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Peter Lindergh talk to Filep Motwar
POTD ON TUDAY, 1T NOV 2016 Y FILP MOTWARY
FILP MOTWARY: What I’ve alwa found triking, in addition to
our photograph itelf, i our “wa” with women, our
“uject”. looking at our work, one feel there i a ond, a
deep relationhip, a mutual undertanding and trut etween
ou and the women ou photograph. How did ou achieve
having all thee iconic women lierate themelve in front of
our camera in uch a wa that it eem a if an intruder i
omehow witneing omeone ele’ peronal moment?
PTR LINDRGH: I would tr to define it a the experience of
undertanding another peron’ condition from their
perpective. Thi exactl eem to e the mot important gift
ou need, to come to a “miotic relationhip” with our
uject. It create amazing moment and a feeling that
everthing can happen at an moment. It i omething ver
eautiful and, the wa, ver ueful… I do not make a
difference etween an actor or a model when I hoot—I love
tortelling, narrative torie, and it i aout howing omething
real, ituation where I leave ome pace for improviation. I
give the guideline—ugget— and then the have to pretend I
am jut not there photographing them.
FM: The eem like till from a ver peronal narrative of a
fahion film. How difficult wa it to develop thi approach to a
peronal perpective and maintain it a our ignature for o
man ear?
PL: I think it i a parallel proce of tring to find out what ou
want to expre or communicate. Over the ear, ou tart
knowing more and more who ou are and where ou want to go.
Thi i the ai for ever manifetation, whether a
photographer, artit, muician or an creative peron with
omething to a. Once ou have found ourelf in thee
complex, ut at the ame time natural and intinctive
urrounding, ou’ll automaticall feel our wa to photograph
women, or anthing ele. That’ wh it i important to liten onl
to ourelf, for an deciion concerning the meaning and
viual direction of our work. I don’t think the wa I ee women
ha changed a lot. What ha changed i m wa of approaching
the making of image and if the are more intereting toda
than 25 ear ago, I would gue thi i ecaue all fear ha
left and I can clearl ee the ottom of everthing. If ou are
conitent and have a clear point of view, if ou elieve and
ta true to ourelf, from who ou are to our tle, ou can
ucceed.
FM: It i remarkale how photograph ou took 30 ear ago,
with the fahion of that time, till eem o current. How would
ou explain that?
PL: There i one imple entence from the Japanee Zen
mater, hunru uzuki: “To expre ourelf a ou are,
without an intentional fanc wa of adjuting ourelf, i the
mot important thing.” I think following hunru’ thinking
would e the mot revolutionar and ueful act, concerning
photograph and everthing ele.
FM: What i our definition of eaut?
PL: ince the arrival of the digital proceing of image, a lot
ha changed. peciall a new tool, like Photohop, are too
often ued in a detructive wa, a too much control i given to
digital retoucher. Thi ha a ver ad, dehumaniing effect.
You can ee everda, everwhere that thi ha ecome
automatic: retouching ha kidnapped the life from the face of
women and cleared them from pat experience and emotion.
The image of women in our time ha ecome an inult for ever
peron who love and repect them. Real eaut, widom,
eniilit, love or intelligence in omeone’ face ha een
randed with the uppoedl mot negative word of our time:
old! The trong market of eternal outh ha taken control over
our awarene of eaut. When ou can ign on to the idea that
there cannot e eaut without truth, the anwer i clear. How
craz and unreal i the idea of eraing all our experience
from our face? You hould alo know wh ou want to leave
them. Thi hould e the reponiilit of photographer toda:
to free women, and finall everone, from the terror of outh
and perfection.
FM: Gianni Verace wa reponile for coining the term “top
model”, ut ou are reponile for making that term a realit
through our photograph, tarting with the legendar ritih
Vogue cover in Januar 1990. You till collaorate with mot of
thee women more than 25 ear later. What wa—and i—o
pecial aout Linda, Tatjana, Naomi, Chrit, tephanie, Cind,
Helena and Claudia?
PL: At the end of the 1980, the upermodel repreented for
me a change from the other women in the fahion magazine.
The had ver different peronalitie and the were different to
model from efore. The were independent, could peak for
themelve and were not in need of maculine protection and
were not living and expoing their ocial tatu to exit. It wa
aout independence, authenticit and diverit. Thi led to the
“White hirt” image hot in California in 1988, which wa the
firt time the had een put together a the group later referred
to a the upermodel. I had refued to work for American
Vogue everal time ecaue I could not relate to the women
the were howing in their page. Mr Lierman from Condé Nat
aked me to how him what m tpe of woman wa. I did
image of relativel new model a a group, all in white hirt.
Vogue did not a much and refued the picture. Ironicall, the
picture ended up four ear later in the ook celerating the
100-ear anniverar of Vogue a the mot important picture of
the decade. Uing lack-and-white photograph wa reall
important to create the upermodel. ver time I tried to hoot
them in colour, it ended up looking like a cometic advert. With
lack and white, ou could reall ee more of who the were. It
toned down the commercial interpretation that colour give.
FM: The 90 were a period of fahion exce and et ou
managed to keep thee women real. How difficult wa it to
reconcile that with the need of the fahion pulication ou
were collaorating with?
FM: You made Model: The Film in 1991. What wa the tor
ehind it?
PL: It wa a great experience, a learning experience, a it wa a
firt for me. I have good memorie of it ecaue it i a
documentar, proal the onl one, aout thee girl at that
moment. It wa done more artiticall with a lot of freedom and
I didn’t have to follow an profeional rule for documentarie.
It i a witne tetimon of that time.
FM: Did ou film on fahion hoot?
PL: The film wa the onl goal, ut we had re-ued the idea of
an earlier tor for Italian Vogue with Linda, Naomi and Chrit
Turlington a gangter in rookln.
FM: One of m favourite cene in the film i when Linda and
Tatjana are haring a tale on the each, talking. It eem to e
a reak the had etween hot. I find thi converational
cene ver powerful and repreentative of our od of work:
the converation etween women, oth literall and
metaphoricall.
PL: I like to give freedom to the people I capture to let them
expre themelve in the wa the want. The reult are
alwa ver intereting and unexpected and I think thi i how
magic work in a wa to capture moment.
FM: What i our creative proce? From the moment ou are
commiioned for a tor, what i the next tep?
FM: If I aked ou to decrie the current tate of fahion, what
would ou a ha changed?
PL: You’re aking the wrong peron… All I can a i that now it
i ovioul more gloal and intantl acceile all over the
world ecaue of ocial media. Mae it i le aout creativit,
more aout commerce, aout elling ag and cometic rather
than individualit.
PL: Their oundle creativit, for which I have a lot of repect.
When I firt met Rei Kawakuo when he arrived in Pari, I wa
totall impreed her unique viion and her freedom in
creating her garment, mixing tradition and avant-garde.
FM: Thi exhiition eem to e one of our igget and mot
peronal how to date. Wh now?
PL: I cannot a it i m igget or m mot peronal ut it
definitel i ver different from the previou one. Toda I
hould not work a much a I do ecaue I alwa thought that
now, at thi tage of m life, I hould have ome time to reflect
and to find out more aout everthing I have een and
experienced. ut then, thinking onl aout photograph there i
not much left to do… ut let’ talk aout the exhiition! Thierr
didn’t think of the exhiition like a retropective. We worked
together for almot three ear on it, reearching image. The
photograph aren’t preented chronologicall ut, a he call it,
through m paion and oeion of the pat decade… The
Kunthal in Rotterdam i a ver ophiticated mueum of
modern art. I’ve een told that I am, if not the firt one, one of
the firt artit with a olo exhiition there while till alive. In
thi context, the le fortunate artit were Palo Picao,
Giacometti and Keith Haring, among man other. Thierr came
to me with thi idea of howing m work in a different wa—a
wa that I melf had never thought of efore. It wa quite
intereting for me to ee image I hot recentl and man ear
ago, all together, from a ver different perpective. It i ea to
do a photograph exhiition and to jut hang them on the wall,
ut the wa it i preented it i not onl aout me—ou dicover
other, different univere, aout dance, aout art in German,
aout cinema, aout ocial iue, eaut…
FM: Can ou tell u more aout how the exhiition ha een
curated?
PL: It i divided into theme, from upermodel to et, dance
and icon (cinema, muic, etc.), fahion deigner to The
Unknown, a pecial video intallation with all the work inpired
alien, pacehip and the unknown… The galler aout the
upermodel i contructed in a wa that viitor undertand
what wa going on ociall at the end of the 80, wh it
happened and how the role of women in ociet wa evolving to
omething that wa aout individualit, empowerment. Alo how
I came and worked in that period of fahion exce and over
grooming, with an approach that wa ver different to what
everone ele wa doing ack then. Man of m paion and
inpiration, like modern dance and allet—from Nijinki, to
Martha Graham and m dear friend, the late Pina auch—are
explored. I gue it can e intereting for omeone who doe
not know aout that univere to dicover thee great late artit
and learn aout creativit and artitic exchange. There i alo
a galler called Zeitgeit, aout ocial iue, in which ou ee
how, in photograph, ou can have dicuion with image,
with taoo, whether it i androgn, m pla on maculinit and
femininit, gender ut alo—omething ver actual and
necear thee da—the culture of outh and perfection and
the exceive ue of retouching. There i alo a darkroom that
will e recreated, o the oung generation who think
photograph i mainl done with cell phone will dicover how
it ued to e done, with camera, film, contact heet,
negative, real darkroom element…
PL: Mueum exhiition are a great wa to give viitor acce
to what i inacceile. To ee an image in a magazine or on
the Internet, everod can do that, ut to ee an actual
photographic print, it i not omething ou encounter often. It’
the ame with Polaroid, contact heet and the other material
that will e exhiited. The garment are onl in one ection of
the exhiition—the are another wa to ee the work
photographed, a 3D element in 2D, and to then dicover the
eaut of them.
FM: peaking of haute couture, how ha it maintained it
principle—if indeed it ha—throughout all all the ear that ou
have een photographing it?
PL: I am not a fahion pecialit, ut what i facinating aout
haute couture i the craftmanhip and the numer of hour
pent to create real work of art… It evolved into omething
ele, more modern, with the arrival of McQueen and Galliano.
FM: You participated in oth m exhiition and ook, Haute-à-
Porter, at the Modemueum of Haelt. M uject conidered
the relationhip etween cutom and read-to-wear clothing.
Where do the two meet?
PL: I do not think haute couture will ever meet prêt-à-porter a
the are two different thing. ome do elaorate work in read-
to-wear, ut now with everthing on the Internet the mut
reinvent a wa not to e copied, o the make it more
complicated to execute, I gue.
FM: Wh do human feel the need to alwa redefine
themelve through garment, make-up, platic urger…?
PL: ecaue the do not accept who the are and what the
ecome, a imple a that. The think the will look etter
uing thee artificial tool and forget that what i important i
who the are, not what the look like.
FM: What i the igget lie in fahion?
PL: You tell me! Otherwie, now the igget lie i called
Photohop.
Originall pulihed in Dapper Dan magazine 14, 2016.
POTD IN IU 14 TAGGD INTRVIW, PHOTOGRAPHY, PRINT
PIRR HARDY TALK TO FILP MOTWARY LUCA GUADAGNINO TALK TO CARLO ANTONLLI