has got to be legal because

17 interracial marriage is now legal.

18
19 BOB & JAN HUGHES SKYLINE CHURCH PASTORS

20 MR. BOB HUGHES SKYLINE CHURCH PASTOR:

21 You cannot compare the discrimination that

22 was experienced of those of us who are up

23 against--against interracial marriage in

24 this country and compare it with same-sex

25 marriage. It's not right. It's wrong.


36

1 It's just--it's just wrong. God ordained

2 marriage between a man and a woman. And

3 even when interracial marriage was seen and

4 authorized as legal, it's still God's

5 pattern. And it doesn't violate God's law.

6 Same-sex marriage does.

7 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

8 CHURCH: Jan, what do you want to add to

9 that?

10 MRS. JAN HUGHES, SKYLINE CHURCH

11 PASTOR: There's nowhere in the Bible where

12 interracial marriage is forbidden. In fact,

13 um, when there used to be laws in this

14 country that forbid interracial marriage,

15 that was discrimination. But it's the

16 Bible itself that does condemn homosexual

17 actions. This isn't a matter of

18 discrimination against homosexual marriage.

19 This is an issue where we're taking a moral

20 stand against an issue that the Bible

21 explicitly forbids. So do not condemn my

22 God-ordained marriage on an issue that God

23 labels as sin.

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: Hear them carefully because when


37

1 interracial marriage laws went down, it

2 opened the door for God's pattern, what Bob

3 said, of more men and more women to marry.

4 A man and a woman, which is God's pattern.

5 Praise God that law was thrown aside.

6 Thank you Bob and Jan Hughes for your

7 sharing on this as well--

8 [Applause]

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: Let's go to Maggie Gallagher.

11 Maggie Gallagher, I hope you're available

12 to hear us right now. Talk to us about

13 this issue that everywhere, in every

14 culture, the fundamental building block has

15 been one man/one woman.

16
17 MAGGIE GALLAGHER, INSTITUTE

18 FOR MARRIAGE AND PUBLIC POLICY

19
20 MS. GALLAGHER: Yeah

21 marriage is a virtually universal human

22 social institution. Everywhere in--in

23 jungles and in the desert and--and, uh, you

24 know, down in--in the Steppes of Asia,

25 human beings over and over again come up


38

1 with this basic marriage idea. And it's

2 got a certain shape to it. It's a public

3 union, not just a person one, it's a sexual

4 union not some other kind of union between

5 male and female, not some other kind of

6 union. And, um, the thing you really have

7 to ask yourself is why is it, over and over

8 again; I mean those of us who know about

9 God's law but even those who don't know

10 about God's law, it's manifested over and

11 over again. Why? And I think that when

12 you ask the question the answer is not hard

13 to find. Marriage exists in every known

14 culture because every culture if it's going

15 to survive has to deal with three basic

16 facts which is that men and women are

17 powerfully attracted to an act that creates

18 new human life, so sex between men and

19 women makes babies. You need babies. Only

20 those societies that manage the procreative

21 implications of male/female sexual

22 attraction survive. And children need a

23 father as well as a mother. Those three

24 ideas are the heart of marriage. Not only

25 in our own culture but in every known human


39

1 society because these unions of male and

2 female where men and women come together

3 and promise each other sexual faithfulness

4 so they can raise their children together,

5 to share their resources, these are

6 necessary relationships to the whole

7 society and in a way that no other kind of

8 adult relationship is.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: Thank you Maggie Gallagher for

11 what you are doing for the State of

12 California--

13 [Applause]

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: --we praise God --

16 MS. GALLAGHER: [Interposing] God bless you---

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: --for you.

19 MS. GALLAGHER: God bless you.

20 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

21 CHURCH: Bless you.

22 MS. GALLAGHER: Bless all of you.

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: My very good friends Sean and

25 Laurie Mitchell, Pastors of New Venture


40

1 Christian Fellowship in Oceanside, he was

2 one of the first ones, the early ones that

3 jumped on board as we went for this, in

4 this campaign for Prop 8. Uh, Shawn, one

5 of the things that's interesting is how

6 often the homosexual moment tries to

7 compare their journey with the civil rights

8 movement. Talk to me about that.

9
10 SHAWN & LORI MITCHELL

11 NEW VENTURE CHURCH

12
13 MR. SHAWN MITCHELL, NEW VENTURE

14 CHURCH: What does concern me hearing about

15 all this tonight, it is in my mind in a

16 cultural battle. We are in the midst of a

17 spiritual war. And the gay agenda is

18 taking gay rights and now saying that it

19 actually is a civil right. We've got to

20 recognize that a civil right is by birth,

21 but gay rights are solely founded on one's

22 sexual and bedroom preference. So there's

23 a great difference. My church up in

24 Oceanside, New Venture Christian Fellowship,

25 we've got about, uh, in our community 65%


41

1 are, uh, Caucasian. We've got about 8%

2 Black, 22% Hispanic, 5% Pacific Asian. We

3 also have in our church folks who have

4 wrestled with homosexuality and lesbianism

5 and have given themselves to the cross of

6 Jesus Christ, said I do to Jesus and are

7 now living a heterosexual lifestyle. So

8 we've got ex-gays and ex-lesbians but in

9 our church you won't find an ex-black. And

10 there--

11 [Laughter]

12 MR. MITCHELL, NEW VENTURE CHURCH: --

13 and I mean it ain't going to happen. You

14 know. Hah.

15 [Laughter, applause.]

16 MR. MITCHELL, NEW VENTURE CHURCH: You

17 know, Jim, it's really funny to me, you

18 know, the word says cannot the Ethiopian

19 change his skin or the leopard his spots.

20 Outside of Michael Jackson, no, you know?

21 [Laughter]

22 MR. MITCHELL, NEW VENTURE CHURCH: So

23 but--but the real deal here is, is that you

24 cannot equate, uh--uh--um, um, the sin of

25 homosexuality and then--and apply it to


42

1 skin. And when--we begin to think of

2 homosexual--we love them as people. All of

3 us know folks who are homosexual but we've

4 got to call it what it is. It is sin. And

5 we need to pray for them and love them,

6 nurture them. But recognize that God's

7 grace is available to all. And I'm so

8 grateful that it is.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: Awesome, awesome, good words--

11 [Applause]

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: Laurie, what--what would--what

14 would you add to this Laurie?

15 MRS. LORI MITCHELL, NEW VENTURE

16 CHURCH: Well I'll probably, uh, take off

17 on what Jan had mentioned earlier about the

18 laws being changed for blacks and whites.

19 It's now legal and I'm glad it was.

20 [Laughter]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: Very good. Married how many

23 years?

24 MRS. MITCHELL, NEW VENTURE CHURCH: 21.

25 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE


43

1 CHURCH: 21 wonderful years.

2 [Applause]

3 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

4 CHURCH: Shawn and Lori Mitchell.

5 Blessings on you. Now what we've covered

6 so far works especially the first three

7 really work when you talk even to un-church

8 people. You talk to secular people. They

9 get the first three. And many of them get

10 the next two. So we're up to five now.

11 Nazareth where are you? Let's see if we

12 can--

13 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

14 [Interposing] Well I--

15 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

16 CHURCH: --cover all five.

17 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --have

18 to say to Pastor Shawn I'm an ex-Middle

19 Eastern. I'm Mexican now.

20 [Laughter]

21 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: So

22 thank--I--I've got my friend here, how are

23 you Sir?

24 DARRYL: I'm well thank you.

25 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: What is


44

1 your name?

2 DARRYL: Darryl.

3 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Darryl,

4 nice to meet you Darryl. Okay the E is

5 going to be everywhere. So we're going to

6 do the globe sign. Everywhere. Do it like

7 Arnold. I go around the country and tell

8 people, hey I'm from California and my

9 governor can beat your governor anytime.

10 So E for everywhere. Okay so A is for

11 what?

12 AUDIENCE: Activist.

13 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: B.

14 AUDIENCE: Benefits.

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: C.

16 AUDIENCE: Children.

17 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: D.

18 AUDIENCE: Dads and moms.

19 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: And E?

20 AUDIENCE: Everywhere.

21 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Thank

22 you.

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: Oh you're a good teacher, doing

25 well. Way to go.


45

1 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Thank

2 you.

3 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

4 CHURCH: Thanks Nazareth.

5 [Applause]

6 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: You're

7 welcome.

8 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

9 CHURCH: The next letter is F. This is an

10 important one. We're going to slow down on

11 this letter F for a moment. It stands for

12 freedoms. It stands for the loss of

13 freedoms. In countries where same-sex

14 marriage is legal, pastors, churches,

15 business persons, parents are losing their

16 freedom. Now they will try to tell us to

17 the contrary. They will look at our Yes on

18 8 television ads and say they're lies. But

19 in every historical example we have,

20 Massachusetts, we'll talk about New Jersey

21 in a moment. We'll talk about Sweden in a

22 moment. In every one of these examples

23 rights have been crushed under every time

24 same-sex marriage is legal. Some pastors

25 have been threatened with jail. Many have


46

1 been muzzled and silenced. Churches have

2 been threatened and intimidated and parents

3 like we've already heard and business

4 persons as well. Now when they're honest

5 they admit this. This is ultimately really

6 not about marriage and homosexuality at its

7 core. At its core is they have found a

8 loophole hiding under the guise of civil

9 rights by which they can put underfoot and

10 crush underfoot the rights of every person

11 who has a Biblical worldview. That is what

12 is at stake. They know it. And let me

13 just go to one individual. Watch Sarah.

14 Sarah Asplin. Watch what she said. She

15 gets it.

16
17 MS. SARAH ASPLIN, 2007-08 PRESIDENT, U.

18 C. DAVIS LAW STUDENTS ASSOCIATION

19
20 WHAT LEGALIZING SAME SEX MARRIAGE MEANS TO

21 GAYS AND LESBIANS

22
23 SARAH ASPLIN: I am

24 the President of the Law School. Or I just

25 was, I just graduated, yeah that's me. The


47

1 decision that, uh, gave us the right to

2 marry today in fact was even more sweeping

3 that just give marriages. What it

4 effectively did was it gave gays and

5 lesbians protection under the law that will

6 extend to other areas of the law such as

7 employment and other contexts. Uh, and so

8 it is actually an even bigger deal that it

9 seems on its face. It's not just about

10 getting married it's about all sorts of

11 ways that we can protect people in the

12 community.

13 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

14 CHURCH: Gavin Newsome, the Mayor of San

15 Francisco openly admits that if we lose on

16 Proposition 8 it will set us back by an

17 entire decade in our other agenda items.

18 Another one said it could set us back 25

19 years, an entire generation if we lose on 8

20 they're saying. They get it. Those that

21 are on the inner core are savvy. They know

22 what's at stake here. It's your freedom.

23 It's my freedom. And to give some more

24 examples, let's go to Bob Tyler, an

25 attorney. Bob Tyler, tell us your story.


48

1
2 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY

3
4 MR. TYLER:Well,

5 uh, I'll tell you about this case, you know,

6 first of all it's so important to

7 understand that the--the move against us as

8 Christians is--there's an attempt by the--

9 by the homosexual lobby to not only censor

10 us but to suppress our free exercise of

11 religion. And it's more--it's so evident

12 in this case where we have two physicians,

13 many of you know about this, uh, where they

14 were sued by a lesbian woman. Uh, this is

15 our case. We went all the way up to the

16 California Supreme Court and the issue is

17 whether or not the lesbian woman's rights,

18 uh, based on the California Unrest

19 [phonetic] Civil Rights Act, that

20 supposedly prevents discrimination, whether

21 they trump the religious liberty of these

22 two physicians. This case is so

23 significant. The California Supreme Court

24 came back and said that the re--that the

25 religious liberty, based upon the First


49

1 Amendment of the United States Constitution

2 is trumped by this lesbian--lesbian woman's

3 right not to be discriminated against which

4 is based upon state law. It's just

5 incredible.

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: I was in an interview, uh, with an

8 individual and I referenced the fact that a

9 professional cannot, based upon this case,

10 a professional cannot refuse services, uh,

11 in spite of their own religious convictions.

12 And she says well--and I said that could

13 apply to doctors which is does in this case

14 and to pastors whereupon she says well

15 certainly not to pastors. You have right of

16 free expression, First Amendment. I said

17 no. I also offer services, they're called

18 weddings. And if I cannot refuse on the

19 basis of religious convictions to pro--

20 provide services I could be forced and some

21 day will if Proposition 8 does not pass,

22 someday will be forced to do this.

23 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: That's

24 right. It applies, this case, this

25 decision is one of the most significant


50

1 decisions in the country, uh, after the

2 same-sex marriage decision. It's so

3 important, please pray for it. But it goes

4 far beyond just physicians practicing in

5 medicine. It goes to ministers. It goes

6 to whether or not our rights to free

7 exercise will trump, uh, the homosexuals'

8 attempt to take away our tax-exempt status.

9 It goes so far beyond, uh, and it goes--and

10 it applies to every one of you in this room

11 and to everyone listening. It goes to all

12 of your professions and to all of your

13 businesses.

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: Chuck Limandri you have another

16 case. Talk to us about that one.

17
18 MR. CHUCK LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY

19 18

20 MR. LIMANDRI: Happy to do so Pastor Jim. I

21 have the privilege of representing four

22 courageous Christian firefighters who were

23 ordered against their will last year to be

24 in the San Diego--

25 [Applause]
51

1 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: --

2 gay pride parade.

3 [Applause]

4 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY:

5 Thank you very much. And they stood up to

6 the City of San Diego so that this won't

7 happen to any other San Diego firefighters

8 in the future. They were, during the

9 course of the 3-hour parade subjected to

10 literally dozens of sexually harassing

11 comments and lewd gestures and public

12 nudity and things that I just don't want to

13 mention in this context and in detail. But

14 it was terrible for them particularly as

15 family men with, uh, kids. So they filed a

16 sexual harassment case against the city.

17 They also filed a First Amendment action

18 for free speech because under our State

19 Constitution you can't be compelled to

20 speak and being in a parade is considered a

21 form of expressive conduct which should be

22 protected speech. On the sexual harassment

23 case which was tried to a jur--jury earlier

24 this month, we got 8 out of 12 votes in the

25 regular jury plus all 3 alternates but we


52

1 needed 9 votes on the regular jury so we're

2 going to retry that case in January. One

3 vote short, we're very confident we're

4 going to win next time. The eight jurors

5 in the majority told us some of the minor

6 points the dissenters were focusing on and,

7 uh, again we're confident we're going to

8 prevail. On the free speech, uh, claim,

9 the judge ruled because my clients are

10 government employees they don't have the

11 same, uh, constitutional protections as

12 everybody else and their personal religious

13 beliefs, and there was a lot of anti-

14 religious, uh, comments and sentiments in

15 the, uh, in the parade and demonstrations

16 and of course a lot of people promoting

17 same-sex marriage in the parade they didn't

18 agree with. Nonetheless the judge ruled

19 that's just their personal opinions. It's

20 not a matter of public interest. It's not

21 constitutionally protected. Now that

22 decision applies to any government employee

23 in the State of California. They could be

24 ordered into a gay pride parade or any

25 political event that they don't agree with.


53

1 So we're confident that's going to be

2 overturned. We're appealing that. We

3 think we're going to end up with some good

4 law favoring the religious community by the

5 time we're done with that so keep us in

6 your prayers, please--

7 [Applause]

8 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

9 CHURCH: You were going to ask about--we

10 were going to ask about the cost. What it

11 has cost.

12 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY:

13 What has it cost?

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: But what--what did it--what did it

16 cost the two doctors to try to defend their

17 right?

18 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: You

19 know, at--at this point in time what the

20 doctors are facing, we're--we're hoping

21 that the US Supreme Court will take the

22 case, uh, should we lose, these doctors

23 could be facing well over $1 million in

24 attorney's fees, and tell me that's not

25 persecution.
54

1 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

2 CHURCH: Anything you want to add to that?

3 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY:

4 Yeah. Well since we went through a free--

5 uh--a full trial and had dozens of

6 depositions and such the legal fee's over

7 $900,000. the actual costs my firm has

8 advanced have been close to $100,000.

9 We're talking about $1 million in fees and

10 costs so far.

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: This is what happens when same-sex

13 marriage becomes legal. A lot of us become

14 illegal. Thank you. Let's hear another

15 story. Thank you men for what you're doing.

16 [Applause]

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: Come on over here if you would, uh,

19 Jonathan and Elaine Huguenin. This young

20 couple, this young couple is--they're

21 professionals. He was a--in the military.

22 Eight weeks ago, uh, they gave birth to

23 their firstborn. He came out of the

24 military at that time but also in the midst

25 of all this over these last couple of years,


55

1 you as a professional photographer received

2 an email one day that has changed your

3 lives. What happened?

4
5 MS. ELAINE HUGUENIN, NEW MEXICO

6 PHOTOGRAPHER

7 MS. HUGUENIN: Uh, yeah, we started, um,

8 our business a few years ago and, uh,

9 around that time we got an email from, uh,

10 a lady who had asked us to shoot her same-

11 sex ceremony and celebrate with her. And

12 so we declined, um, and then got a phone

13 call from the New Mexico, uh, Department of

14 Human Rights, um, Division saying that

15 there had been a complaint filed against us.

16 And uh, we either needed too--either needed

17 to find an attorney or do mediation.

18 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

19 CHURCH: So what does mediation mean?

20 MR. JONATHAN HUGUENIN, NEW MEXICO

21 PHOTOGRAPHER: Well we had the option of

22 going to litigation or talking things out

23 which was essentially, uh, us saying that

24 we're sorry and apologizing for declining

25 to shoot that. And then paying a, uh, fee,


56

1 um, with our apology. So we decided to, uh,

2 locate an attorney. And, uh, it was a

3 little scary for us because we're not a big

4 photography corporation. It's us. And, uh

5 [chuckling]--

6 [Laughter]

7 MR. HUGUENIN NEW MEXICO PHOTOGRAPHER:

8 --we, uh, contacted the Alliance Defense

9 Fund and Jordan Lawrence who you see on the

10 screen there, uh, is our attorney. And

11 they've been representing us so far.

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: And what's the status of it now?

14 Update it for us.

15 MRS. HUGUENIN NEW MEXICO PHOTOGRAPHER:

16 Um, they ruled against us and so we are--

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: [Interposing] At the first level.

19 MRS. HUGUENIN NEW MEXICO PHOTOGRAPHER:

20 Yeah. And the hearing that we had in

21 January. And so we're appealing, um, and

22 just kind of waiting for the next--

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: [Interposing] What was the

25 consequences? Did they fine you? Did they


57

1 threaten jail?

2 MRS. HUGUENIN NEW MEXICO PHOTOGRAPHER:

3 Um, $6,700 in attorney's fees.

4 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

5 CHURCH: $6,700 and attorney's fees?

6 MRS. HUGUENIN NEW MEXICO PHOTOGRAPHER:

7 In attorney's fees.

8 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

9 CHURCH: In attorney's fees, you've got to

10 pay the other side's attorney's fees? Is

11 that it?

12 MRS. HUGUENIN NEW MEXICO PHOTOGRAPHER:

13 Right.

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: so right now you have an almost

16 $7,000 fine against you at this point.

17 Jordan can you hear me right now?

18
19 MR. JORDAN LORENCE, ALLIANCE DEFENSE

20 FUND

21 JORDAN LORENCE: Hi, I can.

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: What would you pick up and add to

24 this amazing case?

25 JORDAN LORENCE, ALLIANCE DEFENSE FUND


58

1 MR. LORENCE:

2 Well I just want to say--and--and

3 especially for people from the other side

4 that might be listening, we do not make

5 these cases up. That this is--these are

6 the implications of what happens when these

7 laws go into effect--into effect. Uh, uh,

8 these are real people that are before you.

9 We had to defend them in a real live trial

10 before the New Mexico Human Rights

11 Commission. And all they thought they were

12 doing was saying hey, you know, I'm in a

13 live and let live, you can go have your

14 ceremony up in Taos, New Mexico but leave

15 us alone. And instead what happened, they

16 had the full force of the State of New

17 Mexico come down upon them. And we at the

18 Alliance Defense Fund have probably about a

19 half dozen cases that are similar to this

20 going on around the country. Uh, and, uh,

21 I just point out New Mexico does not have

22 legalized same-sex marriage. So I--I would

23 say how much more it will be if it is

24 legalized. That, uh, people, photographers,

25 you know, any regular business owner that


59

1 just simply doesn't want to have anything

2 to do with this, a church that rents out

3 its facilities who doesn't want to do

4 anything about this, they're all going to

5 get sued for discrimination because it's

6 viewed as an affront to say that regular

7 marriage is different than same-sex

8 marriage.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: Does New Mexico have civil unions

11 or domestic partnerships?

12 MR. LORENCE:

13 No they don't have any of that but they do

14 have a law that says that, uh, companies

15 cannot discriminate when doing business

16 with customers, uh, with, uh, on the basis

17 of sexual orientation. And there's a whole

18 spectrum of these kinds of laws. And

19 California has the complete spectrum like

20 when you were hearing, uh, uh, from Chuck

21 and, uh, the other attorney earlier that

22 they were just--they were basically showing

23 that these types of laws can pop up in

24 situations that you never expected. You

25 just think you're living your own life, uh,


60

1 like Elaine and Jon did here and the next

2 thing you know the full force of the state

3 has come down upon you and you're viewed as,

4 uh, some bigot that needs to be punished

5 and to be made an example of.

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: Jordan thank you for joining us

8 from Washington D.C. Jon and Elaine, thank

9 you for being courageous and standing. You

10 could have caved in easily at several

11 points along the way. But with resolve and

12 conviction, straight from the first century

13 of Christianity you said no. We will not.

14 Thank you for doing that. We're proud of

15 you--

16 [Applause]

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: We're excited for you and we await

19 God's blessings upon your lives. Okay.

20 [Applause]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: Jordan, Jordan was right. We

23 don't make these cases up. And we've only

24 touched on a few. There are so many, well

25 just hear a few of them yourself from three


61

1 attorneys right now.

2 MR. DACUS, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: The

3 California Supreme Court decided that the

4 city of Berkeley could withdraw a rent

5 subsidy from the Boy Scouts because of

6 their opposition to homosexuality.

7 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: April

8 2006, San Francisco City Board of

9 Supervisors issued a resolution condemning

10 the Catholic Church's teaching on

11 homosexuality and urging Catholic leaders

12 to defy the Vatican's directive not to

13 place children with same-sex couples.

14 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In

15 June of 2005 a U.S. District Court held

16 that a student's religious speech which

17 opposed the school's endorsement of

18 homosexuality could be banned at the school.

19 MR. DACUS, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In

20 June 2007 the Oakland City government found

21 the words "marriage is a foundation of a

22 natural family and sustains family values"

23 to be a hate crime.

24 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY:

25 February 2008, a public elementary school is


62

1 preparing to accommodate a second grader

2 who was born a boy but now feels that he is

3 a girl. He will dress like a girl and

4 begin using a unisex bathroom.

5 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In

6 June of this year 2008 in Colorado the

7 governor signed a law making it illegal to

8 publish or distribute books, papers or

9 other writings that discriminate against

10 sexual orientation which could effectively

11 outlaw the Bible.

12 MR. DACUS, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In

13 Colorado in June 2008 the governor signed a

14 law making it illegal to deny a person

15 access to restrooms and locker rooms based

16 on the "perception of the person's gender

17 identity."

18 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: August

19 2007, Des Moines YMCA signed a conciliatory

20 agreement with a lesbian couple to change

21 the organization's definition of family to

22 include same-sex couples after the lesbian

23 couple filed a complaint with the city's

24 Human Rights Commission.

25 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In


63

1 Massachusetts in 2004 after gay marriage

2 was legalized, the Justices of Peace were

3 told by the Governor's Office that they

4 must simply follow the law, meaning they

5 were obligated to perform same-sex marriage

6 even if doing so violated their sincerely

7 held religious beliefs.

8 MR. DACUS, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In

9 Massachusetts, March 2006, Catholic

10 Charities was forced out of the adoption

11 business for the first time in 100 years

12 because it would not place children with

13 homosexual couples.

14 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: July

15 2008 in Michigan, a homosexual man sued two

16 Christian publishers for emotional distress

17 due to their versions of the Bible that

18 they--that refer to homosexuality as a sin.

19 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In

20 Virginia a Christian man who owned a video

21 duplication business was ordered to do work

22 for a lesbian activist after the man

23 initially declined to do the work because

24 of his religious views against

25 homosexuality.
64

1 MR. DACUS, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: In

2 Washington D. C., October 2007 the

3 Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff was

4 fired because he publicly expressed his

5 moral views opposing homosexual behavior.

6 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY: Canada

7 2000, a professional printer declined to

8 print material for the Canadian Gay and

9 Lesbian Archives. He was fined and ordered

10 to print the material. He lost his case in

11 both the Ontario Supreme Court and the

12 Ontario Court of Appeal.

13 MR. LIMANDRI, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY:

14 Also in Canada a Catholic high school was

15 forced by the Ontario Supreme Court to

16 allow a homosexual student to take his

17 boyfriend to the prom even though the

18 school has a rule against condoning sexual

19 behavior. So as you can see this is a

20 problem all over the place.

21 MR. TYLER, SAN DIEGO ATTORNEY:

22 Definitely, definitely--

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: [Interposing] Thank you, thank you.

25 The list is actually considerably longer.


65

1 These attorneys could have gone on. I, I

2 just gave them three minutes. I said cover

3 what you can in three minutes of these

4 cases, they could have gone on and on here.

5 Not just the business we've talked about,

6 not just firefighters, not just medical

7 doctors but well into the church if you

8 want to look at Steven Boissoin, B-O-I-S-S-

9 O-I-N, StevenBoissoin.com in Canada. Read

10 what happened to him as a pastor when he

11 wrote a letter to the editor saying the

12 same kind of things that any of us would

13 say who believe the Bible. And the dear

14 price he is paying to this day in that area.

15 But the person who may demonstrate the most

16 of what it means if you speak out on

17 homosexuality of any of the pastors I know

18 occurred in the country of Sweden. The man

19 who's come the farthest, who's come the

20 farthest by far, to be with us tonight is

21 our special guest, Ake [phonetic] Green,

22 All the way from Sweden, would you welcome

23 him here to the United States of America.

24 [Applause, cheering]

25 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE


66

1 CHURCH: What's, uh, the word in Swedish

2 for welcome is what again?

3 INTERPRETER: Van commen.

4 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

5 CHURCH: Van commen. Did I get it right?

6 Let's all say it together on the count of

7 three. One, two, three.

8 AUDIENCE: Van commen.

9 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

10 Absolutely.

11
12 MR. AKE GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR

13 MR GREEN: Thank you very much.

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: I want to know what happened. It

16 started on July the 20th, 2003.

17 MR. GREEN SPEAKING THROUGH AN

18 INTERPRETER: Yes. Well I was preaching a

19 sermon about what the Bible says about

20 homosexuality.

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: And?

23 MR. GREEN SPEAKING THROUGH AN

24 INTERPRETER: And after that they placed

25 charges against me and I had to go to the


67

1 court.

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: Then what happened?

4 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

5 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: And the prosecutor

6 in the courts thought that he had good

7 evidence against me. 'Cause I had taped my

8 sermon and he had that tape. So we asked

9 the judge if he can play the tape in the

10 whole--in the court. And after that they

11 sentenced me to one month in prison.

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: Well wait; wait, back up here a

14 second. Uh, did they play--you asked if

15 they could play the tape, did they play the

16 sermon, the entire sermon, play it in the

17 court?

18 [Crosstalk between interpreter and Mr.

19 Green]

20 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

21 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Yeah they played

22 the whole sermon in 45 minutes.

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: Wow. Now that's a way to get a

25 wider listenership to your sermons.


68

1 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

2 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: It was amazing.

3 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

4 CHURCH: So what'd they rule in that first

5 court hearing after hearing your sermon,

6 what did they rule?

7 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

8 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Well they found me

9 guilty for hate crime.

10 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

11 CHURCH: So what were they going to do?

12 What was the fine or?

13 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

14 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: They sentenced me

15 for one--one month in prison.

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: One month in prison for your hate

18 crime. Did you go serve that time then?

19 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

20 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: No 'cause we

21 appealed to the - - Court and I didn't have

22 to go--

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: [Interposing] So you went to a

25 second court hearing.


69

1 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

2 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Yes I came to the

3 second--the second court--

4 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

5 CHURCH: [Interposing] An appellate court.

6 And what happened at the appellate court?

7 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

8 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Well it was the

9 same prosecutor and he wanted to play the

10 tape again.

11 [Audience chuckling]

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: Back in the same courtroom?

14 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

15 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: But they knew that

16 many people wanted to hear this so they

17 rented a cinema--

18 [Laughter, applause]

19 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

20 CHURCH: So, huh--

21 [Cheering]

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: Let me get this straight. Your

24 sermon--you preached the sermon first on

25 your church and then to a very captive


70

1 audience in a courtroom and then to a

2 packed out cinema. A key question for me

3 as a pastor is did you get to take an

4 offering--

5 [Laughter]

6 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

7 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: No they didn't let

8 me.

9 [Laughter]

10 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

11 CHURCH: Okay so what happened in court

12 trial number two, the appellant court, is

13 in a cinema, what was the result of that

14 one?

15 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

16 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: It was very

17 interesting because the judge, when he was

18 listening to my sermon, he had a--his Bible

19 and looking up all the verses that I was

20 saying in my sermon--

21 [Laughter]

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: That's an interesting way to

24 launch a new ministry.

25 [Laughter]
71

1 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

2 CHURCH: Never heard of this one.

3 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR: I haven't

4 either.

5 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

6 CHURCH: You haven't either. I suppose

7 that's what he said [laughing]. Okay. So

8 we're at--at the conclusion of trial two,

9 what's--what's the verdict?

10 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

11 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Wait, they asked

12 me actually, if--if they would find me

13 guilty if I wanted to have, um, what do you

14 call it where you have this--

15 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

16 CHURCH: [Interposing] Oh the ankle

17 bracelet?

18 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

19 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Ankle bracelet or

20 go to prison. But I said if they find--

21 find me guilty, I'd rather go to prison.

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: Well so--

24 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

25 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: [Interposing] But


72

1 they overturned my conviction.

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: Oh okay.

4 [Applause]

5 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

6 CHURCH: Way to go.

7 [Applause]

8 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

9 CHURCH: So you walk away a free man and

10 that's the end of the story, right?

11 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

12 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Well I went out

13 like a free man but the prosecutor didn't

14 like that.

15 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

16 CHURCH: So what happened?

17 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

18 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: So we appealed to

19 the Supreme Court. They took--took my case.

20 And I had to go to court again. So--but

21 before the court the national TV came to me

22 and asked if they could play my sermon--

23 [Laughter]

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: [Interposing] [Laughing]--


73

1 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

2 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: --and the whole--

3 in the whole of Sweden.

4 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

5 CHURCH: So you were--so sermon gets played,

6 now this is the fourth time, in church and

7 in all these court cases and where does it

8 get played this time?

9 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

10 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: They played it for

11 all--all the Swedish people.

12 [Laughter]

13 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

14 CHURCH: Uh--on--on television?

15 [Crosstalk]

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: TV and radio across the entire

18 country?

19 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

20 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Yeah--

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: [Interposing] Oh my goodness--

23 [Cheering, applause]

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: Well you're the--you're the Billy


74

1 Graham of Sweden.

2 [Laughter]

3 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

4 CHURCH: Okay. Now did the Swedish high

5 court then or the Supreme Court did they

6 find you, uh, acquit you or did they find

7 you guilty?

8 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

9 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: According to the

10 Swedish law the Supreme Court wanted to

11 find me guilty. But they knew--be--because

12 we had said that if they found us guilty we

13 will appeal to the European Union court.

14 So they preferred to find me not guilty and

15 referred to--to the European Union's laws

16 that protect freedom of speech and freedom

17 of religion.

18 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

19 CHURCH: Way to go--

20 [Applause]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: --way to go.

23 [Applause]

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: Are you--you're telling this story


75

1 far and wide. Are you able to travel and

2 go to other countries?

3 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

4 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Yeah, I have had

5 the opportunity to--to tell this in other

6 countries.

7 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

8 CHURCH: As you were talking, um, Ake, I

9 believe that you need to pray. I need--I

10 need you to look in one of these cameras,

11 the camera straight in front. There are

12 people gathered in probably around 170

13 church auditoriums across the state. And

14 then there are thousands of people watching

15 you at their individual computers. But I'm

16 particularly concerned for pastors. I want

17 you to pray, a spirit of boldness upon

18 California pastors, a spirit of boldness--

19 [Applause]

20 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

21 CHURCH: Now let's go a phrase at a time

22 and he'll interpret a phrase at a time.

23 MR. GREEN, SWEDISH PASTOR, SPEAKING

24 THROUGH AN INTERPRETER: Father in heaven I

25 pray that you touch our hearts that we


76

1 shall experience your spirit and your

2 strength and let us experience your

3 anointing. I believe that you should shed

4 this all over your servants, that you give

5 your servants boldness, for those who you

6 equip--for those you choose as servants,

7 you keep those, you protect them. And I

8 pray for boldness, great boldness over all

9 your pastors in this country. Lord, bless

10 all churches that want to stand for you.

11 Let your kingdom expand that all demons fly

12 away from your power. In praise of Jesus'

13 name, amen.

14 AUDIENCE: Amen.

15 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

16 CHURCH: Amen.

17 [Applause]

18 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

19 CHURCH: Ake Green, thank you. Thank you.

20 Thank you. Bless you, bless you. You are

21 wonderful. Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful.

22 Thank you. Thank you. You're a hero. I'm

23 telling you. Tell him he's a hero to us.

24 Tell him he's a hero to us. You are.

25 [Applause, music]
77

1 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

2 CHURCH: Be seated. Let me just talk to

3 the pastors, pastors who are listening

4 right now, you're where you are because you

5 are bold and courageous but I want to

6 encourage you to challenge other pastors.

7 Pastoring has changed. It's changed

8 enormously. The number one ingredient that

9 causes people to compromise is when their

10 desire for respectability from other

11 persons outweighs their reverent fear of

12 God. We must fear God more than man.

13 Whatever it costs us, we've read about the

14 great saints. We've extolled them. We

15 sing songs about how wonderful they are and

16 sermon illustrations. Now God has given us

17 an incredible opportunity to be like one of

18 them. So pastors and Christian leaders,

19 let's stand and may the spirit of Ake Green

20 fall on us all. He didn't want this. He

21 didn't choose this. He kept saying why

22 won't somebody challenge this wicked law.

23 Why won't somebody challenge it? He went

24 for months and finally God said, you. You

25 stand up and that's why he did what he did.


78

1 God give us more just like him in

2 California and across America right now.

3 [Applause, cheering]

4 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

5 CHURCH: There have been--there have been

6 so many interviews that I've done where I

7 refer to Ake Green and they will say but

8 yeah that's Sweden and they'll cut me off

9 oftentimes right then. I say wait a minute,

10 wait a minute. If you're going to cut that

11 one off let me take you to Ocean Grove, New

12 Jersey. Now I did my last two degrees in

13 the State of New Jersey. I love New Jersey.

14 Carol and I just really enjoyed that state

15 immensely. But along the ocean there's a

16 beautiful little town, it's one square mile,

17 it's called Ocean Grove, New Jersey. A

18 breathtaking camp meeting. It started

19 about 1869. A part of my doctoral

20 dissertation was done on the moment that

21 began this particular Ocean Grove camp

22 meeting. I've spoke there. I've had the

23 privilege of being there. We go to Ocean

24 Grove. And we're going to talk right now

25 to Scott Hoffman. Scott Hoffman's the


79

1 Director. Scott, are you on the phone with

2 us?

3 MR. SCOTT HOFFMAN, OCEAN GROVE CAMP

4 ASSOC.

5 MR. HOFFMAN: I sure am Jim. Thank you.

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: Scott, what happened at Ocean

8 Grove at the camp meeting association where

9 you're the director?

10 MR. HOFFMAN:

11 Well what happened is, uh, in, uh, late

12 2006 the New Jersey State Legislature was

13 forced to pass a law by the court system in

14 New Jersey to either have same-sex marriage

15 or same-sex civil unions. They passed a

16 civil union law. Then we had, uh, a same-

17 sex couple that came to do a ceremony at

18 one of our boardwalk worship facilities--

19 [Music playing louder in the

20 background]

21 MR. HOFFMAN, OCEAN GROVE CAMP ASSOC.:

22 --and asked for permission to do that which

23 we denied on the grounds of our biblical

24 beliefs, uh. We had a long conversation

25 with them. They left disappointed but


80

1 understanding our position but then shortly

2 thereafter we received a notice from the

3 Attorney General's Office in New Jersey

4 that we were being investigated on charges

5 of discrimination stemming from our failure

6 to allow this ceremony. So after a lot of

7 discussion we decided to, uh, secure the,

8 uh, wonderful services of the Alliance

9 Defense Fund who encouraged us to file in

10 the Federal court on First Amendment

11 grounds. So we filed on the Federal, uh,

12 in the Federal court, uh. They determined

13 that we had not adequately, uh, exhausted

14 our remedies at the state level and so they

15 sent us back to the state for, uh, the

16 administrative hearing at the Civil Rights

17 Office of the Attorney General's Office.

18 But sim--simultaneously while that was

19 going on, we have a Green Acres exemption

20 on our beach and boardwalk for the open

21 space which we've had since 1989. And, uh,

22 before the merits of the case had been

23 determined, before it had been determined

24 whether we had done anything, uh, wrong or

25 not, even in the eyes of the state, uh, the


81

1 Department of Environmental Protection

2 withdrew our tax exempt stat--status for

3 the pavilion, uh, because we had failed to

4 do that ceremony. Um. So as of today

5 we're still waiting for the, uh, New Jersey

6 administrative stage to complete the DRC

7 Division of Civil Rights, hasn't yet even

8 concluded their investigation to determine

9 if we're guilty or not. That's been since

10 November of '07--

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: [Interposing] When you had--

13 MR. HOFFMAN, OCEAN GROVE CAMP ASSOC.:

14 --that's - - .

15 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

16 CHURCH: --when you had the conversation

17 originally with the first lesbian couple,

18 the second les--I guess you had several

19 lesbian couples come to you, was it

20 hostile? Was it mean? Did you have, uh,

21 warning signals that this is what was going

22 to happen?

23 MR. HOFFMAN:

24 No not at all. In those cases the, uh,

25 conversation was very civil. The


82

1 conversation was very, uh, it was a request

2 on their part which we explained would be

3 in opposition to our deeply held religious

4 beliefs. They were disappointed that they

5 couldn't have it in this beautiful setting,

6 uh, but seemed to understand. So we had no

7 idea that there was going to be a, uh, a

8 storm coming.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: There's 100 miles of Jersey shore

11 they could have selected. They chose this

12 one spot, specifically. Scott, thank you

13 for coming on with us. We're going to be

14 praying for you. Stand fast my brother,

15 thank you--

16 MR. HOFFMAN:

17 [Interposing] Thank you. We'll--we'll be

18 praying for you too.

19 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

20 CHURCH: --thank you so much my brother.

21 This is the kind of intimidation and

22 bullying that takes place and this is in

23 our country here and now. We'll lighten it

24 up a little bit. Nazareth, help us. We've

25 got quite a few letters going now.


83

1 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes,

2 you know what? I'm going to go to Sweden

3 and do gay jokes now that the publicity is

4 so good over there--

5 [Laughter]

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: [Laughing] Oh no.

8 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --yes

9 and you don't need to speak English. How

10 are you? Okay. For the letter F we're

11 going to do shackle, no freedom for F. So

12 for F. uh, what's your name young man?

13 TRACEY: Tracey.

14 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Tracey.

15 That's a girl's name--oh freedom, yeah, you

16 can--

17 [LAUGHTER]

18 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --Oh, hi

19 Tracey.

20 TRACEY: Yeah she was cute, I took her

21 name, so I--

22 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

23 [Interposing] Oh thank you so much. That

24 defeats Proposition 8, thank you. I picked

25 the wrong guy, uh. Okay remember all of


84

1 them? Okay. I want you to look at

2 everybody and tell them. A.

3 TRACEY: A--

4 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

5 [Interposing] What does it--?

6 TRACEY: --activist judges.

7 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

8 Activist judges. B.

9 TRACEY: Benefits.

10 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

11 Benefits. C.

12 TRACEY: C, child.

13 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes. D.

14 TRACEY: Dads and moms.

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Embrace

16 yourself; you're doing a bad job.

17 [Laughter]

18 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: E.

19 TRACEY: Everywhere.

20 AUDIENCE: Everywhere.

21 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: And F?

22 TRACEY: Freedom.

23 AUDIENCE: Freedom.

24 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Good.

25 You did--uh, 2 out of 6 is not bad, have a


85

1 seat, thank you.

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: Huh, thank you.

4 [Applause]

5 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

6 CHURCH: Our next one is the letter G and

7 it just stands for God. God established

8 it; historic, orthodox Christianity has

9 affirmed one man, one woman for 2,000 years.

10 Don't let anybody talk you out of that

11 historic, orthodox Christianity has

12 affirmed one man, one woman marriage for a

13 couple thousand years. In fact, Judeo-

14 Christian heritage has affirmed it for

15 5,000 years. The US has in all of our

16 history until some judges took it away from

17 some people in Massachusetts. And

18 California has in all but the last three

19 months of our 158-year history. The reason

20 for it is because God established it

21 because it works. Let me make a real quick

22 illustration here. Let me have my Amish

23 friend come back up here--he's not Amish in

24 reality but come on up here. I need a

25 couple of you to help me out real quickly.


86

1 And I want you two right here. Would you

2 two right here come help me out? Yeah, you

3 two, thank you. Thank you for coming up

4 here. And, uh, would you two, right here,

5 would you two come help me up here. And,

6 uh, would you two come help me, you two

7 right there--yep, yep. You--okay here we

8 go. Come right up here on the stage. Come

9 here. Don't argue with me. Right over

10 here.

11 [Laughing]

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: Quit arguing. You have been so

14 difficult tonight. Okay you stand right

15 over here.

16 [Laughter]

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: Too bad somebody cut your pants

19 off but you'll do okay. Okay.

20 [Laughter]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: Now you stand right here okay.

23 Now you stand right here. Now I want you

24 to stand right here and you--yeah there we

25 go. No, no--right over here--come over


87

1 here, come over here. You stand right here.

2 There we go. Okay. Here's a quick--here's

3 a quick--calm down, I'm doing the show.

4 Here comes--

5 [Interposing] [Laughter]

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: --a quick story. Now in this--in

8 this story, we're going to have a Bible

9 story, a real quick Bible story from

10 Genesis; you're old--from Genesis--

11 [Interposing] [Laughter]

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: --all the way... all the way to the

14 Book or Revelation. The Bible begins with

15 a marriage and it ends with a wedding. And

16 all the way through it's always lifted up as

17 one model, one man, one woman. You get--I-

18 -I've been picking on you but I'm going to

19 go easy on you now. In this--my

20 illustration you get to play the role of

21 God. Okay. Just--

22 [Interposing] [Laughter, applause]

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: With a--with a God like that I

25 thank you for Jesus.


88

1 [Laughter, drum roll].

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: Whoa. I didn't say you had to be

4 intimidating; you could be nice and warm

5 and--okay. Never mind. Okay. He's going

6 to be God. You are going to be his

7 creation. And you are Adam and Eve. When

8 God made Adam and Eve, listen very

9 carefully, he made them in his image.

10 Since God is neither male nor female, God

11 is the full spectrum of all the qualities

12 of masculinity, strength and historically

13 what's associated with femininity?

14 Tenderness. God is both masculine,

15 strength, and feminine, tenderness. For

16 this illustration you get in touch with

17 your feminine side, okay?

18 [Laughter]

19 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

20 CHURCH: Okay. Okay. God you're all of

21 that--

22 [Interposing] [Laughter]

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: --[chuckling]. Just... boy when you

25 can't get union help see what you're stuck


89

1 with?

2 [Laughter]

3 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

4 CHURCH: Okay. Okay. God is both all the

5 strength and masculinity and all the

6 tenderness of femininity. And so when he

7 created Adam and Eve, he created Adam and

8 Eve, a strength and the tenderness of

9 femininity and together when Adam and Eve

10 come together in union, when--in that

11 moment, they become a reflection of the

12 full spectrum--spectrum of the image of God.

13 Now this is the image of God. Part of what

14 God gave and stamped in their heart and

15 image is the capacity to create. So as a

16 husband and wife, Adam and Eve, come

17 together in this story. Adam and Eve come

18 together in Genesis Chapter 4. The result

19 is a sperm and an egg and a miracle of

20 humanity. And the result is they become

21 partners, co-creators with God in the

22 ongoing creation process. Stamped upon

23 them together to become one at that point,

24 they have a full image of God displayed in

25 their life, as one entity. Now. If I were


90

1 the enemy. If I were the enemy, if I were

2 the enemy, what would want to do is destroy

3 the image of God off the earth so people

4 would not have a grasp of the fullness of

5 the nature of God. That's the theological

6 underpinnings to what is happening here.

7 Now let's go further with our story. This--

8 let's just pretend, this is a married

9 couple somewhere in our community. They're

10 a married couple. This--in this

11 illustration, step over here a little bit

12 further up, in this illustration guess what

13 you get to be? You are playing the role of

14 Jesus. Well, act a little more excited.

15 [Laughter]

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: Okay. Okay there we go.

18 [Laughter]

19 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

20 CHURCH: Victor. And you are playing the

21 role of the church. The church. We tend

22 to think backwards from reality. We tend

23 to think God established marriage on earth

24 and he borrowed from that metaphor and

25 tried to portray to us what it's going to


91

1 be like in the end times. And so he made

2 the analogy well just like you have

3 marriage on earth, that's what it's going

4 to be like when Jesus and the church, the

5 redeemed community, truly become one with

6 each other. We have it backwards. The

7 real marriage, capital M, is this one.

8 This is small m, marriage. The real

9 marriage you have not yet fully seen.

10 That's when the church and Jesus become one.

11 All of history is culminating towards that

12 one thing when Jesus and the church become

13 completely one, capital Marriage. And God

14 said, hum, so they can understand how

15 wonderful this is, I'm going to put

16 marriage on the planet so they'll get a

17 grasp of the joy and the delight, even the

18 delight within sexual expression itself is

19 a reminder of the sheer joy at the right

20 hand, are pleasures for evermore. The joy

21 of being in the presence of Almighty God.

22 The church and Jesus coming together. But

23 if I were Satan and I knew that was God's

24 agenda and where he was headed and he

25 needed visual aids on the earth to try to


92

1 demonstrate that, I would come in and I

2 would destroy this. I would clobber it

3 with stuff like divorce and pornography.

4 And then I'd really go for it at its core

5 and I'd throw this model aside, two men and

6 two women that way people would never be

7 able to grasp a Bible that starts with a

8 marriage and ends with a wedding. That's

9 what's at stake here. Let's hear it for

10 the people who helped us out here, right

11 now.

12 [Applause]

13 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

14 CHURCH: Thank you so much for that.

15 [Applause]

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: I want you to watch the screen

18 right now. We have something very special

19 about to come; Chuck and Jena Norris are

20 going to help us out.

21
22 CHUCK AND JENA NORRIS

23 MR. CHUCK NORRIS: Hi, I'm Chuck

24 Norris and this is my wife Jena. And we're

25 sharing with you from our Texas ranch about


93

1 California's Proposition 8, the Marriage

2 Amendment that maintains the union between

3 a man and a woman. As part-time residents

4 of the Golden State we are concerned about

5 the precedent set by Proposition 8 and its

6 effect on the rest of the nation.

7 MRS. JENA NORRIS: For some citizens

8 of California the need for Proposition 8

9 might seem a big confusing. In 2000 a

10 strong majority voted to uphold the

11 definition of a traditional marriage with a

12 statewide referendum. But Proposition 22,

13 as it was called, only amended State Civil

14 Code. However in May of 2008, 4 California

15 State Supreme Court judges, against the

16 will of the California citizens, voted that

17 laws limiting marriage to opposite sex

18 couples violate the State's constitutional

19 rights of same-sex couples. That is why

20 Prop 8 is needed. It would amend the

21 Constitution to define marriage as a union

22 between one man and one woman, just as you

23 voted in 2000.

24 MR. NORRIS: We encourage Californians

25 to vote yes for Prop 8 for three simple


94

1 reasons. First we don't believe four

2 judges should have the right to overturn

3 laws already passed by voters and the State

4 legislature.

5 MRS. NORRIS: Um-hum.

6 MR. NORRIS: Their jobs is to apply

7 the laws to specific situations not to

8 create new ones or legislate from the bench.

9 The majority of Californians have already

10 spoken and it is simply not right for a

11 very small minority to override their

12 decision.

13 MRS. NORRIS: The second reason that

14 we encourage Californians to vote yes for

15 Prop 8 is because redefining the bounds of

16 marriage will have an immediate impact upon

17 all of our children especially those within

18 public schools. California Education Code

19 Section 51933 states that instruction and

20 material shall teach respect for marriage

21 and committed relationships. Proposition 8

22 is not just about preserving traditional

23 marriage but pro--protecting educational

24 curriculum about this sacred union.

25 MR. NORRIS: The third reason that we


95

1 encourage Californians to vote yes for Prop

2 8 is because we're all Americans and we

3 should never be afraid or intimidated to

4 vote our conscience--

5 MRS. NORRIS: [Interposing] Um-hum.

6 MR. NORRIS: --in my new book, Black

7 Belt Patriotism which is a cultural

8 manifesto on issues from family to faith

9 and country, I say things that may ruffle

10 feathers in government but freedom of

11 expression is all of our right--

12 MRS. NORRIS: [Interposing] Um-hum.

13 MR. NORRIS: --as Americans. God

14 created the first couple, a man and a woman,

15 that there's no reason to be ashamed of

16 that fact.

17 MRS. NORRIS: Um-hum. As sure as a

18 house divided cannot stand, neither can a

19 state or a nation. Let's unite and let our

20 voices be heard. Please take courage and

21 vote yes on Proposition 8.

22 MR. NORRIS: And safeguard marriage

23 for future generations of Californians and

24 the rest of America. Even Texans--

25 MRS. NORRIS: [Interposing] Even


96

1 Texans.

2 [Applause]

3 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

4 CHURCH: I, I say to the other side in case

5 you're listening in, you may mess with us

6 preachers but don't mess with Chuck Norris.

7 [Laughter, applause]

8 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

9 CHURCH: Okay Nazareth where are you--?

10 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

11 [Interposing] I'm right here.

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: --I know you're there. Where are

14 you?

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: I'm

16 here. I'm leaving--

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: [Interposing] Oh come up here--

19 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --I'm

20 upset man. God is Amish and Jesus has a

21 headband, is that it?

22 [Laughter]

23 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

24 CHURCH: [Laughing] Whatever you say--

25 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:


97

1 [Interposing] I this young lady here me

2 where, would you stand up? You know, even

3 young people are going for Pro--yes on

4 Proposition 8. I just want people to know

5 that. What's your name?

6 JESSICA: Jessica.

7 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Jessica,

8 have you been to Texas?

9 JESSICA: No.

10 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: You

11 know in Texas when they make a hat and

12 point, they go you know what I mean

13 [clicks]?

14 [Laughter]

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: I say

16 yeah I know what you mean [click, click].

17 [Laughter]

18 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: All

19 right. G's going to be--G's going to be

20 for God. So this is a point for God. So

21 God our creator, God. So can we go over

22 them again? A is, what's the sign for A?

23 AUDIENCE: Activist judges.

24 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

25 Activist judges. B.
98

1 AUDIENCE: Benefits.

2 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

3 Benefits. C.

4 AUDIENCE: Children.

5 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

6 Children, yes. D.

7 AUDIENCE: Dads and moms.

8 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes.

9 Dads. E.

10 AUDIENCE: Everywhere.

11 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: And F?

12 AUDIENCE: Freedom.

13 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: And G.

14 AUDIENCE: God.

15 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Good

16 job.

17 [Applause]

18 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Thank

19 you. Thank you.

20 [Music playing, applause]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: Letter H, letter H. Homosexual

23 lifestyle. Can be transformed by the power

24 of Jesus Christ. We love those that are

25 caught up in same-sex attraction. We do


99

1 not hate anyone. We love them. We want

2 their life to be transformed. Melissa,

3 you've got a story. Tell it to me.

4
5 MS. MELISSA FRYREAR, FOCUS ON THE

6 FAMILY

7 MS. FRYREAR:Pastor Jim, two of the biggest

8 lies out there, one that homosexuality is

9 genetic and second that once gay, always

10 gay. And I know from personal experience

11 that that's not true. Uh, as young as 13,

12 I questioned my sexuality. I was

13 questioning whether I might be gay. I

14 stepped into my first homosexual

15 relationship at the age of 16. And for the

16 next decade, the next 10 years, lived

17 homosexually, lived as a lesbian. Well, in

18 the early 90s through God's intervening

19 grace and accepted Jesus Christ as my

20 personal savior and Lord, and God began to

21 radically--

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: [Interposing] Hum.

24 MS. FRYREAR, FOCUS ON THE FAMILY: --

25 over time, radically change my life. My


100

1 feelings, my thoughts, my opinions, uh, yes,

2 my attractions, even physically what I

3 looked like. Now as we've been talking

4 about tonight, we know that homosexuality

5 is not genetic as Christians. And you

6 might be surprised to learn that even gay-

7 affirming, pro-gay secular organizations

8 like the American Psychiatric Association,

9 the American Psychological Association

10 acknowledge this truth as well. The APA,

11 their literature states there's no

12 replicated study that proves homosexuality

13 is genetic. Now not only is that, uh, that

14 scientific truth affirming a Biblical truth

15 which, of course, shouldn't surprise us as

16 Christians, but it's also a message of hope

17 that because homosexuality is not genetic,

18 because people are not born gay, this is

19 absolutely something that can be overcome,

20 that people can change. And I have the

21 privilege to be here tonight with all of

22 you and understand that I represent

23 thousands and thousands of men and women in

24 California, throughout the United States,

25 around the world, who have the same


101

1 testimony. That because of the love of the

2 Heavenly Father, because of the power of

3 God's holy spirit and because of what Jesus

4 Christ accomplished on the cross, in his

5 name and through his blood, this--this

6 absolutely can be overcome and changed.

7 And so the truth is, uh, born gay,

8 absolutely not. The truth is not born gay,

9 and the truth is once gay but now straight.

10 [Chuckling]

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: And you--yeah--

13 [Interposing] [Applause]

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: Yeah.

16 [Applause]

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: You, uh, you know thousands of

19 people who like you have walked out of this.

20 What's that passage from, uh, is it First

21 or Second Corinthians? That says and some

22 were--

23 MS. FRYREAR, FOCUS ON THE FAMILY:

24 [Interposing] Oh, First Corinthians, as

25 Christians, oftentimes we quote First


102

1 Corinthians 6, 9 and 10 but we leave out

2 verse 11 and verse 11 says and such were

3 some of you, and we have witness from the

4 first century of the church, that there

5 were people struggling with homosexuality

6 and that God radically changed their lives,

7 and now we have millennia of--of witnesses

8 of thousands and thousands again of men and

9 women who have overcome homosexuality

10 through the power of Jesus Christ.

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: I whish we had another hour. I--I

13 spent about--almost 50 to 55 minutes

14 interviewing you and we have that on the

15 website along with Ake Green and Dave and

16 Tonya Parker and all these. You can go to

17 the website, uh, www.ProtectMarriageCA.com

18 and you can watch the full interviews.

19 Melissa thank you for being with us.

20 That's aw--awesome--

21 [Interposing] [Applause]

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: --come up here.

24 [Applause]

25 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE


103

1 CHURCH: This is Vince; Vince and Marina

2 Romeri. I just met them a few days ago.

3 He was caught up in a homosexual lifestyle

4 for years. One day God got a hold of him,

5 spun him around, set him free. He met this

6 lady. They got married and they're about

7 ready to celebrate their 25th wedding

8 anniversary in just a few days--

9 [Interposing] [Cheering, applause]

10 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

11 CHURCH: --way to go. Way to go, way to go.

12 [Applause, music]

13 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

14 CHURCH: Where are we? Nazareth, are you

15 going to take this letter H?

16 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: You

17 know, I--I really struggled with that. I

18 can't find a sign. Any of the signs I want

19 to do--

20 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

21 CHURCH: [Interposing] Fine.

22 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --I

23 can't do. Can we do--

24 [Interposing] [Laughter]

25 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --YMCA


104

1 for that one?

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: Oh, no, no, no.

4 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: No.

5 Okay. How are you my friend? Okay. Since

6 people can come out of that lifestyle, they

7 say we're coming out of the closet, you

8 know, actually they're coming out of the

9 closet of homosexuality, so we'll say, come

10 on. Would that work?

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: Yeah, yeah.

13 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: That's

14 better than YMCA--

15 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

16 CHURCH: [Interposing] That's good. You--

17 yeah I think that's a lot better than YMCA-

18 -

19 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

20 [Interposing] Okay. So for H we're going

21 to do--

22 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

23 CHURCH: --thank you [chuckling].

24 [Laughter]

25 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --all


105

1 right. Thank you very much.

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: We're going to go to the letter I

4 right now. The letter I right now stands

5 for I've got to be involved. Say that with

6 me.

7 AUDIENCE AND DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR,

8 SKYLINE CHURCH: I've got to be involved.

9 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

10 CHURCH: Say it again.

11 AUDIENCE AND DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR,

12 SKYLINE CHURCH: I've got to be involved.

13 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

14 CHURCH: And here's Chris Clarke from East

15 Claremont Baptist Church to tell you

16 exactly how you can do this. He's been

17 along this ride all the way from the

18 beginning--

19 [Interposing] [Applause]

20 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

21 CHURCH: --13 months, working this out.

22 Star--star player here.

23 [Applause]

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: What's the word? What can we do?


106

1
2 CHRIS CLARKE, CLAIREMONT FBC

3 cHRIS CLARKE: We

4 are in the 2-minute warning if this were a

5 football game. We only have 15 more days

6 to activate. Here's what we need you to do.

7 Number one, if you're not registered to

8 vote, register to vote. There should be

9 registration formS where you are, register.

10 We may only win this by one vote--

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: [Interposing] Aren't we in the

13 last day of that?

14 MR. CLARKE, CLAIREMONT FBC: --and it

15 might be yours. Tomorrow is the deadline.

16 So you need to do it tonight. Second, you

17 need to get involved in the church calling

18 campaign if you've not already done so. Go

19 to ProtectMarriageCA.com to get that

20 information. There's still time to do it.

21 Next, we need a big push on November the

22 4th. November the 4th we need 100,000

23 people to man 20,000 precincts in

24 California to make sure we get the vote out.

25 It's easy. You can do it close to home and


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1 you're only going to be seeing people who

2 are going to vote yes. We need to get them

3 to turn out and vote. Go to

4 ProtectMarriage.com and register there to

5 be a part of that massive effort.

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: Now that one's not

8 ProtectMarriageCA in that case but just go

9 to ProtectMarriage.com.

10 MR. CLARKE, CLAIREMONT FBC: That's

11 correct.

12 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

13 CHURCH: Drop the CA off on that one.

14 Okay?

15 MR. CLARKE, CLAIREMONT FBC: Do it.

16 That's--

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: [Interposing] Anything more on it?

19 MR. CLARKE, CLAIREMONT FBC: Well I'm

20 out of time.

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: You are [laughing]--

23 [Interposing] [Applause]

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: --that you are. Thank you.


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1 MODERATOR: - - put together by Tony

2 Perkins and the Family Research Council.

3 [Applause]

4 [Music]

5
6 MR. TONY PERKINS, PRESIDENT, FAMILY

7 RESEARCH COUNCIL, WASHINGTON, D.C.

8
9 TONY PERKINS: In the

10 United States Capitol Rotunda there's a

11 beautiful painting of the signing of the

12 Declaration of Independence. Hello I'm

13 Tony Perkins here in Washington D.C. If

14 you're considering whether or not to vote

15 in this fall's election, I want to share

16 something with you. 56 men signed this

17 document, the Declaration of Independence,

18 which established our freedom and led to

19 you and I having the right to vote. Now

20 some of you may be saying you're just

21 simply too busy to vote or you--you're

22 frustrated with politicians or you don't

23 like what's going on in your state's

24 government. Well and here in Washington,

25 the Republican President and the Democratic


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1 Congress have the lowest approval ratings

2 in recent history so some of you may be

3 tempted to show your disdain by not voting.

4 Well keep this in mind. Of the 56 men who

5 decided to take a stand for faith, family

6 and freedom with their signature of this

7 Declaration of Independence, all 56 were

8 the subjects of manhunts by the British, 5

9 were captured, imprisoned and treated

10 harshly. Several lost wives, children or

11 entire families. One lost his son in

12 combat. Another had two sons captured.

13 Two wives were brutalized by the British.

14 12 signers had their homes seized, some of

15 which were destroyed. 9 signers died

16 during the war. 17 lost everything they

17 owned. Now your kids probably won't learn

18 this in the public schools. So you'll have

19 to tell them about the sacrifices made by

20 these 56 men, their wives and their

21 children. But as you can see freedom is

22 not free. These men and their families

23 paid a dear price so that you and I would

24 have the right to vote. So please consider

25 honoring their sacrifice. Do your civic


110

1 duty. Vote your values in November.

2 [Music]

3 [Applause]

4 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

5 CHURCH: Lou Engle has filled stadiums.

6 He's the only person I know of who has

7 filled stadiums all around the United

8 States, 15 of them so far, 14 of them so

9 far, with people just coming to pray. And

10 he called this state to a 40-day fast.

11 We're on day 26 of a 40-day fast. If you

12 haven't been a part of it, we encourage you

13 to jump in now and go with us because it's

14 going to culminate in a great day, November

15 1, Qualcomm Stadium, talk to us, Lou.

16
17 LOU ENGLE, THE CALL

18 LOU ENGLE: I have two

19 articles. I wrote one in 2000 for

20 California and it's Who Prays for the

21 Judges. And in that article I said we must

22 pray for Prop 22, fast and pray. I've got

23 another one called The Golden Fast, 2003,

24 where we called California to 40-day

25 fasting because of--and after that I ended


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1 up warning the Mayor of San Francisco that

2 he would be held accountable for everything

3 he does in this city under the government

4 of God. Now I'm in the same--an 8-year

5 journey. I want to see Qualcomm Stadium

6 filled with 70,000 people in united fasting

7 and prayer--

8 [Interposing] [Applause]

9 MR. ENGLE, THE CALL: --across

10 denominations, across races, because we're

11 in a crisis and God's answer in crisis is

12 united fasting and prayer. November 1st,

13 from 10:00 in the morning to 10:00 at night,

14 let's change history by appealing to the

15 Supreme Court of Heaven who overrules the

16 Supreme Courts of earth.

17 [Applause]

18 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

19 CHURCH: Whoa, whoa, whoa.

20 [Applause, music]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: The Call--go to TheCall.com.

23 TheCall.com and you can sign up. There's a

24 lot of information, TheCall.com, you want

25 to be involved, mobilize and TheCall.com.


112

1 We come down to the letter J, it stands for

2 Jesus. Marriage is not an idol. We have

3 no idols before us. We treasure marriage

4 because Jesus says to, but Jesus is Lord.

5 Miles McPherson, come up here from The Rock

6 Church and talk to us--

7 [Interposing] [Applause, cheering]

8 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

9 CHURCH: --about the letter J, Jesus. Go

10 for it.

11 MR. MILES MCPHERSON: Everyone say

12 Jesus.

13 AUDIENCE: Jesus.

14 MR. MCPHERSON: We want to say hello

15 to everybody out there in TV land. Say

16 Jesus with us, one, two three, say Jesus.

17 AUDIENCE: Jesus.

18 MR. MCPHERSON: I was watching a

19 boxing match last night. I'm a boxing fan,

20 my brother boxes. And this boxing match

21 between an old guy and a young guy.

22 Everyone say old guy.

23 AUDIENCE: Old guy.

24 MR. MCPHERSON: Say young guy.

25 AUDIENCE: Young guy.


113

1 MR. MCPHERSON: The young guy has been

2 knocking people out. He's 35 and 0, 30

3 knockouts. The young guy is 43-years old

4 and he was at the end of his ca--he's at

5 the end of his career and everyone was

6 betting that he was going to get knocked

7 out for the first time. My dad rooted for

8 the young guy, everybody say young guy.

9 AUDIENCE: Young guy.

10 MR. MCPHERSON: I rooted for the old

11 guy. I love underdogs. Say old guy.

12 AUDIENCE: Old guy.

13 MR. MCPHERSON: So they asked the

14 young guy, what you going to do? He said

15 I'm going to knock him out; I'm going to

16 knock him out. His trainer says it's going

17 to be the first time this guy gets knocked

18 out. And they asked the old guy what are

19 you going to do? He says look, I got this

20 guy figured out. And he's real calm. He

21 was confident. He says I'm waiting to see

22 how he's going to react when he finds out

23 he's been lied to.

24 [Laughter]

25 MR. MCPHERSON: And realizes I'm not


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1 an old man.

2 [Laughter]

3 MR. MCPHERSON: I'm going to tell you

4 something. He had something no one else

5 had, 35 and 0; this is what the young guy

6 one. And he figured something out and he

7 had something no one else had, he thought.

8 We have something that no one else has,

9 that's Jesus. Say Jesus.

10 AUDIENCE: Jesus.

11 MR. MCPHERSON: We also know, now you

12 know, this is not just marriage. It's way

13 bigger than that. Amen?

14 AUDIENCE: Amen.

15 MR. MCPHERSON: Now you know the

16 Devil's strategy is to destroy the church

17 is to destroy marriage. Okay so now you

18 know. So what would Jesus tell us? Three

19 very simple things. Number one, fear not,

20 say fear not.

21 AUDIENCE: Fear not.

22 MR. MCPHERSON: The one thing he

23 commanded us more than anything else in the

24 whole Bible is not to have fear. He said

25 don't worry about it. I'm still on the


115

1 throne. I--this is good news. God is

2 still God, he's not applying for the job,

3 he's still on the throne and no matter what

4 the devil's doing he's still on the throne.

5 Now can I get an amen?

6 AUDIENCE: Amen [applause].

7 MR. MCPHERSON: And he also said this.

8 Don't clap on - - time, thank you very much.

9 And he also said this, he says this, you

10 are the right people to be in this fight

11 right now. I had you life right now to be

12 in this fight just like Esther. You've

13 been placed here for such a time as this,

14 so don't worry. I got you. I got you.

15 Number two, he would say pray. Pray unless

16 you fall to temptation. We have to pray,

17 it's a spiritual battle. And number three,

18 number three, number three, I'm going to

19 wait--wait until I remember it, love your

20 neighbor.

21 [Laughter]

22 MR. MCPHERSON: All you people out

23 there that love us, we love you. All the

24 people out there who hate us, we love you

25 too. Love people. Let's make sure we do


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1 this in the spirit of love. We've not been

2 given the spirit of fear but the spirit of

3 power, love and a sound mind. What's J

4 stand for?

5 AUDIENCE: Jesus.

6 MR. MCPHERSON: Very good.

7 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

8 CHURCH: Hey.

9 [Applause, cheering]

10 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

11 CHURCH: Nazareth.

12 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: All

13 right.

14 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

15 CHURCH: Now we've got all ten of them, all

16 ten of them. Do you have somebody that can

17 do all ten?

18 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yes.

19 I'd like to buy a vowel first--

20 [Interposing] [Laughter]

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: [Interposing] [Laughing]

23 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --no.

24 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

25 CHURCH: Where's Vanna?


117

1 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Uh, can

2 you stand up young man?

3 [Audience reacting]

4 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Yeah--

5 we--no, no, the I is for salute of course.

6 So we need to know that. The I for salute-

7 -

8 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

9 CHURCH: [Interposing] Oh yes, the I is

10 for--

11 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --and

12 the J for?

13 AUDIENCE: Jesus.

14 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: All

15 right. Thank you very much--

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: [Interposing] What--what--what's

18 the hand motion to, uh, I again?

19 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: The I

20 is the salute.

21 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

22 CHURCH: Oh okay 'cause we're--we're--we're

23 reporting for duty.

24 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: We're

25 reporting for duty to fast and go to the


118

1 Qualcomm Stadium, yes.

2 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

3 CHURCH: Yeah okay [laughing].

4 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Okay.

5 Let's go back. You have them all?

6 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

7 CHURCH: What--what's J. What's hand

8 motion--?

9 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

10 [Interposing] J is for Jesus--

11 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

12 CHURCH: [Interposing] Oh hanging on the

13 cross?

14 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: --I

15 hurt the guy here, yes hanging on the cross.

16 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

17 CHURCH: Oh okay. Okay. Okay.

18 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: A sign

19 for people watching.

20 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

21 CHURCH: Okay.

22 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN:

23 Wonderful. Can we go all over them? Okay.

24 Number A.

25 [Music starting]
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1 AUDIENCE: Activist judges.

2 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: B.

3 AUDIENCE: Benefits.

4 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: C.

5 AUDIENCE: Children.

6 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: D.

7 AUDIENCE: Dads and moms.

8 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: E.

9 AUDIENCE: Everywhere.

10 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: F.

11 AUDIENCE: Freedom.

12 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: G.

13 AUDIENCE: God.

14 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: H.

15 AUDIENCE: Homosexual lifestyle.

16 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: I.

17 AUDIENCE: Involved.

18 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: And J.

19 AUDIENCE: Jesus.

20 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

21 CHURCH: Whoa.

22 NAZARETH, CHRISTIAN COMEDIAN: Thank

23 you so much.

24 [Applause]

25 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE


120

1 CHURCH: Yes.

2 [Applause]

3 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

4 CHURCH: In case you can't remember all

5 those, go to ProtectMarriageCa.com, click

6 on resources and there's the ABC's all for

7 you. You can print them out because over

8 the next 15 days, what are you going to do?

9 You're going to talk to everybody. The

10 first few are for un-church, the rest are

11 for everybody. Talk to everybody you can

12 in the next 15 days because 16 days from

13 tonight, we're going to be celebrating a

14 great victory for God as we protect

15 marriage--

16 [Interposing] [Cheering, applause]

17 DR. GARLOW, LEAD PASTOR, SKYLINE

18 CHURCH: --thank you for being with us.

19 Thank you for being with us.

20 MALE VOICE 4: By the way, as

21 California goes, so goes the rest of the

22 nation.

23 [Cheering]

24 [Music]

25 MR. ENGLE: God, as


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1 California, so goes the nation. A

2 confrontation between light and darkness

3 will happen this November. A battle to

4 save the very sanctity of marriage, to the

5 victor goes the souls of the nation. Cry

6 out to God for the deliverance of the

7 homosexual, for the salvation of their

8 lives, for the love of God to be poured out

9 over their hearts. Where there is no hope.

10 Where there is no human remedy, God still

11 has a holy prescription.

12 [Cheering]

13 MR. ENGLE, THE CALL: We're calling

14 the whole nation to 40 days of prayer and

15 fasting for California culminating in a day

16 of humility, cleansing. A day of battle

17 like no other.

18 IN THE BACKGROUND: Jesus.

19 MR. ENGLE, THE CALL: Let the whole

20 nation raise up massive praying hands for a

21 wave of freedom and deliverance the State

22 has never seen. We dare to believe in

23 Jesus' name.

24 [Music]

25 MR. ENGLE, THE CALL: This State has


122

1 seen wave after wave after wave of revival

2 that has swept its shores for 100 years.

3 God send us another Jesus movement. On

4 November 1st, we will take our stand with

5 tens of thousands of our brothers and

6 sisters in united massive fasting and

7 prayer at Qualcomm Stadium in San Diego,

8 crying God have mercy. God restrain, hold

9 back the flood. God release a wave of

10 revival to shape the future of the State

11 and the future of America. Lord we believe.

12 [Music, thunder]

13 FEMALE VOICE SINGING: God he will

14 sound a voice, coming to America again.

15 Love, hear the sound of voice--

16 [Interposing]

17 [Applause]

18
19 [END VOB]

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1
2
3
4 C E R T I F I C A T E

5
6 I, Laura L. Springate, certify that

7 the foregoing transcript is a true record

8 of said video recording, that I am not

9 connected by blood or marriage with any of

10 the parties herein nor interested directly

11 or indirectly in the matter in controversy,

12 nor am I in the employ of the counsel.

13
14 Signature: ____Laura L. Springate______

15 Date: _____December 16, 2009__________

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