INTERVIEW – DR.

DENNIS ERASGA (sociologist)

DR. DENNIS: Dr. Dennis Erasga, I've been with the Behavioral Science Department for like 20 years. I
am the coordinator of Lasallian core curriculum. These are the replacement courses
which were reassigned to the K-12. I'm also the college research council representative
which means that I am the one who approves and previews all researches done by the
faculty members before they can go to a larger evaluation body which is the University
Research Council, so major researches are being filtered and processed.

I'm a sociologist by profession, and quite specifically, I'm more into the sociology
literature and sociology of the future. So those are my current research interest and also
my reading interest. I'm handling undergraduate and graduate courses – Undergraduate
Science and Technology in all courses and in graduate I'm handling most Sociology
Theory courses.

INTERVIEWER: Number one question, what is interaction and how does it benefit adolescent growth
and development?

DR. DENNIS: Okay, the traditional definition of interaction is like what we're doing right now that is
why Zaide said that sociology will die if the focus of sociology is basic interaction. Most
interaction are no longer face-to-face because most interaction are mediated so
whenever we chat, that is also interaction, but there's something that goes between us
which cellphone probably the keyboard and everything so interaction the more
traditional sense is face to face co-presence. Our presence is virtually interlocked in
space.

The more post-modern definition of interaction is any form of communication

mediated or not, so I call you by the phone my voice is interacting with you but within,
on doing it on a phone.

INTERVIEWER: So how do you promote interaction at a young age?

DR. DENNIS: It depends on what definitions you are subscribing to, right? So, if you want to promote
interaction on the more traditional sense, maybe the traditional activities inside the
house like eating together, watching TV together or telling stories together these are
outlets for promoting interactions but if the more postmodern definition of interaction
anything goes, right, as long as you have data, as long as you’re available, as
long as your teacher allow you to do the call and do texting, right, there are no –

INTERVIEWER: No limitations.

DR. DENNIS: No limitations – that is what I call literally real time as is where is kung type of
interaction and as long as you have a –

INTERVIEWER: Gadget.
DR. DENNIS: Capability to do that like there is a cellphone, and there is Wi-Fi.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. So what is your view on adolescence spending most of their time online
nowadays?

DR. DENNIS: It’s not a problem to me because it’s a generational traits, when I was watching
yesterday, I was just watching the kids play tumbang preso, luksong baka, luksong tinik,
I told myself that these are the activities which we spent most of our time on. However,
those days are over. Gone are those activities and now being replaced by you know,
self- time with a cellphone.

So most sociologists problematized the presence of cellphone and the way it inhibits or
constrains its facilities of interaction but interactional generational trademarks. So with
my generation, it was luksong tinik, right? For their generation, it’s the cellphone. So,
your question is about what again?

INTERVIEWER: What is your view on adolescents spending most of their time online?

DR. DENNIS: It’s a natural way of an adolescent growing up in this digital age. If you don’t have
Facebook, they’re like, “Oh my god, are you for real?” If you don’t have cellphone – like
let’s say your phone is really old, someone will tell you, “Oh my God, buy yourself a new
phone,” right? That is how adolescents are at this day and age.

INTERVIEWER: Do you think it is an urgent problem?

DR. DENNIS: Just like I've told you, I concluded that it is not a problem – it is just a characteristic of a
generation. That is what makes us different compared to other disciplines. Sociologists
do not just think of something as a problem. They will first examine if such thing is a
constraint against interaction. If it is a constraint, what makes it a constraint because
that is where will see how the problem arises. And the next one, which is the most post-
modern of them all – until something is problematized, that thing is not a problem at all.
There should be recognition of that now. Maybe, that is where your idea come in since
it is generally recognized that the presence of cellphone with students affect the way
they interact or how they behave – that is when it becomes a problem. However, as
long as no one says that it is a problem, then it isn’t. And, it’s a generational trait, right?

DR. DENNIS: My take on that is that it is not a problem unless a greater portion of a society believes
that it is a problem.

INTERVIEWER: Okay, so how does technology affect adolescents exposed to it in an early age?

DR. DENNIS: I have a question about your question. Are you referring to technology alone or science?

INTERVIEWER: Technology alone.

DR. DENNIS: Okay, so technology is a thing that we used to survive interaction everyday interaction
so your question is about how?

INTERVIEWER: How does it affect children being exposed to it at early age? Like does it cause too much
“dependency,” on them?

DR. DENNIS: It is not really “dependency.” It’s more of an extension of their generation. With my
generation, at 4 A.M., we were already thinking of playing the game. It is also like that
with other children where you’re already holding to your phone first thing in the
morning – click here, click there. Then, let’s say if you have house rules where by 10pm,
all gadgets must be shut down, it’s not a form of addiction; it’s a form of or –
dependency. It is already a form of a relation.

When we use “dependency,” it means that life cannot go on without it, but with the
way I look at it, it is possible that a child could not or would not use a cellphone for the
entire day. And if let’s say, that goes on for a week, then the idea of dependency is out
of the picture already. So, dependency is your life is not normal without that specific
thing, but if you would look at it for a shorter period of time, adjustments will already
been have made, and then the adjustment is something that we have to look at again so
that we could decide whether or not it is dependency.

Let me give you an example. When I was in Toronto three years ago, there was a general
blackout in the greater Toronto area, and the North Americans were hoarding. Right,
they have huge refrigerators in their pantries? So when the power was out, they were
throwing away all the food inside their refrigerators, and that was like the end of the
world for them. It was a really big problem for them as long as the electricity was out –
that is what we could call dependency.

On the other hand, when you take away the cellphone for a week, it’s only a problem
for the first two days; come day three, the person will have already been calm by then.
For some reason, the person would probably be calm already – maybe the person
borrowed a cellphone from someone else, or maybe even used a desktop – we'll never
know but the dependency is not related. It is not the same as the one with the
Canadians. As long as you prolong it, the dependency also becomes so great and so
permissive – and those two are different, right?

INTERVIEWER: The next in terms of face to face interaction – how is it different now with then?

DR. DENNIS: It’s different simply because there is a simulation. There are simulacra – if you know
Jean Baudrillard –

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.

DR. DENNIS: He was the one who conceptualized the simulacra. He claimed that the original concept
does not disappear with the presence of copies, so even the face seemingly – I would
 put a quotation mark – seemingly face-to-face is simulated. Why do I say so? If you have
a camera which uses the actual two-dimensional presence of your mom while she’s
abroad, you know for a fact that she is your mom, and on the other hand, she knows for
a fact that you’re her daughter. However, you are not real – just simulated.

So there is this form of deception in terms of our perception. It’s like VR, virtual reality,
you see it, but it’s not real. So that’s the element of simulacra, but I don’t want to call it
simulacra to parody Baudrillard. I’d rather call it a sort of phantasmagoria. It’s
something like a ghost because it’s real. A simulacrum is only copy, but this one is like a
ghost because you see everything, right? I do not know if I'm toying with the idea of is it
a simulacra or a phantasmagoria. Meanwhile, phantasmagoria was conceptualized by
Walter Benjamin. He's another – you know – critical thinker during the Holocaust
period.

INTERVIEWER: In terms of interaction with the physical environment, is it different for them?

DR. DENNIS: Yes, because first, the physical environment has already evolved. For example, back
then, our ceilings were made out of wood or cement. Now, our walls can either be
visible and invisible. Also like this cubicle, you think there is no wall, but that is already a
wall. Sometimes, we think that the wall is until there, but there is some space above, yet
why do we call it a wall? Sometimes, we tell the other side, “Don’t be too noisy,”
because the moment that we cannot control the noise, we are in a way saying there is
no boundary.

So with that, our boundary can be visible and invisible again there – something like a
ghost – phantasmagoria. In terms of space, I do not want to refer to space that is
something as you know three-dimensional which you can touch, or feel as real. Right
now, our concept of space is not only invisible, but also detachable – meaning, you can
move it, fold it or, you can literally (you know) annihilate it.

INTERVIEWER: So it is more flexible –

DR. DENNIS: Yeah, physical space is more flexible.

INTERVIEWER: There was also a trend where the vacant spaces are being turned into exhibits so that
people will visit that place.

DR. DENNIS: Yeah, right – they design it in such a way that people will attracted to it.

INTERVIEWER: But the essence of that is lost because there are some who are just there to take
pictures.

DR.DENNIS: Yes, actually there are many issues about our concept on being with the space and being
in a space are two different things. When we say, “going back to nature,” what we
picture is the essence of being with nature. However, now, with the concept of
 cellphone and everything, which sometimes makes people take pictures on high places,
cliffs, and the like. These are dangerous spots it is still considered as space. Even a
crevice is considered a space as well. Yesterday, I was reading an article about this man
who fell from an iceberg because he was taking a selfie from that place. Luckily, he
survived. He got on the ground in one piece, but look at the selfie – my goodness! So
there, that’s what I was saying. Your question is a something about?

INTERVIEWER: The interaction with physical environment.

DR. DENNIS: Yeah, our physical environment is treated no longer as a barrier but also a form of
landscape, when we say “landscape,” you can contour it in the way you want it to
personalize the idea of space. We don’t have a choice regarding space. If it’s there, it’s
there, but now, the idea of space is being personalized or should I call it “sectorized?”
What do I mean by that? For example, if you want to invite gay people, then you will
design the space for LGBT, right?

INTERVIEWER: It’s like everything is personalized already.

DR. DENNIS: Yeah precisely, if you want a more urban or urbane ambiance, go to Coffee Project, go
to Starbucks. It all depends on what you want, and how you want it. So there, you have
plenty of options on where you want to go.

INTERVIEWER: In terms of their behavior offline, how is it different for them? There are studies that
they get bored easily or their attention span is quite low. Apart from that, mental health
issues are quite common among them.

DR. DENNIS: Yeah, stress is actually a part of that. All along we thought that social media platforms
are avenues of extending ourselves, right? For example, I was sent by the university to
Mahidon University in Thailand for three months to visit a professor’s team. My only
coping mechanism in dealing with homesickness was – all the while I thought –
Facebook because I talk to my cat sitter at and the sitter would show my cats, Bobties,
Ms. Min-chin, and Garden. It makes me happy for a while, but once the call ends, I
ended up feeling even more homesick. So in a way, our social media apps which are
supposed to extend ourselves and create more space for us suddenly becomes an
instrument that brings us closer. In the end it gives us what you could call a digital
space.

I call it a digital space because even if there is distance between two parties, the
moment you chat, you guys end up sharing a common space. As I was also saying, our
behaviour changes not only our life span, but that is from a teacher’s perspective. On a
more general audience, the general behaviour really changes because of the way we
live. What were you saying? Offline?

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.
DR. DENNIS: There!

INTERVIEWER: It’s like we get bored easily, so we don’t get to appreciate the physical elements
because we are so used to the virtual world making us happy.

DR. DENNIS: Let’s say your keypad changes. You will immediately react and ask why is the keypad like
this, right? But then again, that is just a simple keypad, and keypad is part of the
physical space. It would be nice for you to study the gravitation of space – how does one
feel the actual change? It’s like Jekyll and Hyde Cane but this is about online and offline
where if you are online, decent behaviour, but when offline, you’re a total monster.

INTERVIEWER: There is one architect that said that we already have two bodies, one which is online
and the other is the offline.

DR. DENNIS: Yeah.

INTERVIEWER: And it gives us a strange feeling because it’s like having two really different
personalities.

DR. DENNIS: It only becomes strange if you can already pinpoint the liminal node, the actual
separation of the two about the cross-person personality. You would actually feel and
experience the changes happening to you. And, have you been watching Black Mirror?

INTERVIEWER: Yes.

DR. DENNIS: Right, there is an episode where your “currency,” is the number of likes. There, that is
one futuristic effect a person’s behavior where everything is fake simply because you
want more people to like you because even when it is about you promotion at work, it
also depends on the number of likes. Have you watched that episode?

INTERVIEWER: Yes.

DR.DENNIS: That's kind of weird right?

INTERVIEWER: But most of their episodes are weird.

DR. DENNIS: Overall.

INTERVIEWER: There is a chance that it could happen as long as there is no overuse –

DR. DENNIS: Black mirror is a mirror that reflects what's currently happening. If you face the black
mirror, then it will show you who you are at this point of your life.

INTERVIEWER: Yes.

DR. DENNIS: Maybe that’s why I don’t fully get it – no I'm only trying to interpret – is it really called a
Black Mirror?
INTERVIEWER: Yes, black mirror.

DR. DENNIS: Black mirror – the reason why it’s called, “black,” is because it’s a future that is kind of
dim?

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.

DR. DENNIS: We have a future, but – my goodness – it’s like band the black. What is the blackest of
the black? Have you heard of that?

INTERVIEWER: No.

DR. DENNIS: Oh, they discovered a very black object.

INTERVIEWER: Ah, yes.

DR. DENNIS: Like, when you look at the black mirror, you'll never know what's on the other side, and
you'll never know what's going to happen.

INTERVIEWER: Overall do you think the being expose early to technology has negative effects on social
skills? Like on how we talk.

DR.DENNIS: It depends. I do not want call it negative because it’s a new generation with a new
lifestyle; therefore, new skills – digital skills.

INTERVIEWER: So it’s a generational characteristic?

DR. DENNIS: Yeah – again, if we are going to extend that kind argument that they are like this, and
they have unique set of skills for this generation. Like for example, the students text
without looking. Oh my God – sometimes they do it while riding the elevators in
Andrew. Sometimes, they’re either calling or texting – just amazing, dude!

INTERVIEWER: How does exposure to the physical environment help adolescents’ development in the
physical environment – meaning it’s still tangible like the usual? How does it help
them in their development?

DR. DENNIS: It depends on the nature of the physical environment. If the physical environment is
amiable, something that gives pleasant feelings, you can expect pleasant behavior. But if
the physical variable is constraining, and it gives negative perspectives, like for example,
a classroom. As a teacher and as I age, I see the classroom as burden and a distraction.
But when I was a still a student, I loved being inside the classroom.

What I'm trying to say is it all depends on a person’s perspective – whether it’s the
classroom, space, or anything, it all depends on perspectives. I’m pretty sure you have
experienced something like that, right?

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.
DR. DENNIS: Another one would be the pedestrian lane, that’s space, but it’s public space.
McDonalds also – that’s a crowded space, but you still want to have coffee. There is a
pleasurable feeling, but the moment you arrive and see this sort of pandemonium on
the queue, it gives you a very unpleasant feeling as well. You will try not to be in a bad
mood, but you end up in a bad mood eventually.

INTERVIEWER: Do you think that public spaces of tomorrow can be places where the two realities
intertwine?

DR.DENNIS: Like that?

INTERVIEWER: Yeah, because right now, the public space –

DR.DENNIS: It is possible.

INTERVIEWER: Won't work on their generation because they are not used to that kind of physical
environment ever since –

DR.DENNIS: You’re correct, but that is already a hypothetical question. It’s a question where the
answer lies in the future, so my answer is hypothetical as well. Again, I'm going back to
the previous question – it depends on what kind of public space we're talking about, and
it depends on the texture of that environment. If the environment there is a hologram,
then it already has barriers at this day. Have you seen Star Trek where if they want a
forest, they can create a forest; if they want a period base like during the era of the
knights, they can get it too. They can recreate by holographic projections, and I think
hologram is the future of the environment. One of the best examples is Spiderman: Far
Away from Home – did you watch that? In there, they can recreate a whole –

INTERVIEWER: New scene.

DR. DENNIS: A whole new scene with projections.

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.

DR.DENNIS: Oh, probably that the future of physical space – although we do not call it physical space
anymore, it can be a digital projective space for lack of better term, right?

INTERVIEWER: There's this one museum in Tokyo where the idea is like that. It’s a combination
between how people go around the space, and at the same time, there are some
projections that could change the person’s movement.

DR.DENNIS: Ah okay, this is ambient, right?

INTERVIEWER: It’s like ambient.

DR. DENNIS: Actually movies – this was when the Japanese first experimented where inside the
cinema, people will usually smell something different if something is burning.
 Eventually, you’ll be called a douchebag or something where you are so anti-social or
not interactive at all.

INTERVIEWER: It can be 4D to 7D

DR.DENNIS: Oh right!

INTERVIEWER: That’s because it’s already so stagnant. Oh, last question – do you think that it is
necessary to provide proper public spaces that allows and attracts digital natives to go
there for their generation?

DR.DENNIS: Again that's a futuristic question.

INTERVIEWER: Yeah, it’s a speculation.

DR.DENNIS: Because what’s happening among digital natives right now are I think not comparable
on of what we can expect in the future given the holographic environment. I cannot
quite answer that because that's very futuristic, but then again, answering it quite safe it
depending on our generic answer. It depends on texture and we cannot classify it as a
type because types would be solid, liquid, and so on, right? There are times where solids
look like liquids, so our basis of attraction of digital natives will be the texture of an
environment on a specific space for whatever interest they would like to pursue
hypothetical.

INTERVIEWER: Would you like to add anything?

DR. DENNIS: None, I think our discussion is kind of exotic.

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.

Dr. DENNIS: I wish you all the best on your endeavour, and at least there is a confirmation about
some works that I want to publish. Our personality changes with our environment the
texture of your space literally changes who you are. You can be outgoing, or you can be
prim and proper depending on the kind of space.

INTERVIEWER: I think the problem with that now is there are no similar textures because we want
everything personalized.

DR.DENNIS: Yes, the way I look at it is this: if you want to see arrangement the word pros and “lies,”
– is the proper word to use it, but when it comes for the type, that will be texture and
people will have no control over it. Most of them will be probably produce something
new or different. This one is produced by an industry and our behavior normally
gravitates on that.

INTERVIEWER: Yeah. The one about architecture – like a treehouse

DR.DENNIS: Yung 3D is an example of that.

INTERVIEWER: I think it only differs on how you connect them altogether, but the unit per se is the
same.

DR.DENNIS: I kind of want to call it, “Lego reality.”

INTERVIEWER: Yeah, it’s like a Lego –

DR. DENNIS: – where you construct reality the way you want to see it or the way you want to move
around it. That's a good topic for a paper, the Lego reality concept. It’s a toy that you
connect together to produce a form or whatever you want.

INTERVIEWER: Thank you, sir.

DR.DENNIS: Okay, no problem. I'm happy you made it.

INTERVIEW – MARY JANE SIOSON (psychologist)

INTERVIEWER: Good morning, so my goal today is to know more about adolescent behavior with
technology influencing it. So it's going to be related to my topic on creating more
spaces, creating more interactive spaces to the digital natives of today.

MARY JANE: I'm Mary Jane Sioson. I work in ChildFam Possibilities as a full-time psychologist, and you
have invited me to answer a particular topic regarding digital – individual being of
adolescence digital natives using uses and gratification theory and principles of
environmental psychology so the first question is?

INTERVIEWER: What are the usual age groups affected by the phone usage?

MARY JANE: According to my research before, it shows that for four straight years, Philippines tops in
worldwide social media used with the record of ten hours and two minutes spent online
daily. Ironically, we only have an average internet speed of 15 mbps, yet we are the top
country spending most time online. On a cultural perspective, Filipinos are highly
sociable, and we are known for strong family ties; that's why social media is a great help
to connect with relatives abroad regardless of the internet connection quality.

In the recent study by We Are Social and Hootsut Facebook garner, the largest number
of global users to is teens aged 13 to 17 years old. In the Philippines alone, the biggest
group of social media users can be also in 18 to 24 years old –basically young adults.

An estimated 21 million users so if we were going to emphasize the adolescent age 13

to 17, usually, it’s typical for students to go online and utilize the use of social media to
discuss homework, announce some news, update, or virtually meet one another. Gone
are the days where they meet outside their homes and experience the hassle of daily
commuting. However, I'm not saying that it has disappeared already, but they rarely
meet outside to do their homework etc.
 For the age range 18 to 24, they usually make use of social media during breaks to get
updated on the latest news since employees tend to have difficulty on watching the
news on television since the hassle of commuting takes a while and once they get home,
the news has already been finished. Your second question is?

INTERVIEWER: What is your view on the adolescents spending most of their time online or on their
phones?

MARY JANE: So personally, my view of how adolescents spend their time using their phones is
basically typical since these particular ages 13 to 17 are considered post-millennial. They
were born with the digital media. They were born with heavy reliance on phone usage.
Some of their parents already give their children their phones to play with. At the very
young age 2 or 3, they do that just so their children will not be bored or not to be too
playful or be too active. So, if they want to get their children to stay in one place, they
just give the phone.

INTERVIEWER: Do you think there's a parental shift?

MARY JANE: Yeah, I definitely agree that there is a parental shift because before, there were no
digital gadgets and all, so they spend more time together, bonding, going and eating in
places, talking with one another in more intimate way. Now, since there is the use of
social media and other apps, basically they rely on virtual communications like video
calls, voice recordings, and messaging. Also, instead of games with physical activities,
they tend to play online.

Some parents allow their children to play on the phone. Some are traditional, and I
don't mean to say that they are not part of the general parenting shift. I just think some
still stick on traditional parenting where they only give a phone once their children are
of legal age, or once they enter college. Some are lenient that as early as a pre-school or
grade school age, they already give the phone, and that's the danger of not being fully
aware of the possible negative effects of digital media used. So, next question?

INTERVIEWER: So my next question is do you think this is an urgent problem for that age?

MARY JANE: I think yes because in our clinic, a lot of our clients that are being referred here were
seeking professional help. Usually, it has something to do with online bullying and other
social – like virtual social media activities – that threatens or harms young children in
particular. Do you remember the “momo challenge?”

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.

MARY JANE: Yeah, we had two clients who were seeking professional help because of the virtual
threats that they get because that. Also, data privacy is a particular concern here like
some are hackers would seize information – personal information to extort, get money,
or steal other significant information that would threaten the users.
 So, it does not only involve the adolescents, but also people in general who use digital
media. Other concerns that needed to be addressed is the high reliance of children on
digital media. Like for example, when they are in another place, they tend to use Google
Maps online. Now, what if there's a network problem and there is no signal? How will
they use their basic skills of asking someone directions to places or asking other people
to know exactly where they are.

So, if they are highly reliant on the gadget they use, they tend to be anxious, fearful, and
scared to go or live without digital media. Another example is some viral content that
contains an invitation to harm themselves, to self-mutilate themselves, or even to
commit suicide, so it is highly dangerous that children are susceptible on being heavily
influenced. So there, a lot of viral videos, and I think it was in the Middle East where
they launch up a program, the blue whale. They will draw a whale and in that particular
game, they have to commit suicide when the game is over – something like that.

Another is when they go on the dark web or deep websites that are not restricted, but
are not well-restricted by the government, so there are some. What else – well, usually
just some really explicit content, pictures and videos which are not really nice for young
children to see. That is one issue that our society, government, and parents should
address a community – restricted phone usage in general.

INTERVIEWER: What makes them use their phone more than anything else? So, what are the common
reasons as to why they use their cellphones a lot at that age?

MARY JANE: That is because the particular age range of 13 to 17, in psychology, it’s a time where
you build friendships, making friends, and things like that, so there is this jargon, FOMO
or “fear of missing out.” With that, they tend to go with what's in and what's trendy so
that they can be invited, or could be attractive as a friend to others. There are instances
where we want to be friends with someone because it’s cool to be friends with a person
like that. It is pretty much like that for adolescents. Phones have become basic needs
already. If they don’t have a phone at that particular age, they will feel alienated or even
feel like outcasts. The worst part is others will ask if your parents love you or not.

INTERVIEWER: So at this age would you say they are looking for that sense of belongingness?

MARY JANE: Yes correct, belongingness that they do not look for from their family unit but
belongingness outside the family, so it will be advisable to give them a little freedom to
feel that sense of belongingness. But then again, I highly emphasize that everything
should be in moderation. For example, the teenager is free to do what he wants but he
or she has to be in bed by 9 P.M. Another is restricting which social media apps may be
used because some apps require the legal age because the platform is an online dating
app or something like that.
 Of course, we do not want to expose them with those apps at a very young age, so
parents should also monitor the apps that their children use. There is this app that I
would highly suggest. It’s a particular family app made by Google, so personally, I use
that to monitor what my nephew does because I got him a phone. The beauty of this
app is you can control his activity like what he downloads, and things like that. Then
when it’s bedtime, you could prohibit him from using it unless it is call or text.

INTERVIEWER: I think there are many apps which can be used to moderate.

MARY JANE: Yeah, so he couldn’t install Facebook because he’s still young. He could not install
YouTube as well, but YouTube Kids is okay. There are many moderating apps so I would
advise parents to be more familiar and well-researched on the pros and cons of using
social media apps as well as the presence of technology or apps that are intended to
moderate the used of phones.

INTERVIEWER: At the age of 13 to 17, do you think they are more obedient to their parents or are they
more inclined to be independent?

MARY JANE: At 13 to 17 years old, the level of cognitive mind is still in the process of maturity, so
technically, they really are not capable enough to be highly independent and decide on
their own. As adolescents, they should realize that they are still under the supervision of
their parents. Their activities should be collaborative at a very young age where they
have established that kind family relationship balance between granting permissions
and having restrictions.

However, there are times adolescents really want to be independent, and sometimes, it
becomes a question of, “do you trust me or not?” For example, there are parents who
are really strict. There is this thing called helicopter parenting where the parents are
always tracking their children’s activities. Of course, adolescents would want their
parents to trust them. Adolescents are capable of thinking and expressing themselves.
Parents, however, should keep their roles to teach their children distinguish wrong from
right.

INTERVIEWER: On the effects of staying offline, what do you think is the most urgent behavioral effect?
I read somewhere that depression or attention deficiency is common. Like the ones who
always multi-task, they easily get bored. There's one research also which claimed that
these people lose empathy and lack social communications. So, for that age group 13 to
17, what is the most urgent issue that needs to be addressed?

MARY JANE: So basically, we are trying to ask the psychological effects of phone usage in general on
adolescents. If we go back and ask, “what is the purpose of phone?” The purpose of the
phone is to connect people; however, because the technology improves continuously,
post-millennials tend to forget the original purpose of a phone. They don't realize that
before, everything was done through letters. They were born in a time where the mode
 of communication has completely changed with the rise of cellphones. They always have
to update and upgrade their phones so they could continue to stay online. If they go
offline, the purpose of their phones is into simply call and text.

A possible psychological effect that they could experience is the anxiety – fear of the
unknown. It’s like the phone should be the one giving you comfort, and without it, it’s
the one causing so much trouble.

INTERVIEWER: Oh, so it’s like they’re not comfortable without the unit?

MARY JANE: And then some get annoyed or some throw tantrums just because there is no Wi-Fi.
Even if it the internet speed is kind of slow, or there is a slight delay, it is really hard for
them because they want everything to be there in an instant. Also, going back to my
previous argument, phones were to connect with others better; however, because of
our reliance with the virtual world, it became hard to establish real connections or face
to face connections. Eventually, they become more likely to suffer from depression
because they do not have real connections that could provide, nurture, support and
understand them.

The level of intimacy of virtual relationships is different from that of actual relationships.
It is hard to establish full intimacy through the virtual way because it’s only about
personal disclosure, and that cannot achieve full intimacy. Intimacy involves non-verbal
cues, tone of voice, non-verbal language, and touch. That’s why the challenge on
technology is being able to improve, change, and transform communication. One of
their greatest innovation is the video call where you guys see each other, but it is
difficult to read the other person’s body language. Touch cannot even be done using
video call especially when we want to express our support or empathy.

INTERVIEWER: The problem with the screen is that it only gives you the audio and the visual but it
leaves out the other senses.

MARY JANE: Yes, that is one of its limitations, and we don’t know if a problem could arise from it? Is
it already a necessity at this point? Could it lead to more problems in the future? Those
are the pros and cons of virtual interaction. Depression and high levels of anxiety are
already possible effects of the absence of a phone or Wi-Fi among adolescents. They do
not know what life would be without using social media.

Also for transportation, there’s Grab. If you want to pay bills, people want to pay online
as well instead of over-the-counter. Even when applying for a job, it’s done via e-mail. It
isn’t much walk-ins anymore. A lot has already changed with the rise of the digital
media. I also agree with you said that a limit of the screen is not being able to fully
experience different things. It’s like comparing it to secondhand items. For example,
people really line up to buy tickets to watch a boxing match. Now, there is this thing
called pay-per-view (PPV) where you could watch the match at home.
 The experience is already “secondhand,” so instead of real-life experience, they
experience it through the prism of digital media. Aside from depression and anxiety,
addiction is also possible. Some kids get addicted to playing games because sometimes,
when something bad happens, they use the games as their coping mechanism.

INTERVIEWER: It’s like they use it as an “escape.”

MARY JANE: Yes, especially those Role Playing Games diba kasi barrowed thing gives parang yung
character na yun pwedeng ini-inbody nila in a way nakakapause sila sa pag face or pag
confront dun sa problem through games ganun.

INTERVIEWER: Would you say their reason for their usage is because they want to escape or entertain
rather than communicate?

MARY JANE: There are many factors. When you ask kids why they play games, they will not
specifically say that it’s an “escape.” Some would even say that they play this game
because it’s what everyone plays, so if they want to have new friends, they play that
game.

INTERVIEWER: Yes.

MARY JANE: For example, Mobile Legends. Number two would be that you could build a network
there, but they are only your virtual friends. They wouldn’t be really considered as
genuine but they’re still counted as your friends, and that’s better than not having one
at all. Games could be for amusement or entertainment. Some studies show that they
can improve hand-eye coordination. Then the third is the idea of “escape.”

Maybe we can look at it as an escape once the child uses that outlet to vent out instead
of facing the actual problem. Eventually, it affects his relationship with his family, his
sleeping patterns, even his own appetite –

INTERVIEWER: Productivity.

MARY JANE: Productivity – like their performance in school is also affected. With that, it can already
be considered an addiction. Eventually, their lives are not exactly “normal,” anymore.
Some parents even act as enablers. When they see their kid playing, they’ll just feed
them their food while they are playing. There has been that one instance of that in the
news, and that is not a good parenting.

INTERVIEWER: So the parental shift is really different?

MARY JANE: Yes, personally, I believe that the behaviour of an adolescent is not only influenced by
technology or their environment. Part of it is also the kind of parenting that their
parents did.
INTERVIEWER: So do you think that the trend of detox is overused (although, it isn’t really a trend)? I
read that adolescents try to practice self-control by cutting the time usage, but they end
up failing.

MARY JANE: As I've said a while ago, they were born with the digital media, so they are not
experiencing what is to live without it. Perhaps their attempt for those studies (that you
read), what they want to achieve will be very difficult since not having a phone is a
completely different and unusual feeling for them.

Fortunately, there is an option among social media apps where you could either
deactivate or uninstall the app. It is really hard because it’s their generation’s thing.
There’s also this idea of peer pressure where if you don’t have social media, you’re a
killjoy or alien because people will ask you, “Tao ka ba?” They are really judgemental
when it’s a personal thing.

Also, sometimes if you don’t social media, you become an inconvenience to your
groupmates in school. For example, in school, they usually say, “I’ll send it to our
messenger group chat.” Then one will say, “Send it to my e-mail. I don’t have
messenger.” That is when one becomes an “inconvenience,” to the group. To avoid that,
people just make one to avoid any hassles.

There are really some people who are like that; they only communicate via e-mail or do
meet-ups. Maybe, those are their inhibitions from totally abstaining from social media.
Also, the content that you see on social media is based on your interests and how you
behave. One thing I noticed among adults is that they are hooked with the content from
the Tulfo show (like the one for commoners).

INTERVIEWER: Yeah.

MARY JANE: Now, when we speak of young adults, common trends would be credit cards, work-
related things, shopping, etc. Meanwhile, kids are into the Korean culture like K-Pop and
K-Drama. The content of your social media depends on which posts you react or
respond to. Messenger is also a trend because it is encrypted. But little do they know
that they are prone to getting their personal info being stolen, fake news, and other
chain messages.

They trust too quickly so they immediately spread what they see even without checking
again if it is legit or not. Here in the Philippines, they use Facebook to search for
something instead of using actual search engines, eventually –

INTERVIEWER: Would you think that it be easier for them to abstain if there is another tool aside from
the phone itself or like the app itself?

MARY JANE: Yes, of course.

INTERVIEWER: If there are tools that would help us control ourselves with our phone usage, will be
easier us to fully control it or even make it easier for us to cope with the physical
environment?

MARY JANE: Yes, one thing I noticed is that people can detox for a while. Look at them while inside
the airplane. The number one rule in an airplane is that they highly discourage using
cellphones inside the airplane because of the possible dangers that it could bring about.
There is also no signal so you really cannot use it. Lastly, it may overheat and it may
expose you to something harmful .

I noticed that as long as there is a particular rule, and it will be for everyone’s benefit
whether psychologically, physically, or something else, they can detox. They can live
without the phone. If there is a particular structure or public space that encourages
them to abstain from using their phones for a bit, I’m pretty sure they would recognize
the importance of engaging in the physical environment instead of just staying on your
phone.

INTERVIEWER: I think the one you were saying earlier – I think I’ve read something related to
behavioural culture. For example, you’re in a library so it is embedded in us that we are
supposed to observe silence but if you are elsewhere, you are free to make noise. In the
example that I just gave, it’s pretty much about us adapting to the environment.

MARY JANE: Yes, you are correct. So, if you are in a particular environment – say inside the church 0
you are expected not to make calls, text, or play games because it is a sacred place of
worship. Those are like some established norms which you should observe. So if you
would introduce this particular space that would give a certain aura, you are like
encouraging them to detoxify or abstain without forcing them to do so.

INTERVIEWER: What do you think will be the problem here because it’s hard to get their full attention,
so what are the cues that make them engage in an area or space?

MARY JANE: Since the post-millennial adolescents have the tendency to easily get bored, then their
attention span is short – did I get your questions right?

INTERVIEWER: Because there are like times where we get engaged if there is a crowd or an activity – is
that idea still applicable or does there really need to be something to attract them?

MARY JANE: I believe in that social psychology. We have this term called, “conformity,” so regardless
of their traits whether they are those post-millennials who get bored easily, I still believe
in the idea of conformity. Conformity pretty much means that whatever is trending –

INTERVIEWER: – they’ll go there

MARY JANE: Like you have innate tendencies and anthropological behaviour to be curious on what’s
going on there. You could actually target what is innate among humans regardless of
 their age, and other traits. From there, you could draw out an audience or a crowd.
Once that happens, you have a group of people focused and engaging on that certain
activity.

INTERVIEWER: So more on being curious.

MARY JANE: Yes, just like that.

INTERVIEWER: Actually, I tried looking up if there is a theory about that, then reasons as to how
something makes someone curious. I saw that it is because they want to learn or they
are seeking something.

MARY JANE: Oh, yes! As long as something innovative or new comes out, and their curiosity is
stimulated, that is a tool, a way or – if it becomes viral, it can become a tool. There really
are pros and cons. Disseminating new information has always been possible because of
social media especially when it becomes a trend.

There – what else? So that’s the only problem, and there’s the answer to your question.
It’s pretty much just about the idea of conformity.

INTERVIEWER: Last question, do you think that adolescents aged 13 to 17 prefer that they are alone, be
with friends, or be with family? Like in terms of the personal correction, whom do they
seek counsel from?

MARY JANE: It depends. What I can say is that it’s different for every individual. It’s hard for me to
generalize it. Each of us has different desires so some would go to their friends, some
would go to their family, or maybe both.

INTERVIEWER: Oh okay, on personality type.

MARY JANE: Yes, personality type is different from each individual. I would highly emphasize again
the upbringing of the family because based on psychology, personality disorders
emerges on how they interact with the environment which could be their family, or the
society they grew up in. For example, if the environment of the child growing up was an
area where crime and drugs are common, there is a probability that that child may be
involved in an issue related to crime and drugs. The same goes for his family, if it is
harmful or threatening, they could eventually develop other psychological or mental
disorders.

So there – but the trend I am currently seeing is that the usage of the phone is really for
accessibility of communication especially if your family is far away. For example, one of
your parents is abroad, you really have no choice but to use a phone because that is the
only way to reach your parent easily. It is also helpful because it fills the gap between
you and your parent. In that way, your family bond stays strong and established because
despite the distance, there is still communication.
INTERVIEWER: Yes

MARY JANE: So for you to establish the right communication, you guys should talk face-to-face as
much as possible. Yes, there is a proper time for using the gadgets, but for family
bonding, avoid using gadgets as much as possible even for just – say – two hours.
Sometimes, because of work, some receive e-mails then they end up working even if
they’re at home to the point that sometimes they tend to forget that they are at home
and not in the office – something like that.

Those are the problems that need to be addressed by technology. There are many
benefits, yes, but there are also a lot of cons which need to be addressed as well. So,
one question you would ask is what type of connections does this adolescent have? It
varies from person to person.

INTERVIEWER: But, would you say that at that age, are they looking for a sense of belongingness or
something?

MARY JANE: Yes, I do believe in it because according to psychology, that is the age where they
friends and belongingness outside the family. They may already feel that they belong in
their family, but belongingness among friends is different.

INTERVIEWER: So they’re always looking for connections, or network?

MARY JANE: Yes, something like that, but by age 20, they are more focused on looking for intimacy
from one person. Age 13 to 17 is about seeking intimacy among friends. Age 18 to 25 is
seeking for intimacy from one person because that is the time where they usually
prepare for marriage.

INTERVIEWER: Thank you.

MARY JANE: Thank you as well.