Beruflich Dokumente
Kultur Dokumente
Replies:
3199.1. SPDC's bitter experience and contact Vincent Osifeso 14 Apr 04 04:46
Joe,
SPDC has operated four units of high speed (~750rpm) high pressure (up to 300bar) Dresser
Rand (now called IR?) reciprocating compressors (driven by 3,000 kw Solar Centaur turbines) at
Oguta gas injection plant since 1980s. It was almost a constant migraine for every operations crew
(including myself!). Suggest you contact spdc's George GIFFARD, (PSE-MTC), my ex-boss &
mechanical specialist , who has very vast wealth of experience on these compressors.
3199.4.1.1. High speed recip standard - withdrwan Darrell Wood 17 Jun 04 02:38
David
I missed your comment on the SGN about the recip standard I had quoted. It should have read
API 11P not 11D. Maybe the d and the p on this keyboarp have got mixep ud. However, looking
on the API website it appears that 11P has been withdrawn in the past few years. I don't know
why but I suspect that because there are only a few manufacturers of high speed machines - Ariel,
Superior, Dresser Rand and Gemini are the ones that come to mind - it's not worth maintaining a
standard and each company is starting do its own thing based on their original 11P design. Just a
guess mind.
I still believe we should have some form of DEP guidance on high speed machines. On the last
three projects I have been involved with, one purchased high speed recips (due to significant cost
and schedule benefits), one was offered high speed as an alternative to API 618 and therefore
had to assess the pros and cons of different standards in order to baseline the bids and the
current one will probably end up buying high speed because the 618 boys on the (imposed) bid list
probably won't quote because they know they can't compete on cost and delivery. Fortunately I
can call on previous experience to help me but this doesn't help other people and my peers may
disagree with my approach.
Although there are only a few manufacturers, they make the majority of the recips produced each
year and much of the technology they develop is being adopted by conventional API 618
manufacturers who recognise that it can give them an edge over competitors who stick rigidly to
what can be an unduly conservative base standard. A number of compressor companies quote
hybrids claiming to take the best of each standard.
As we would be a relatively small purchaser of machines which are meant to be standards, the
opportunities to modify would be limited and/or costly. Starting with a knowledge of the (few)
manufacturers is perhaps the best way rather than trying to work with a defunct standard.
However, the manufacturers do provide a range of options and these machines are usually
packaged by licenced companies and the ancillaries and the way they are handled make all the
difference. There are also options to derate machines by going for reduced speeds or increasing
margins on frame power.
Just a brain dump. Do with it what you wish.
Regards
3199.5. Tried to select a high speed recip - but did not Rob Jansen 27 Apr 04 09:16
Joe,
Agree with Darell that the question has come up quite a lot. I posted a query back in 8/2003 on the
same subject - but can't seem to find it anymore.
In the end I did not specify a high speed recip as the power requirement was to large for high
speed recips to handle - I needed ~ 1.8 MW, where the largest high speed recip was in the order
of magnitude of 0.9 - 1.0 MW. Apart from this slight problem, I did receive a couple of warnings on
installation (what to ensure) and on higher maintenance cost/downtime. The latter I could however
not get substaniated, as some of the examples given with high downtime had several problems
that were not directly related to the fact that a high speed was chosen.
My advise would be - check the database for history and try and locate the query that I posted for
starters. No doubt the administrators can help you.
Do post your findings & results at the end of your search as I am very interested in your final way
forward.
Regards,
Rob
The majority of unavailability’s of remote oil-field type applications are due to prime
movers such as gas engines and gas turbines (a horrendous, happily unusual,
application at Oguta described by the colleague from SPDC). There is a general
development in the Group for distributed power, so more and more applications will be
directly-driven by motors at 700 to 1000rpm, and 1500rpm for smaller/ lower-pressure
duties.
I suspect that Joe Nitzsche’s initial query was about higher-pressure machines, ie
200bar plus. In fact this is well within demonstrable proven experience by many short
stroke/ high speed compressor manufacturers, and the 600kW is well within available
frame sizes, that typically go up to around 4MW. I suggest that if approached
manufacturers will be able to demonstrate proven experience and reliability; including
Dresser Rand, Cooper Energy Services, Ariel and Nuovo Pignone (Gemini). The first
three of these manufacturer’s (and possibly NP) use licensed packagers who can
design, construct and test complete compressor packages.
This was originally thought to be a drawback as there was a risk of reduced focus on the
compressor itself. There are older examples of packages that have suffered low
reliability due to the extended scope process and peripheral supporting equipment and
systems, however the manufacturers have inexorably moved towards the use of
licensed packagers, who, over time, have become much more competent in designing
processes and systems around the core compressor. Although the reason for using
packagers was a cost optimisation for the manufacturers, the change in the industry as a
whole has meant that all manufacturers have to ensure the packagers are competent so
as to remain in business over the long-term. We are developing a database of
experienced packagers who are acceptable as prime compressor package suppliers;
using them in no way prevents direct dialogue with the compressor manufacturers or
diminishes the importance placed on the core compressor.
The original specification for ‘high-speed’ compressors was API11P, however that was
intended to cover standardised packaged gas engine driven compressors complete with
interstage scrubbers and coolers. As pointed out by David Saile this seems to have been
withdrawn. In fact the API11P could be used as the basis of any ‘high-speed’
compressor package, with extended scope, and with any driver, by supplementing and
modifying as necessary. The API was intended as the basis for standardised packages
that could be transported between sites, either owned or as part of a rental fleet. There
were a number of aspects not included in API11P that we would want to include in a
compressor package in a permanent, fixed location; for example a pulsation study to
API618 design approach 3.
3199.7. DEP for high speed compressors Wim Hardeveld 14 Jul 04 08:33
There are indeed a number of different views and experiences relating to the application of high
speed recips. We have inventorised over the last year some experiences and limitations of use. I
agree that we should provide guidance on this matter in the DEP for recipson the use of such
equipment in relation to its application.
I will action and dioscuss with Peter Fowler how we can introduce this in EP projects and sollicit
your input in the DEP scripting.
Based on a number of inputs received last year we have formulated following provisional
suggestions in use: