chronicle.com/article/Live-Chat-Supersizingthe/131773/?sid=wc&utm_source=wc&utm_medium=en http://chronicle.com/article/Live-Chat-Supersizingthe/131773/?sid=wc&utm_source=wc&utm_medium=en Tuesday May 8, 2012 11:20 Hi everyone, this is Marc Parry.

I'm a reporter here at The Chronicle, and I'll be moderating today's chat with John Boyer. We'll get started at noon. I look forward to your questions. 12:00 Hi, everyone, and welcome to The Chronicles live chat with John Boyer, senior instructor at Virginia Tech. Last week, The Chronicle published a story describing how John teaches 2,760 students in a face-to-face geography class. The story touched off a feisty debate among readers. Johns students poured on the love, praising his charisma and innovative use of social media. But skeptics questioned his methods and accused John of providing entertainment, not education. Which is it? Ask John a question and decide for yourself. Lets get started! 12:01 Hello everyone! Thanks for joining a lunch-time convo, and I will do my best to answer anything about everything that interests you. 12:02 Comment From J. Smethers - Would you say there is a difference between entertainment and education? Can't education be entertaining and entertainment be educational? 12:03 Yes, I would contend that there is a difference between the two, and for me it is all about the dialectic...you have to have some back and forth between the instructor and the student for true education. 12:03 Comment From Mike - In a class as large as yours, how do you assess student learning? 12:04 But yes to the overall statement: I think a good lecture can be entertaining, and I think a National Geographic TV show on polar bears can be educational. ANd lots of stuff is somewhere in between. 12:06 ANd this is for Mike's query: for the huge class, and my smaller ones, we have a variety of traditional quiz/test/written options, combined with our new experimental social networking/online activities. You can see a brief run-down of those here: http://www.thejohnboyer.com/new-education/ 12:06 And my entire syllabus can be downloaded as a pdf from that page link as well. Please have at it! 12:07 Comment From Amy - How do you keep 2,760 students engaged as active participants in your classroom? I understand the tactics you use, but can you explain the philosophy that brought you there? 12:09 I don't know that I have a named 'philosophy' to how I conduct the live class, but I try to get students to build their own knowledge and active engagement by utilizing current events and live news feeds into the class, and by also trying to build environments that allow for live interaction

on the spot, like instant polling and twitter feeds during the lecture that are monitored by my assistant 12:10 Comment From Doug Cremer - What has been the most challenging aspect of teaching such a large class? Any surprises?

12:11 We truly are in an experimental phase with most of these things, as the technologies are changing so fast and furious, and we ar constantly testing new products to see what may work better and get the students engaged more. Of course we also have microphones and live questions asked in the traditional sense throughout the lecture, and believe it or not, we have a tremendous amount of interaction through those means too 12:12 TO Doug Cremer: Most challenging aspects so far has been getting all the students on the same page for our new 'flipped syllabus' approach. 12:12 John: Could you explain what you mean by that "flipped syllabus" remark? 12:13 This model allows man, many more options to build points towards your final grade, allowing the student to choose paths and pursuits that best engage the way they learn best...BUT it is so flexible and non-deadline driven that it is easy for not-so-serious students to get left behind until it is too late 12:14 Comment From Zac - With you being so "connected" all the time with your students in the social networking arena, how do you manage to have just "John" time? How have other faculty on your campus reacted to your style of delivery? 12:14 And I explain the 'flipped syllabus' in greater detail at http://www.thejohnboyer.com/neweducation/ about halfway down the page. 12:15 Zac, believe it or not, you would be shocked about how many students DO NOT connect or contact me 12:16 But they like the "illusion" that you're always connected, right? 12:16 I believe it is more about the PERCEPTION that students can connect and chat with me if they were to choose to do it...most do not, but still rate the class highly in terms of 'individual attention' they perceive they are receiving 12:15 Zac, believe it or not, you would be shocked about how many students DO NOT connect or contact me 12:16 But they like the "illusion" that you're always connected, right? 12:16 I believe it is more about the PERCEPTION that students can connect and chat with me if they were to choose to do it...most do not, but still rate the class highly in terms of 'individual attention' they perceive they are receiving

12:16 I think Zac's second question about faculty reaction is good. John, I know you've received some pushback from professors about your work. Can you talk about that? 12:17 The on-line office hour every week actually is a huge and concentrated way to talk to lots of students personally about lots of things, in just an hour or tow outside of class time 12:17 Sure thing... 12:18 I think a lot of professor may feel threatened by our experimentation with large classes, seeing it as a "forced future" that they will all be slaves to in near term.... 12:19 I have always been quick to say that I am only pushing the envelope in my particular field, with this particular content, using these new particular tools....

12:19 In no way shape or form would I ever be a fan of having all classes go to this large class format. How terrible that would be for the entire college experience if that were to ever happen! 12:20 Comment From Katie - I'm intrigued by your "flipped syllabus" grading method, where you let students earn their grade by choosing which assignments to take. Do your students still seem to learn most of the course content-based objectives, or do they "skip out" on sections that don't interest them, thereby missing that content? I teach intro bio classes that have specific contentbased objectives and wonder about the feasibility of your approach. 12:20 I mostly like to think of our experimental approach being best utilized by others in pieces, or certain technologies that they could use for their subject matter, in classes of any size. 12:21 But your style of doing assessment seems like a big part of this. Do you think that is transferrable? 12:22 Great question Katie! WHile still in experimental form, I do work hard to adjust the points scale to make the most important content worth mor points....

12:23 And I also try really hard to have virtually all the assignments overlap each other with content, so the students are getting multiple exposures to the material, via different modes and medians. 12:23 Comment From Cherisse Gardner - Have you given any thought to opening your course(s) to the world outside of Va Tech follwing the likes of Standford, MIT, etc.? 12:24 And yes, I totally think the points based system is transferrable, as I know lots of peoples from lots of fields that are already using it. I am quite positive I did not come up with the concept myself. 12:25 John, sorry don't think I was very clear ...

12:25 I meant more whether you think it is transferrable to let students earn points by picking their own assignments, which raises that issue of missing some key content. 12:25 Cherisse, I actually think it is a bit too early to be investing our courses into specific platforms (especially the commercial ones) as I consider this higher ed on-line stuff in a 'Wild West' stage.... 12:26 Who knows which ones will survive the next 5 years? I think none of us know, but it is definitely a terribly exciting time to be watching the rapid evolution occur. Remember the Alamo! 12:26 Comment From T. Drake - You mentioned not being a fan of all classes using this large class format. What disciplines/classes would this type of format work well for? (Besides yours of course...) 12:27 Back to Mark's comment on flipped syllabus... 12:29 Like I said, the way I weight the options in the syllabus makes it almost a necessity to do the core content assignments...if they don't do those one or two big assignments, then they actually have to work 5 times harder to do other work, so we kind of are stacking the deck a little bit to guide their choices in ways that I think give them the best slice of knowledge from the course 12:30 Thanks, that makes sense. And T. Drake's question on what disciplines this might also work for? 12:31 T. Drake: Instinctually, I would lean towards humanities, but really aren't most 'intro' courses for all major at big universities already in large classroom settings? We have intro engineering, chemistry, biology, business, music appreciation, all of which are 500+ classrooms...

12:32 So for me, maybe the stuff we are experimenting with are best utilized in classes that are already of this size, just not as interconnected with students as ours is 12:32 Comment From Lynn - I'm still trying to wrap my head around having students view the lecture before coming to class. How do you get them to take the time before class? Sometimes it is hard enough just to get the students to read an assignment before class. 12:33 Lynn, I am not to the point of the 'flipped classroom' model myself. I do have some of my lectures on-line, but not the whole course. Yet. I still mostly do the traditional lecture format in the live class.... 12:34 ...and I only started putting lecture material on-line in an effort to put more in-depth content up there for students to review, but also because I never get to all the course content during lectures, so it is a resource that students can access (forever) to see new material we may not have covered at all in class 12:34 Comment From misty - i love the ideas here - and to some degree i think these issues are happening with or without us, classes are getting bigger and such - i am curious how risky it is to start using these - especially while pursuing tenure. another way - what were the biggest pitfalls?

12:35 You can check out some of my attempts at the video lectures at http://www.plaidavenger.com/worldregions/ and we may eventually develop them all into a stand alone iTunes University course, which we have been approached about already. 12:37 Misty, I should state up front that I am untenured, non-tenure track personel, so I have always lived under the threat of the executioners axe... 12:38 I never really considered experimenting with the best ways to connect with students as a 'risk'....I actually have always considered it a part of my job. Am I alone on this one? 12:38 Comment From vowe8205 What is your Withdraw/Fail rate? What student characteristic(s) would you consider a mismatch for this type of class? 12:39 Vowe8205, I have to be totally honest with a 'not sure' response. Generally, I would say 5%-8% drop and fail rate 12:39 Comment From Amanda - About how many hours per week do you spend on this single class (preparing lectures, creating podcasts, etc.)?

12:39 Comment From Amanda - About how many hours per week do you spend on this single class (preparing lectures, creating podcasts, etc.)? 12:41 Amanda: how many hours are in a week...? 12:41 Comment From Sarah Cheverton - What are you trying to achieve by offering this to such a large group? Is the only purpose to show that we can reach more students with fewer instructors? Are there other goals? 12:42 lol just kidding. To put it in perspective, I only teach that huge class in Fall, and teach nothing else that semester. I teach 2 classes of 575 each in the SPring. ANd I do not have any research responsibilities, so teaching is my full time job, and that is how I treat it. 12:43 I know to many of you in higher ed have that luxury, and I do consider myself lucky to not have to be expected to be a genius teacher, a genius researcher, and a genius writer all at the same time. And be underpaid for it as well. 12:44 TO Sarah Cheverton: AS referenced in the article, this experimental class was initially offered simply to fulfill latent demand, as there was a back-log of class request closing in on 3000 students... 12:46 Comment From misty - lol... i knew we were hindered spirits. 12:46 ...but now that is is successful and the demand keeps getting bigger, I see the role of the class first and foremost to inspire students, get them engaged in their learning environment,

deliver the global content that I believe is critical for them to be introduced to....and be able to experiment with these new tools and technologies so that others can learn from us. 12:46 Comment From Kristen - What is a typical grade in your class? Do most settle for attempting/earning a B? Is a "B" a challenging grade to receive (difficult quizzes/exams), even with a lot of options to choose from? Do most end up with an A...? 12:46 I heart you too Misty. 12:48 Kristen, the bell curve applies, but it is definitely skewed toward the A/B side if te spectrum. THe vast majority of students do achieve A/B, but there are those that struggle or disconnect entirely, no matter what we do. But I assume that is true in virtually all 1000 level classes. 12:49 Comment From Laurence Lachapelle - What steps would you recommend to a teacher who would like to embrace your model? 12:51 Laurence, I would definitely contact some instructional designers and teaching/learning pedagogy peeps as well to get some help structuring the course per your content, right up front.... 12:52 but I would also warn to take all their great advice with a grain of salt, and also follow your instincts... 12:53 ...talk to your students, and ask what/how they would like to experiment with, and what types of delivery they like best. Input from the peeps we are trying to communicate with means much more to me than any sterile statistical study performed ten years ago...long before any of these systems were even in play 12:53 Comment From Quisp Kid - Have you thought of moving to the Coliseum? 12:54 lol Quisp Kid, I will lecture in the Coliseum, as long as I don't get thrown to the lions after a poor lecture performance. 12:54 This is Marc again. We'll take a couple more questions, and then wrap things up. 12:54 Comment From Aleta - I really admire you and what you are doing. I also appreciate the additional information you provided. Im curious as to how all of those assignments are graded. 12:56 Sorry I had a window crash momentarily 12:56 Grading is conducted many ways: 1)some are automated on-line quizzes and exams.... 12:57 2)some are in class scantron graded... 12:57 3)written assignments are graded by 2 TA's... 12:58 4)Me and my technical assistant Katie grade the more elaborate Delicious, Twitter, and social networking assignments

12:58 This is Marc again. We have time for one more question. But the transcript of this chat will be available to replay once we wrap up. And you can send additional questions to John at joboyer@vt.edu 12:58 Comment From Guest - Apple was successful because Steve Jobs inspired his people that they would change the world. Do you have a belief like that? 12:59 But I am definitely going to start experimenting with more 5) peer to peer grading. Much of our content can easily be tailored to have trained honor students and education majors help us out with them. ANd I think it would be valuable experience for future teachers who are really into getting real world experience 1:00 ABSOLUTELY!!!! And no, my caps lock was not on. 1:01 I am absolutely passionate about inspiring students to be fired up, passionate, engaged, and knowledgeable about the wider world.... 1:02 I believe it is a moral and ethical imperative that we do our best to educate/train/build our students into global thinkers that are best prepared not just to know about the wider world out there, but to be able to engage it in, travel in it, help solve problems in it, and hold their governments accountable on what happens in it. 1:02 Marc here again. We're about out of time. Thanks for joining us, John. And to everyone who sent in questions: Thanks for participating!